What to do about undercutting "scabs"

[csabo17]

I saw someone refer to these people as scabs in another thread so I thought id use it.

Our state and local associations set prices with the schools for everything from varsity to one man middle school. What do you guys do, or what can be done about rouge umpires who call up coaches to make deals?

For instance, if a middle school game with one up is $72.50 and they normally play two. A ump will talk to the coach before he turns the games into the assigner and say ill do both games for $105, and work your whole schedule. The coach just gives that ump the entire schedule and when he cant make it he will call and ask other umps to cover it. Didnt really realize this was going on until i agreed to cover and when it came time to pay I asked about the low price and the coach said the ump he had given the schedule to agreed on that price. I didnt want to get into it with the coach over money before a game, because its not professional amd makes it look like im in it just for the money.

Now this very thing has been brought up in meetings. The assigner talking about not being able to get us raises and stuff because we have guys who go out and make their own deals to make sure they are working a lot.

My questions are basically, how would you of handled the situation when you got paid before the game?

Should I bring it to the assigners attention? Should I bring it to other umpires attention that this guy is basically undercutting us all and taking an entire schedule from a team for less money? Should I confront the umpire myself and keep it low key? I really do not want to keep it quiet because tbh, it disgusted me.

[T-Rav]

I saw someone refer to these people as scabs in another thread so I thought id use it.

Our state and local associations set prices with the schools for everything from varsity to one man middle school. What do you guys do, or what can be done about rouge umpires who call up coaches to make deals?

For instance, if a middle school game with one up is $72.50 and they normally play two. A ump will talk to the coach before he turns the games into the assigner and say ill do both games for $105, and work your whole schedule. The coach just gives that ump the entire schedule and when he cant make it he will call and ask other umps to cover it. Didnt really realize this was going on until i agreed to cover and when it came time to pay I asked about the low price and the coach said the ump he had given the schedule to agreed on that price. I didnt want to get into it with the coach over money before a game, because its not professional amd makes it look like im in it just for the money.

Now this very thing has been brought up in meetings. The assigner talking about not being able to get us raises and stuff because we have guys who go out and make their own deals to make sure they are working a lot.

My questions are basically, how would you of handled the situation when you got paid before the game?

Should I bring it to the assigners attention? Should I bring it to other umpires attention that this guy is basically undercutting us all and taking an entire schedule from a team for less money? Should I confront the umpire myself and keep it low key? I really do not want to keep it quiet because tbh, it disgusted me.

Go tell your assigner, I wouldn't be spreading the word to other umpires though, let him do that. Like you said he is undercutting you all and it needs to be addressed from your association.

[csabo17]

Does that make me look like a rat?

I told my partner that I call year round with and he was pissed. Im sure others would feel the same way. I just dont want to be that guy.

[SanDiegoSteve]

I don't consider it ratting somebody out if they are taking food off my table. These clowns that do this have no moral compass, and should be reported and stopped. Just my :2cents:

[TNCoach]

That's market forces at work in reality... I am not a big union guy and this works a lot like a union. Nevertheless, my association/conference has a strange twist with it.

My school is the only one in our conference who is part of the association. Seeing how that is the case, we use two umpires but each school is responsible for having an umpire there. There will be two games, one baseball and one softball. The home team pays for both umpires. We use arbiter and with that umpires who are part of our state association. Other schools in our league don't. They get their own. Our conference has a payout of $55 per double header. Our association price is $75 per double header. If an umpire is our umpire but at another field, they still pay $55 only. If an umpire is the other school's umpire at our field, we still pay $75.

We understandably had some issues this season with the price difference and may change so that each school pays their own umpire. That would cost nothing more for us but would hurt the other umpire who does our game for the other school as they would only get $55.

[csabo17]

^

man thats confusing. Why not just have the home team pay for the umps?

I think ill send the assigner an email, telling him about my experience at the field. Then explain how I got,the game. Id say he will be upset as well when he finds out an ump is taking teams schedules and assigning them out himself.

