How do we manage a play like this...

[johnnyg08]

How do we manage a play like this when we don't have the benefit of replay?

Certainly the first base umpire is 100% certain in what he saw.  

 

[ElkOil]

It's PU's job to follow the runner up the line and look for the pulled foot and swipe tag.  BU does not have the angle to see the foot.  PU should have gone to BU with what he saw.  And he DID see it... riiiiight?

Edited May 23, 2015 by ElkOil

[catsbackr]

It's BU's job to follow the runner up the line and look for the pulled foot and swipe tag.  PU does not have the angle to see the foot.  BU should have gone to PU with what he saw.  And he DID see it... riiiiight?

What?

 

PU trails runner up the line to watch for pulled foot or swipe tag.  The base ump obviously didn't see the first baseman or he wouldn't have called him out.

 

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.

 

[ElkOil]

What?

 

PU trails runner up the line to watch for pulled foot or swipe tag.  The base ump obviously didn't see the first baseman or he wouldn't have called him out.

 

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.

 

​I got my B's and Ps mixed up.  I edited my original post.  (Feelin' stupid).

[noumpere]

BU was way past 90* to the throw.  I know that's somewhat the teach now, but it's why I prefer to be closer to the line.

[ElkOil]

I was taught to forget about the 90 degree school of thought.  Still, once you get set, you're prone to being in this spot.  Hopefully you have a partner who knows what his role is on this play.

Edited May 24, 2015 by ElkOil

[maineump]

The way a 2 person crew could handle this is:

BU makes the call that he sees. If BU is unsure of pulled foot or if asked , then get together with trailing PU to correct the call if it needs to be fixed.

As the BU, if you see a bad throw, you should move a little to correct the angle you are seeing the play at, to see the pulled foot or swipe tag.

Edited May 24, 2015 by maineump

[blue23ll]

The best way to 'manage' a play like this is to get it right. Absent that, you have to eat your s*)t sammich.

[Replacematt]

I am of the opinion that barring sudden incapacitation, there is no excuse for BU to miss a pulled foot from A.

[Dean]

I am of the opinion that barring sudden incapacitation, there is no excuse for BU to miss a pulled foot from A.

 I agree he should have took a read step when the throw was off line.  However, this is the MLB and this is an everyday FT job.  Tell me there are days in your real job you don't get a little lazy and miss something?

[Umpire in Chief]

It appears the BU was straight lined. Yes, he could have taken a read step. 

What I am surprised by is that in the spirit of getting the call right, they didn't either get together or go to review. 

Also, because he came of the bag up the line the PU may not have been able to tell. 

[Replacematt]

I said there is no excuse. Momentary laziness isn't an excuse, it's a reason.

[TheRockawayKid]

In a sub-pro level, I'm sure that he would have went straight to his partner. 

However, I have a feeling that it's the replay system that's at fault here. Is the inclination to just go straight to the replay system and avoid going to a partner? 

[zm1283]

It appears the BU was straight lined. Yes, he could have taken a read step. 

What I am surprised by is that in the spirit of getting the call right, they didn't either get together or go to review. 

Also, because he came of the bag up the line the PU may not have been able to tell. 

​

In a sub-pro level, I'm sure that he would have went straight to his partner. 

However, I have a feeling that it's the replay system that's at fault here. Is the inclination to just go straight to the replay system and avoid going to a partner? 

​You guys do realize this play happened like four years ago, right? Managers rarely react like Mattingly did in the replay era. They either signal for a review from the dugout or walk out and just ask for it. 

MLB never fully adopted the "Get the call right" philosophy that the NCAA did before they went to the replay system. Hence the reason there weren't crew conferences on plays like this. 

Edited May 27, 2015 by zm1283

[woodiemiller]

I said there is no excuse. Momentary laziness isn't an excuse, it's a reason.

​Please define the difference between a "reason" & an "excuse"?

[woodiemiller]

How do we manage a play like this when we don't have the benefit of replay?

Certainly the first base umpire is 100% certain in what he saw.  

 

​This is why as BU in "A" with a play at 1B, take only 1-2 steps in fair territory to see a potential pulled foot or swipe tag.

[Replacematt]

​Please define the difference between a "reason" & an "excuse"?

​A reason is why something happens. An excuse is a defensible reason.

[woodiemiller]

​A reason is why something happens. An excuse is a defensible reason.

​Can you expand on that?

[zm1283]

​This is why as BU in "A" with a play at 1B, take only 1-2 steps in fair territory to see a potential pulled foot or swipe tag.

​The first baseman can still get pulled straight toward you if you start 1-2 steps off the line instead of 90 degrees from the throw. The starting point isn't the key here. The way to hopefully avoid this is read the throw, when you read it isn't true, pick up the first baseman and then take a read step or two one direction so you aren't straight lined. 

[woodiemiller]

​The first baseman can still get pulled straight toward you if you start 1-2 steps off the line instead of 90 degrees from the throw. The starting point isn't the key here. The way to hopefully avoid this is read the throw, when you read it isn't true, pick up the first baseman and then take a read step or two one direction so you aren't straight lined. 

​I believe you are incorrect. In this video, had the umpire only been a step or 2 in fair territory, he would have easily seen the foot off the base. In most cases, the throws do not pull the 1B to the RF foul pole. Once in awhile, no matter what the umpire does, he will be straight lined on a call from time to time. It happens. If you can always read a throw to avoid being straight lined, you should be above MLB level because obviously even this MLB umpire got straight lined.

Edited May 28, 2015 by woodiemiller

[Replacematt]

​I believe you are incorrect. In this video, had the umpire only been a step or 2 in fair territory, he would have easily seen the foot off the base. In most cases, the throws do not pull the 1B to the RF foul pole. Once in awhile, no matter what the umpire does, he will be straight lined on a call from time to time. It happens. If you can always read a throw to avoid being straight lined, you should be above MLB level because obviously even this MLB umpire got straight lined.

​He was straight-lined because he didn't do what he should have. Again, there is no valid reason for anyone to ever be straight-lined in A. He made a mistake.

[woodiemiller]

​He was straight-lined because he didn't do what he should have. Again, there is no valid reason for anyone to ever be straight-lined in A. He made a mistake.

​Never?

[Replacematt]

Never.

[UmpTTS43]

​He was straight-lined because he didn't do what he should have. Again, there is no valid reason for anyone to ever be straight-lined in A. He made a mistake.

Those "mistakes" happen. And yes there are instances where you do not have an opportunity to get a good adjustment step. 

Never say never. 

There is no valid reason to miss anything if we do what we should but hey, there is not one person that is that good. 

 

Edited May 30, 2015 by UmpTTS43

[Replacematt]

I'm not saying that anyone is perfect. I'm quite comfortable that 100% success is not attainable. I'm simply saying that there is never a valid reason to miss the pulled foot.