Unreported vs Illegal and aftermath

[VolUmp]

Fake names.  Fed Tournament Game.

Blues are down 5-1 with two outs in top of last inning.

Reds pitch to batter (#7) and walk him.

DC calls time, appeals to the PU that #7 did not report in.

PU looked at his lineup card and sees #7 in the subs list, but #22 was due to bat.

PU calls #7 out and ... "Ball Game!"

 

OC calls across field to PU and to #7 asking if he checked in.  Both say no.

U1 never offered his two cents or got involved.

 

I got a call from PU after the game to confirm he handled it correctly.

I confirmed instead that he kicked it ... that as long as #7 was eligible to sub, he was simply unreported (with no penalty).

 

PU sent an email of apology and clarification to both coaches and his partner (also called his partner) to explain he kicked it.

Is this the proper way to handle the aftermath, or should PU have self-reported the blunder to his assignor and left it at that?

This was a clear case where neither official and neither head coach knew the rule.

[alex7]

Due to PU's email, the coaches and partner get a chance to learn the rule.  That's always a good thing, so I'll rule in favor of what he did.  HS would be the highest level where I'd do that, as you still have lots of coaches who are just parents or do coaching to help out more than it being their main job.

[Jimurray]

Fake names.  Fed Tournament Game.

Blues are down 5-1 with two outs in top of last inning.

Reds pitch to batter (#7) and walk him.

DC calls time, appeals to the PU that #7 did not report in.

PU looked at his lineup card and sees #7 in the subs list, but #22 was due to bat.

PU calls #7 out and ... "Ball Game!"

 

OC calls across field to PU and to #7 asking if he checked in.  Both say no.

U1 never offered his two cents or got involved.

 

I got a call from PU after the game to confirm he handled it correctly.

I confirmed instead that he kicked it ... that as long as #7 was eligible to sub, he was simply unreported (with no penalty).

 

PU sent an email of apology and clarification to both coaches and his partner (also called his partner) to explain he kicked it.

Is this the proper way to handle the aftermath, or should PU have self-reported the blunder to his assignor and left it at that?

This was a clear case where neither official and neither head coach knew the rule.

Who are you in this rules screw up (baseball only buy the way)? It sounds like the PU kicked a rule and pursued the correct result and and owned up to it. it's a shame his partner didnt know anything. He should tell his assignor that he kicked a rule and to make his chapter knowledgable since his partner didn't know SH*#.

[VolUmp]

 

Who are you in this rules screw up (baseball only by the way)? It sounds like the PU kicked a rule and pursued the correct result and and owned up to it. it's a shame his partner didn't know anything. He should tell his assignor that he kicked a rule and to make his chapter knowledgable since his partner didn't know SH*#.

 

I'm just another trusted official in the same association.

[Jimurray]

Who are you in this rules screw up (baseball only by the way)? It sounds like the PU kicked a rule and pursued the correct result and and owned up to it. it's a shame his partner didn't know anything. He should tell his assignor that he kicked a rule and to make his chapter knowledgable since his partner didn't know SH*#.

I'm just another trusted official in the same association. Well then you should tell your chapter that so and so called you and you told him he kicked it and he said he would let the coach know and you said since I'm a trusted official I will let the chapter know and we will make sure everyone, including the partner knows the correct ruling.

[Replacematt]

Due to PU's email, the coaches and partner get a chance to learn the rule.  That's always a good thing, so I'll rule in favor of what he did.  HS would be the highest level where I'd do that, as you still have lots of coaches who are just parents or do coaching to help out more than it being their main job.

I'd do it with both, depending on the situation, but I would feel more comfortable doing this with a college coach than a high school coach.

[JaxRolo]

Why let a coach know? This could potentially be something held against you next time.

[noumpere]

*Someone* should let the coaches know -- so they don't argue the wrong rule the next time.

 

I have no problem with it being the umpire himself (or herself), and long as the assigner / TD / association president (whoever) is aware of it ahead of time.

[law_reb]

This is often a problem for officials that do know the rules.  The next time either of these coaches see a substitute at bat that has not reported they will be asking for an out.  I can already hear the coach saying, "but the umpire in our last game called that an out!"  Now they know either you or the other umpire were incorrect.  My experience is they are going to assume you are wrong for the remainder of the game and you don't know anything.  Especially if the call went against them both times.

[VolUmp]

My thought was that the PU should have self-reported it to the assignor and insisted that he communicate with both coaches.

 

JaxRolo, are you serious?  Just try to hide from this?  There is no question (IMHO) that it needs to be communicated to the coaches, I'm just not certain whether it should have come from the umpire or the Association.

This is setting both coaches up for a repeat and a stain on the Association if nothing is cleared up.

It's not protestable now, so by all means it should be cleared up immediately.

 

And in the extremely unlikely event that either coach went home and looked it up, by all means I would want to beat him to the punch.

[grayhawk]

I think it showed a lot of integrity by the umpire to admit to his mistake and inform the coaches.  I would prefer to handle it through the assignor, if he wants to get involved.  I'm sure there are many assignors that would tell the umpire to contact the coaches directly.  Next time that umpire has one or both of those teams, I guarantee that those coaches will respect him for owning up to his rule misapplication.

[VolUmp]

I think it showed a lot of integrity by the umpire to admit to his mistake and inform the coaches.  I would prefer to handle it through the assignor, if he wants to get involved.  I'm sure there are many assignors that would tell the umpire to contact the coaches directly.  Next time that umpire has one or both of those teams, I guarantee that those coaches will respect him for owning up to his rule misapplication.

 

Agreed.  He received a very nice reply from the coach who got the (incorrect) benefit of the call, and has already called another game for the "offended" coach ... who admitted he didn't know the rule either and has moved on.  This official told me the reason he emailed the coaches directly is he didn't trust that the Association would do so in a timely fashion.  Probably right.

[blue23ll]

Out here we don't have coaches emails available to us and they don't have ours. All communication is handled through our association and assignor. I would definitely have a conversation with the coach though, next time I saw him and explain that I kicked the call.

[VolUmp]

Out here we don't have coaches emails available to us and they don't have ours. All communication is handled through our association and assignor. I would definitely have a conversation with the coach though, next time I saw him and explain that I kicked the call.

 

That's interesting, Blue23ll.  I would much prefer that.

I think over time, our Association realized that there are too many screw ups in communication over coaches not knowing who is coming to officiate (and when), and who the school pays (and how much).  There are so many last minute changes that I don't see how the Association could effectively handle all that for us.  When JV games get added to the schedule and then later get bumped and a varsity game moved into the JV slot for weather, etc, it often comes down to 90 minutes prior before anyone really knows the final call.

 

My typical routine is to email the school bookkeeper and the coach (in the same email) about 3 days out what the current plan is for a game on said date.

If changes happen, I'll send another email.

If no changes happen, I'll send an email with a friendly reminder that we'll be there at the agreed time and no changes have taken place.

 

Many schools have declared that they will no longer pay on game day, but if we give them notice, they will often write the checks that morning and just expect our signatures on the school invoice at the game.