[TNCoach]

We have to have at least one association umpire at the game for insurance purposes. If we played at someone else's field they wouldn't get one and we would have insurance issues. That is why we each get an umpire. We run into the price issue when we go to other schools because they only pay $55 when the association says they are supposed to get $75. We are trying to fix that issue so it may be that we pay our own next season and all other schools pay their own. The problem then will be one official is getting $20 more than the other. Hopefully though, that will get more peope joining the association to get the higher pay.

[JaxRolo]

In Florida you have to be sanctioned by FHSAA to umpire school games. So we don't have a problem with officials undercutting.

[TNCoach]

The problem we have is that some schools haven't joined the association.

[JaxRolo]

Here the Counties school district signs a contract with the association and every school in that county uses our Umpires.

[csabo17]

So do we. This guy is sanctioned by the khsaa, AND a member of our local association.

[johnnyg08]

uh. oh for him. Probably not a member any longer.

[JaxRolo]

Here the association has to be sanctioned. The lone scumbag umpire can not be.

[cuban]

I saw someone refer to these people as scabs in another thread so I thought id use it.

Our state and local associations set prices with the schools for everything from varsity to one man middle school. What do you guys do, or what can be done about rouge umpires who call up coaches to make deals?

For instance, if a middle school game with one up is $72.50 and they normally play two. A ump will talk to the coach before he turns the games into the assigner and say ill do both games for $105, and work your whole schedule. The coach just gives that ump the entire schedule and when he cant make it he will call and ask other umps to cover it. Didnt really realize this was going on until i agreed to cover and when it came time to pay I asked about the low price and the coach said the ump he had given the schedule to agreed on that price. I didnt want to get into it with the coach over money before a game, because its not professional amd makes it look like im in it just for the money.

Now this very thing has been brought up in meetings. The assigner talking about not being able to get us raises and stuff because we have guys who go out and make their own deals to make sure they are working a lot.

My questions are basically, how would you of handled the situation when you got paid before the game?

Should I bring it to the assigners attention? Should I bring it to other umpires attention that this guy is basically undercutting us all and taking an entire schedule from a team for less money? Should I confront the umpire myself and keep it low key? I really do not want to keep it quiet because tbh, it disgusted me.

You have got to be kidding. Your college assigner is __________________ and your talking about other people being scabs and undercutting umpires pay. Before you go pointing your finger at other people you might want to check the company you keep. Your whole association is SCABS!

Edited May 8, 2012 by Umpire in Chief
removed name

[SanDiegoSteve]

• If an association is contracted to a league, and individual umpires not affiliated with this association take any of their games, they are scabs.
  
• If individual umpires can find games that aren't already being covered by an organized umpire group, then it's open season.
  
• If someone in an association is doing it to their own association, then string their ass up.
  

[csabo17]

Im not sure what you mean cuban. This was the first year I got asked to do any kiac work. This will also be the first summer I work his tournaments in the Cincy area. Do you care to elaberate what you mean? Do i need to rethink working for this guy? Sounds like you have had some problems with him.

[semper_fi_72]

I saw someone refer to these people as scabs in another thread so I thought id use it.

Our state and local associations set prices with the schools for everything from varsity to one man middle school. What do you guys do, or what can be done about rouge umpires who call up coaches to make deals?

For instance, if a middle school game with one up is $72.50 and they normally play two. A ump will talk to the coach before he turns the games into the assigner and say ill do both games for $105, and work your whole schedule. The coach just gives that ump the entire schedule and when he cant make it he will call and ask other umps to cover it. Didnt really realize this was going on until i agreed to cover and when it came time to pay I asked about the low price and the coach said the ump he had given the schedule to agreed on that price. I didnt want to get into it with the coach over money before a game, because its not professional amd makes it look like im in it just for the money.

Now this very thing has been brought up in meetings. The assigner talking about not being able to get us raises and stuff because we have guys who go out and make their own deals to make sure they are working a lot.

My questions are basically, how would you of handled the situation when you got paid before the game?

Should I bring it to the assigners attention? Should I bring it to other umpires attention that this guy is basically undercutting us all and taking an entire schedule from a team for less money? Should I confront the umpire myself and keep it low key? I really do not want to keep it quiet because tbh, it disgusted me.

