run from home to first

[Guest john]

Bad throw pulls the 1b off the bag and the runner stops and starts to run home.  When is that batter out ?  The umps I play with say "as soon as the batter starts running back he has given himself up and is out".  But I can't find anything in the rule book either way.  This artical says different. https://www.closecallsports.com/2021/05/running-batter-back-to-home-plate.html#:~:text=The MLB Umpire Manual states,that obstruction may not be  What say you the almighty rules knowledge gods ?  Thanks

[noumpere]

for (most) baseball -- the batter can return until s/he gets to the plate.

 

I *think* for (some) softball, the runner is out when s/he starts to return.

[Mussgrass]

But the point is, what does it matter? F3 has the ball so all he needs to do is step on 1B for the putout. Don't chase the runner back to home like the Pirates did last season.

[SeeingEyeDog]

17 minutes ago, Mussgrass said:

But the point is, what does it matter? F3 has the ball so all he needs to do is step on 1B for the putout. Don't chase the runner back to home like the Pirates did last season.

...and yet...they chase him back anyway so, as always if there's a rule to apply, we need to know it and when and how to apply it.

~Dawg

[834k3r]

3 hours ago, Mussgrass said:

But the point is, what does it matter? F3 has the ball so all he needs to do is step on 1B for the putout. Don't chase the runner back to home like the Pirates did last season.

I've seen this many times in LL and U13 and below travel ball games. Cranial flagellation is a thing, especially for kids.

[beerguy55]

9 hours ago, Guest john said:

Bad throw pulls the 1b off the bag and the runner stops and starts to run home.  When is that batter out ?  The umps I play with say "as soon as the batter starts running back he has given himself up and is out".  But I can't find anything in the rule book either way.  This artical says different. https://www.closecallsports.com/2021/05/running-batter-back-to-home-plate.html#:~:text=The MLB Umpire Manual states,that obstruction may not be  What say you the almighty rules knowledge gods ?  Thanks

If the umps you play with are softball umps they'd be right - if you retreat to home to avoid a tag you are out...it's mostly treated like INT...batter/runner out, all runners return to base Time of Pitch. (there are exceptions to what happens to runners if a play was made on them first)

If they're baseball umps they're wrong - the batter can retreat to home.

The softball reasoning is likely around the short base paths.  There might be some softball rulesets that don't have this rule and allow the batter to return to home like baseball.

You will find the rule in the softball rulebooks.

eg. International Softball Rules - 8(2) The batter/runner is out: i. When he steps back toward home plate to avoid or delay a tag by a fielder

You won't find it in the baseball rulebooks because the rule books typically don't articulate every single thing a runner is ALLOWED to do...only what they're not.

 

[TooBusyToUmp]

The strangest MLB play of all time illustrates this nicely. Not only does the play amaze--even more amazing is that the commentators got everything right.