Balk?

[UmpJM]

Jeff,

 

Actually it's a very old word - derived from the Latin via Middle English.

 

As always, I blame the Jesuits.

 

JM

[Called3rdStrike]

One that comes out of the pitcher's hand (or glove) unintentionally while he is in contact and hits the ground.

 

JM

So if your holding your cell phone in your hand, and it slips out of your grasp, but you catch it before it hits the ground, did you drop your phone?

[Thunderheads]

JM,

just messin'

[Mike Prince]

One that comes out of the pitcher's hand (or glove) unintentionally while he is in contact and hits the ground.

 

JM

So if your holding your cell phone in your hand, and it slips out of your grasp, but you catch it before it hits the ground, did you drop your phone?

 

No, I ALMOST dropped my phone

[Thunderheads]

One that comes out of the pitcher's hand (or glove) unintentionally while he is in contact and hits the ground.

 

JM

So if your holding your cell phone in your hand, and it slips out of your grasp, but you catch it before it hits the ground, did you drop your phone?

Negative GhostRider ............

[UmpJM]

No, you caught it. 

 

JM

[24sdad]

One that comes out of the pitcher's hand (or glove) unintentionally while he is in contact and hits the ground.

 

JM

JM, thank you because that is exactly what I used to think.  At Evans DC a couple years ago, I asked one of our AAA CC's that same question.  He replied that any downward movement of the ball is considered "dropped," and it does not have to hit the ground.  He told me to look up dropped in the dictionary, which says (in part), "The act of falling; descent, the vertical distance from a higher to a lower level."  To me it makes sense, but like you I always envisioned anything dropped having to hit the ground.

[noumpere]

There is no balk proscription against "looking weird".

 

JM

Okay that part was supposed to be a joke.

 

(k) The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally has the ball slip

or fall out of his hand or glove;

 

I don't see "to the ground" as part of that.

 

I did read later where it was 15-0 JV game or something so if theres a game management reason to let this go (especially if theres any doubt that the ball really came out etc.) then I can see that but I'd have it as a balk.

 

Also, theres a HS case play or something where F1 tosses the ball from hand to glove, or tosses the ball up in the air -- and those are balks.  I think Id apply the same in an OBR game.

[CentralOhioUmp30]

I get the "if it looks weird, call it" adage.  However, this was a JV game (big suburb school vs. small Christian school)  that had gotten out of hand quickly (home team up 15-0 in top of 4), so we were just trying to get the game over with.

 

I don't know how you guys handle those situations, but for me, in blowouts, I'm a little more lenient to balks or general things that aren't giving a team an advantage.  In Varsity games I won't let that stuff go, but I don't think you can treat bad JV and Freshman games the same way.

 

This was a freak thing that happened, but I like this site because I can ask a question like this and be better prepared for future games.  Thanks guys.

Buckeye,

Did you get a bunch of  "BALK, that's a BALK" when it happened ???  If not, .........no worries ....

 

AGAIN....

 

HTBT

 

Not a peep.

[Called3rdStrike]

One that comes out of the pitcher's hand (or glove) unintentionally while he is in contact and hits the ground.

JM

So if your holding your cell phone in your hand, and it slips out of your grasp, but you catch it before it hits the ground, did you drop your phone?

No, I ALMOST dropped my phone Okay then.

[24sdad]

There is no balk proscription against "looking weird".

 

JM

Okay that part was supposed to be a joke.

 

(k) The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally has the ball slip

or fall out of his hand or glove;

 

I don't see "to the ground" as part of that.

 

I did read later where it was 15-0 JV game or something so if theres a game management reason to let this go (especially if theres any doubt that the ball really came out etc.) then I can see that but I'd have it as a balk.

 

Also, theres a HS case play or something where F1 tosses the ball from hand to glove, or tosses the ball up in the air -- and those are balks.  I think Id apply the same in an OBR game.

While I agree this is a balk, given the circumstances of Buckeye's sitch he handled it fine.

[NFUA_44]

Ok so I see the light in calling it in some/most situations. Makes sense given the ref's, but if we were ever going to define HTBT this one ranks right up there!

