Fake tag

[soupcan]

R1 on first, F1 steps off the pitcher's plate and fakes a throw to first. F3 fakes a tag on R1 returning to first?

How would you rule it? OBS? What award?

[zoops]

8.3.2 SITUATION B:

While (a) B1 is moving toward second base on a hit to right-center field, F6, who does not have the ball in his possession, fakes a tag on B1 or (b) B1 is returning to first base and F3, who does not have the ball, fakes a tag on B1.

RULING: In both cases it is ruled obstruction, and B1 is awarded second base or if, in the umpire's judgment, the runner could have advanced farther had obstruction not occurred, the umpire could award additional bases.

[johnnyg08]

Nice job @zoops

[soupcan]

Thanks zoops,

It is as if you were waiting for the question to be posted.

 

[Majordave]

Happens more often than it should. Coaches still don't properly instruct players and many umpires don't call it. 

Plus, it's only a FED rule.  I don't think any youth organizations playing OBR even have this fake tag rule. 

[basejester]

Happens more often than it should. Coaches still don't properly instruct players and many umpires don't call it. 

Plus, it's only a FED rule.  I don't think any youth organizations playing OBR even have this fake tag rule. 

​Little League rule 2.0

. . .

OBSTRUCTION . . . A fake tag is considered obstruction.

 

[Majordave]

Thanks. I don't work LL or any youth ball for that matter (voluntarily that is). 

[ElkOil]

The local chapter of the MABL league we ump also has a no fake tag rule.  Interestingly, no penalties are prescribed.  It just says they're not allowed.

[MooseLoop]

Fake tags in OBR are Type B obstruction (no play being made on the obstructed runner) and the runner usually is only protected to the base they are on anyway.  No automatic one base award for OBR type B obstruction like in FED.

[maven]

Fake tags in OBR are Type B obstruction (no play being made on the obstructed runner) and the runner usually is only protected to the base they are on anyway. 

​Huh? Reference?

[Mad Mike]

MooseLoop, are you confusing the FED Rule and OBR Type B and placing them together? I don't think your assertion is supported by the rules and interpretations out there.

According to the BRD 372, there is no provision in OBR rules for Obstruction to be called on the basis of a fake tag. If you read further about Type B Obstruction, the Official Interpretations offered up denote that Type B Obstruction does not carry an automatic minimum base award. The umpire may use his judgment. The umpire will award any bases that will "nullify the act of obstruction." 

NCAA also has no provision. In the BRD, Carl adds a note that I found interesting--Note 351 from Jim Paronto, "Fake tags are legal, but defensive players would be highly encouraged not to employ this tactic. Faking a tag and thereby getting a runner to slide needlessly often leads to more serious actions later in the game." 

[MooseLoop]

Sorry, I thought I knew that fake tags were expressly prohibited in OBR.  I'm sure I've even called it, but without a base award.  That will stop until I find the rule cite that BRD could not, which I suspect will be awhile. Never mind!

[Thunderheads]

Guys, ....interesting here, and ....since the OP is answered .........

Is there a rule on a 'deke'?  NOT a fake tag?  My partner called a fake-tag on a kid on Saturday, and I was watching runners touch 3rd, and never saw it ....but the coach was calling it a 'deke', ...F6 pretended that he was receiving a throw.

Can this be correlated with a fake tag?  I don't see anything to support this "pretending to receive a throw" as OBS ...

??

[maven]

Interpret 'tag' narrowly: glove applied to runner. Faking other things is legal.

[maineump]

Interpret 'tag' narrowly: glove applied to runner. Faking other things is legal.

​The fake ball to the fence trick is legal, if the runner and base coach miss it, then the guy deserves to be tagged out when he runs. I've seen this work, the 1B lunges away from the runner or jumps, then acts like he is chasing the ball. This is usually a designed play and the other player are in on it too.

[maven]

​The fake ball to the fence trick is legal, if the runner and base coach miss it, then the guy deserves to be tagged out when he runs. I've seen this work, the 1B lunges away from the runner or jumps, then acts like he is chasing the ball. This is usually a designed play and the other player are in on it too.

​Well, if they use a real ball against the fence, that trick is illegal in FED.

8.3.2 SITUATION J: F1 feints a throw to first base. Someone in the defensive team's dugout throws a ball against the fence alongside first base, making R1 think an overthrow took place.

RULING: The umpire shall call obstruction and award R1 second base. He shall also eject the offender from the game and issue a warning to the coach. (2-22-1, 8-3-2, 3-3-1g(4))

 

(Aside: because this play requires the coordinated effort of at least 2 people, I've wondered whom they envision as the "offender" here.)

[kstrunk]

I've seen it at 2nd, no one in the duggout involved, with feint allowed to 2nd, no violation. It worked well. 

[noumpere]

​Well, if they use a real ball against the fence, that trick is illegal in FED.

 

​I think maineump meant the "Miami play" -- but your cite is well taken.

[maven]

​I think maineump meant the "Miami play" -- but your cite is well taken.

​You might be right (that's what kstrunk is talking about), but maineump refers to 1B, not 2B, where the "Miami play" is run. That's why I posted the play I did.

FED has either a case play or interp that explicitly states that the "Miami play" is legal.