You have got to be kidding. Your college assigner is ________________ and your talking about other people being scabs and undercutting umpires pay. Before you go pointing your finger at other people you might want to check the company you keep. Your whole association is SCABS!

cuban.....you should be very careful about using someones name on the internet.

[cuban]

I saw someone refer to these people as scabs in another thread so I thought id use it.

Our state and local associations set prices with the schools for everything from varsity to one man middle school. What do you guys do, or what can be done about rouge umpires who call up coaches to make deals?

For instance, if a middle school game with one up is $72.50 and they normally play two. A ump will talk to the coach before he turns the games into the assigner and say ill do both games for $105, and work your whole schedule. The coach just gives that ump the entire schedule and when he cant make it he will call and ask other umps to cover it. Didnt really realize this was going on until i agreed to cover and when it came time to pay I asked about the low price and the coach said the ump he had given the schedule to agreed on that price. I didnt want to get into it with the coach over money before a game, because its not professional amd makes it look like im in it just for the money.

Now this very thing has been brought up in meetings. The assigner talking about not being able to get us raises and stuff because we have guys who go out and make their own deals to make sure they are working a lot.

My questions are basically, how would you of handled the situation when you got paid before the game?

Should I bring it to the assigners attention? Should I bring it to other umpires attention that this guy is basically undercutting us all and taking an entire schedule from a team for less money? Should I confront the umpire myself and keep it low key? I really do not want to keep it quiet because tbh, it disgusted me.

You have got to be kidding. Your college assigner is __________________ and your talking about other people being scabs and undercutting umpires pay. Before you go pointing your finger at other people you might want to check the company you keep. Your whole association is SCABS!

cuban.....you should be very careful about using someones name on the internet.

Oh well, I said it and I stand by it. The truth is the truth.

[Pete Peterson Sr]

In Alabama, HS sports are governed by the Alabama High School Athletic Association, except for the small, mainly religious, school. All member schools are required to use officials that are registered with the state, and members of a state-approved association.Schools would be fined for using unregistered officials, so that does not happen here.

[Umpire in Chief]

cuban.....you should be very careful about using someones name on the internet.

Agreed -- removed name

[cyclonehokiece]

In Alabama, HS sports are governed by the Alabama High School Athletic Association, except for the small, mainly religious, school. All member schools are required to use officials that are registered with the state, and members of a state-approved association.Schools would be fined for using unregistered officials, so that does not happen here.

Similar here in Virginia. In order to register with the VHSL, you must be in a state approved association that covers specific schools/districts (synomous with conferences). Private and perocial schools are excluded from the VHSL so they are free to choose umpires from whoever. Most go with the VHSL approved association, but my association lost some private schools due to someone coming in to undercut our price. Our association made it known you could work for them or for us, but not both. While I think this starts to tread on the rights we have as independent contractors, we have to do what we have to do to keep schools from leaving our association.

[NCAAump2]

How does that infringe on your rights as an independent contractor? You have a choice of who you work for, and if you choose to go with the other group, then your assignor has the option to not give you games. We have the same thing in the STL area. There are 3 umpire associations in the area: GSLAU (my assn.), JCOA, and MUA. As GSLAU members, we are not allowed to work games through any competing organizations (JCOA or MUA). If we choose to accept games from one of those two groups, we will no longer be members of GSLAU, thus no longer receiving games from GSLAU. Completely fair and understandable if you ask me.

[cyclonehokiece]

Well, the group doesn't have a formal constitution or membership rules in writing, but that is a different story (will hopefully be fixed by next year).

BTW, I would never work for the other guy (rates are not worth it and until it was mentioned at a meeting, never heard of him) just believe unless it is in writing in a membership agreement, I should have the right to take games from whoever.

[NCAAump2]

You do, but they also have a right to not assign you if you're working for someone who is competing against them for business.

[johnnyg08]

You do, but they also have a right to not assign you if you're working for someone who is competing against them for business.

Exactly.