In Buckeyes sitch he has to do the Harlem Shuffle while in contact on the 5th Sunday of the summer solstice before I go huntin that one.

[KLAH316]

One that comes out of the pitcher's hand (or glove) unintentionally while he is in contact and hits the ground.

 

JM

So if your holding your cell phone in your hand, and it slips out of your grasp, but you catch it before it hits the ground, did you drop your phone?

 

Only if the screen shatters!!! 

[Specks]

Balk

8.05(k)

(k) The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally has the ball slip

or fall out of his hand or glove;

 

I don't believe FED is different

[BalkHawk]

There is no balk proscription against "looking weird".

 

JM

UmpJM's got a new word!!

 

proscription (noun) prÅ-ˈskrip-shÉ™n- : an imposed restraint or restriction

[BalkHawk]

Balk

8.05(k)

(k) The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally has the ball slip

or fall out of his hand or glove;

 

I don't believe FED is different

 

The language on the official MLB website reads:

(k) The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally drops the ball;

[noumpere]

Balk

8.05(k)

(k) The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally has the ball slip

or fall out of his hand or glove;

 

I don't believe FED is different

 

The language on the official MLB website reads:

 

>(k) The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally drops the ball;

 

You need to update your link because it was changed this year to what I posted above.

[BalkHawk]

The commish needs to update his website, you mean.

Indeed, you are correct, sir.

Do you really believe either version of the rule was violated in the OP?

[noumpere]

The commish needs to update his website, you mean.

Indeed, you are correct, sir.

Do you really believe either version of the rule was violated in the OP?

I got my quote right from mlb.com so I think the website has been updated but maybe the rules are also somewhere else.

[grayhawk]

noumpere is 100% correct, and the OP is definitely a balk in OBR.  The language underlined below is new for 2013:

 

 

8.05(k): The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally has the ball slip or fall out of his hand or glove

 

For Fed, it's not as clear:

 

6-2-4a: any feinting toward the batter or first base, or any dropping of the ball (even though accidental) and the ball does not cross the foul line

[CentralOhioUmp30]

noumpere is 100% correct, and the OP is definitely a balk in OBR.  The language underlined below is new for 2013:

 

 

8.05(k): The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally has the ball slip or fall out of his hand or glove

 

For Fed, it's not as clear:

 

6-2-4a: any feinting toward the batter or first base, or any dropping of the ball (even though accidental) and the ball does not cross the foul line

 

This is very interesting.  This is my eighth year umpiring but only my first year actually digging inside the FED rulebook.  However, my knowledge of the FED rules was always very good from actually playing the game.  Still have a lot of work to do though.  I also need to dive into the OBR book as well.

[noumpere]

  However, my knowledge of the FED rules was always very good from actually playing the game. 

ha ha ha .  Thatnks for the laugh

 

(and I don't say that to be mean -- just that its what lots of players think when they become umpires -- and mirrors a converstation I was having with one young upstart earlier today)

[mstaylor]

 

noumpere is 100% correct, and the OP is definitely a balk in OBR.  The language underlined below is new for 2013:

 

 

8.05(k): The pitcher, while touching his plate, accidentally or intentionally has the ball slip or fall out of his hand or glove

 

For Fed, it's not as clear:

 

6-2-4a: any feinting toward the batter or first base, or any dropping of the ball (even though accidental) and the ball does not cross the foul line

 

This is very interesting.  This is my eighth year umpiring but only my first year actually digging inside the FED rulebook.  However, my knowledge of the FED rules was always very good from actually playing the game.  Still have a lot of work to do though.  I also need to dive into the OBR book as well.

This is a response I made today in the intro section. My feeling is the same as noumpire. http://umpire-empire.com/index.php/topic/52706-i-am-new-from-nashvilletn/    Post 4

[CentralOhioUmp30]

I've heard people say it, too. And I realize it does sound ridiculous, but just general knowledge of the game did help me avoid problems my first several years.

Obviously, I picked up the rule and case books to take my required tests and to learn some of the more complicated rules, but I wasn't really serious about actually learning until this year, to be perfectly honest.

[BigUmpire]

If you were a runner on 1st, 3 steps out, leaning towards second with a green light on and this happened how would you react?