Little League Forfeit Rules

[ump570]

Hi,

I'm in the unusual position of posting a question today as a coach. I don't umpire Little League, so I'm not aware of all of their rules and the nuances that may or may not exist within the rulebook. Here is the situation, Little League Minors- I am Asst. Coach, at game time our team only has 8 players available. I know the rule book says that 9 are required to start game. However, I have heard of certain leagues making a provision in their rules to allow for fewer. Anyway, the opposing team's coach comes over and asks me for the lineup, I tell him we only have 8, and then I ask the umpire if we can play with 8. The coach objects and says we need 9.  I say, "How about we play the game with 8 so that the kids can play some baseball. This is minor leagues; if you want the win, you can have it." Anyway, the umpire makes a phone call to somebody, comes back and says, "You can play." So we get to the 5th inning our team is leading 4-0 and one of our batters takes a pitch right in the mouth. Anyway, he's done for the day. The half inning ends and we go out to the field with 7 players. At this point, the umpire stops the game and calls it a forfeit.

 

3 questions:

 

1. If there is a forfeit, do the statistics stand as far as pitch counts, batting stats, etc. or are they washed as though the game never happened?

 

2. Does the umpire have to submit a forfeit request in writing to the board of directors?

 

3. Is it possible that we could pick up this game where it left off when the player was injured?

[mstaylor]

The coach was correct, you can't play with 8. If you know ahead of time it is possible to get a pool player. In essance you had a practice. The pitch counts may not be official but you should take them into account for your rotation.

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[plateumpire]

In the Little League I am in they can start with eight but they have to end with nine. 

[ump570]

The coach was correct, you can't play with 8. If you know ahead of time it is possible to get a pool player. In essance you had a practice. The pitch counts may not be official but you should take them into account for your rotation.

Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

That's what I figured. What bums me out is that my son pitched the best game he threw all year. 4 shutout innings against a really good team. Oh well, what can you do? Thanks.

[mjr_2013]

 

The coach was correct, you can't play with 8. If you know ahead of time it is possible to get a pool player. In essance you had a practice. The pitch counts may not be official but you should take them into account for your rotation.

Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

That's what I figured. What bums me out is that my son pitched the best game he threw all year. 4 shutout innings against a really good team. Oh well, what can you do? Thanks.

 

 

How do the stats matter at that level? No one would stop you from counting them independently... And isn't it coaches choice of who makes the tournament team/travel team? Even considering it a practice, practice matters to coaches.

 

Just curious

[Jimurray]

The coach was correct, you can't play with 8. If you know ahead of time it is possible to get a pool player. In essance you had a practice. The pitch counts may not be official but you should take them into account for your rotation.

Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

That's what I figured. What bums me out is that my son pitched the best game he threw all year. 4 shutout innings against a really good team. Oh well, what can you do? Thanks.

It says something that your team was down to 8 players at the end of the season.

[mstaylor]

It simply says parents aren't committed to a program. Remember these kids can't drive.

[semper_fi_72]

There are no Forfeits in Little League.

It is up to the Board of Directors how to handle the game.

Replay, Restart etc.

[MadMax]

I say, "How about we play the game with 8 so that the kids can play some baseball. This is minor leagues; if you want the win, you can have it." Anyway, the umpire makes a phone call to somebody, comes back and says, "You can play." So we get to the 5th inning our team is leading 4-0 and one of our batters takes a pitch right in the mouth. Anyway, he's done for the day. The half inning ends and we go out to the field with 7 players. At this point, the umpire stops the game and calls it a forfeit.

In my opinion, you said something dangerous – "if you want the win, you can have it." In essence, you've conceded the game's outcome to the other team, which is, more or less a forfeit. I'll bet, if asked, the other HC proceeded with the confidence that his team was already being ascribed a Win, and that the following "game" was more or less a scrimmage or practice. Whether or not the game itself is rescheduled, or if it is handled as a forfeit, is up to your LBOD, but I can almost guarantee that play is not suspended and reconvened later on, at the bottom of the 5th and the score 4-0. That "game" never happened, and that would surely be the perspective of the opposing HC.

The Umpire probably called the game considering he didn't want to see any more players get hurt (or wore out) on account of it not really being a valid game anyway, since the outcome had already been determined (by your above statement). He probably used the only vernacular he could think of to explain it – "forfeit".

[Dannytheman]

Minor leagues I try to handle more sensitively.  Was this a regular season game? Was it a round robin that would impact playoff position?

The LL rules say you must have 9. What I have done in similar situations is to see if the other team has 10, and they have to give one up.

If the coach can not get a call up this sometimes allows the game to start and play. Like a call up the kid "borrowed" must only play in outfield.

 

Now last year, in a playoff game majors, we had a boy hurt in the 2nd inning and he couldn't continue. The home team only had 8 players and we rescheduled the game at a later date.

[MB_Ump]

In LL, a game cannot be started without 9 players on each team. It is not an automic forfeiture, but is referred to th LL BOD for a decision on whether to reschedule or forfeit. Allowing teams to "borrow" players is specifically disallowed. A local rule is not going to help unless Williamsport has approved the change. It is common sense that if you play outside the LL rule book, LL is not going to cover the liability for the game. I think an ump would have to weigh the risk of assuming liability for whatever happens in the game (like the kid using his mouth to catch the ball) versus letting the kids play. The kids can always play a practice game without an ump...and beer-thirty comes that much earlier.

[Aging_Arbiter]

BY the way, I'm not sure how LL is going to look on this insurance claim (if filed) for getting hit in the mouth.  When they find out that you played with 8 & the LGR says you must have 9, someone other than LL may be held liable.  In this in this society of frivolous legal cases that we live in, in my game, you're going to have 9 to start, 9 to play and 9 to end the game, or we're not playing a game.  I LIKE MY HOUSE!

[Aging_Arbiter]

There are no Forfeits in Little League.

It is up to the Board of Directors how to handle the game.

Replay, Restart etc.

 

I respectfully disagree. I belive 4.15 is what you would be looking for.  However, sub-paragraphs 1-4 are often referred to the BOD, but I have seen sub-paragraphs 5 & 6 upheld. 

 

In reference to the OP, 4.16 is what applies here NOTE: A game may not be started with less that (9) nine players on each team, nor without at least one adult manager or substitute manager. 

[BigUmpire]

It simply says parents aren't committed to a program. Remember these kids can't drive.

• “Youth sports should be played by orphansâ€.- sdandersonjr

[Guest Rulebook]

Quote

 

You can play with less than 9 in tee-ball and minor league...

Page 37 in the rulebook. Regulation III,  The Teams   "The league shall, at least 10 days prior to the first regular game, establish the number of players on each team. No team may have more than 15 players nor less than 12.  Tee Ball and Minor League:  There will be no minimum or maximum established at the Tee Ball and Minor League levels.  Roster size of 8-10 players is recommended.  NOTE: If a local league elects to roster less than nine (9) players at the Tee Ball and/or Minor League levels, rules 3.03 Note 2, 4.16 and 4.17 do not apply.". Emphasis added!