A, B and C Positioning

[LaskoFan]

First and foremost, after many years of playing and coaching, I have decided to continue my love of baseball through umpiring.  So this is my first year and have two games under my belt - both as base ump.  I have been doing a lot of reading here (great site) and on the web and have a question regarding the correct positioning of a base ump.  We run two ump crews and I am umping teener baseball. Nonetheless, any insight is greatly appreciated.  I asked my partner for their thoughts and they were different.  To be honest though, my first game I was going 100 MPH and really was not able to absorb much besides slowing down and proper angle and such.  The second game slowed down quite a bit and I started thinking a bit more about the these type of things.  Finally, is there an out component for the below scenarios?  Meaning, for two outs, move to "B" versus "C".  

Runners...
None - Position "A"
R1 - Position "B"
R1, R2 - Position "C"
R1, R3 - Position "B"
R1, R2, R3 - Position "B"
R2 - Position "C"
R2, R3 - Position "B"
R3 - Position "B"

[noumpere]

Different groups have different philosophies on BU's positioning.  All agree that with no one on, BU is in A.  After that:

1) With a runner at second or third, be in C, otherwise B.  (This is "old school" and not used much anymore.)

2) With a steal of second possible (i.e., R1 and no R2; with or without R3) be in B, otherwise C (this is what I prefer).

3) With a steal of third possible (i.e., R2 and no R3; with or without R1) be in C, otherwise B (this is what you have above).

 

Given that you are just starting, you should do what your group requires.

 

Not many move in two-person based on the number of outs.

[Stk004]

I've always done 

No runners A

R1 B

R2 C 

R3 C

R1, R2 C

R1 R2 R3 C

R1 R3 B

R2 R3 C

[Welpe]

3 hours ago, Stk004 said:

I've always done 

No runners A

R1 B

R2 C 

R3 C

R1, R2 C

R1 R2 R3 C

R1 R3 B

R2 R3 C

Same here.

[LaskoFan]

1 hour ago, Welpe said:

Same here.

This seems to dovetail with noumpere preferred method - With a steal of second possible (i.e., R1 and no R2; with or without R3) be in B, otherwise C (this is what I prefer). Seems easy to remember as well.  Looks like I will be spending a bit more time in "C".  

[ALStripes17]

This seems to dovetail with noumpere preferred method - With a steal of second possible (i.e., R1 and no R2; with or without R3) be in B, otherwise C (this is what I prefer). Seems easy to remember as well.  Looks like I will be spending a bit more time in "C".  

Precisely. It does make pretty decent sense too. 2-man is fairly straightforward. Just have to know predict/anticipate plays.

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[Forest Ump]

9 hours ago, Stk004 said:

I've always done 

No runners A

R1 B

R2 C 

R3 C

R1, R2 C

R1 R2 R3 C

R1 R3 B

R2 R3 C

If you are a new umpire, do this. In about ten years or more try something different.

[noumpere]

7 hours ago, ALStripes17 said:

Precisely. It does make pretty decent sense too. 2-man is fairly straightforward. Just have to know predict/anticipate plays.

And, move once the ball is hit / there's a play.  These are just starting positions, not ending positions.

[Welpe]

If you are a new umpire, do this. In about ten years or more try something different.

What would you recommend doing differently for the veterans?

[KenBAZ]

Some of the youth games I do I spend so much time at "C" that I get nauseous.

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[udbrky]

4 hours ago, Welpe said:

What would you recommend doing differently for the veterans?

Wondered the same thing

[stkjock]

on a 46/60 field, R1 only, is it better to be inside or outside in B?

 

 

[Stk004]

2 minutes ago, stkjock said:

on a 46/60 field, R1 only, is it better to be inside or outside in B?

 

 

The only time I move inside on a diamond with 60 ft baselines is after the ball is hit. 

[noumpere]

If runners can lead off, go inside.  If not, go outside.

[stkjock]

what's the advantage to being outside?

 

I'm asking based on my limited experience with 2 man set ups, from what I saw last night, it seems to out the umpire in less than optimal for the back pick at first and the steal of second vs. being inside at B or even in C.

[maven]

5 minutes ago, stkjock said:

what's the advantage to being outside?

On a 60' diamond? Some folks like to be able to take a step without knocking down an 9 year-old.

[stkjock]

well in my case it's 11/12s,    

 

in all seriousness, is being outside give one better positions to view the play over inside?

[noumpere]

2 minutes ago, stkjock said:

well in my case it's 11/12s,    

 

in all seriousness, is being outside give one better positions to view the play over inside?

If they can't lead off, then you need to be outside to see that.  You can still see the steal / back-pick from outside, even if being inside would be better (and I'm not convinced it is).

[Stk004]

40 minutes ago, stkjock said:

well in my case it's 11/12s,    

 

in all seriousness, is being outside give one better positions to view the play over inside?

As maven eluded too, there's just no room inside on a 60' diamond. 

[stkjock]

Thanks for the insights

[umpire_scott]

I would add that a lot of organizations are teaching now that with two outs always go to "B" because the most likely play is to be at first base.  I don't personally see a need in this as I have plenty of time on a batted ball to get into position to make a call at first base from "C".  But I've been told that it the "new school" proper mechanic.

[udbrky]

I've disagreed with partners, but I go with what the manuals say. I prioritize MLBUM > NFHS when they disagree.