umpire position

[Guest Eastside Coach]

This past weekend we had a field umpire who, with a runner on first, always moved to the "C" position. In my mind, and that of others, he missed a number of calls at first on plays he felt first baseman came of the bag and didn't find it again (lots of dirt piled around the bags and they were covered in dust). Neither dugout gave him grief, but fans of both teams did. Is there some reason I'm not getting that he would have set up at "C" with a single runner on the bases and that runner being at 1B? 

[DVA7130]

Bad mechanics/ lack of formal training.

[FleasOf1000Camels]

I've worked with several guys over the years who use C in this situation.

They think they gain an advantage by being able to see that runner break for 2nd on the steal.

 

Guys who do this are either:

Newbies that never had any formal training OR

Worn out vets who think they can do whatever they want.

[noumpere]

The issue here isn't where the BU starts (although I agree B is preferred) -- it's where he ends up.  If he started in C and stayed there to make a call on the BR at first, he was wrong.  But, he'd be just as likely to miss the call by starting in B and not moving.

[JaxRolo]

Bad bad bad

[umpire_scott]

My association allows us a lot of liberty to sway from the prescribed mechanics of when to be in "B" and "C".  I like this because I actually vary where I'm at depending on game situations.  For example if I have R1 and R3, most guys that I work with are in "B". But if I have F3 playing behind the runner and a catcher that has thrown do to third a few times I may go to "C" to get a better look at that snap throw.  However when I worked in Arizona we were trained to always be in "C" unless there was only a runner on 1st.  So depending on where you work and who you work for the mechanic may be different.

 

All that being said I've yet to find an organization that teaches to go to "C" with only R1.  Even my current association would frown on that.

[DVA7130]

@umpire_scott

You are in the B with R1 R3 because of look on a steal and first to third rotation.

Personaly I just do not sway from what's published.

[umpire_scott]

@umpire_scott

You are in the B with R1 R3 because of look on a steal and first to third rotation.

Personaly I just do not sway from what's published.

 

 

http://www.bgraregistration.com/master_library/umpire_schedules/files/2-ManUmpiringMechanics.pdf 

 

Has U2 in "C" for everything except no one on and R1.  This is how I was initially taught in Arizona.  This is also how the 2-man mechanic powerpoint that my association uses has it.  Southtexasumpire,com uses the same Powerpoint.

[JaxRolo]

 

@umpire_scott

You are in the B with R1 R3 because of look on a steal and first to third rotation.

Personaly I just do not sway from what's published.

 

 

http://www.bgraregistration.com/master_library/umpire_schedules/files/2-ManUmpiringMechanics.pdf 

 

Has U2 in "C" for everything except no one on and R1.  This is how I was initially taught in Arizona.  This is also how the 2-man mechanic powerpoint that my association uses has it.  Southtexasumpire,com uses the same Powerpoint.

 

They need to update their mechanics!

[JaxRolo]

Not to deviate from 2-man but even in 3-man Perfect Game has U3 in B with Runner on 1st

 

Their justification is that umpires rarely work 3-man.

Most games are work with 2-man so you are always in B. So why change your look in 3-man. Stay with what you normally do.

[umpire_scott]

Not to deviate from 2-man but even in 3-man Perfect Game has U3 in B with Runner on 1st

 

Their justification is that umpires rarely work 3-man.

Most games are work with 2-man so you are always in B. So why change your look in 3-man. Stay with what you normally do.

 

Really?  I've never heard of U3 ever being in "B" in 3-man.  To me that is extra confusing.  U2 has "A" or "B" and U3 has "C" or "D".  

 

That justification makes no sense to me.  One of the reasons to be in "B" in 3-man is to watch the pick-off at first.  Well with U2 in "A" there is no reason for that and thus, in my opinion, no reason to have U3 in "B".

[JaxRolo]

Makes perfect sense to me.

[maven]

Really?  I've never heard of U3 ever being in "B" in 3-man.  To me that is extra confusing.  U2 has "A" or "B" and U3 has "C" or "D".  

 

That justification makes no sense to me.  One of the reasons to be in "B" in 3-man is to watch the pick-off at first.  Well with U2 in "A" there is no reason for that and thus, in my opinion, no reason to have U3 in "B".

Go to any MiLB game at AA or up, and you'll see it a lot.

 

U3 in B with R1 only gives him a much better look at the steal of 2B.

[umpire_scott]

 

Really?  I've never heard of U3 ever being in "B" in 3-man.  To me that is extra confusing.  U2 has "A" or "B" and U3 has "C" or "D".  

 

That justification makes no sense to me.  One of the reasons to be in "B" in 3-man is to watch the pick-off at first.  Well with U2 in "A" there is no reason for that and thus, in my opinion, no reason to have U3 in "B".

Go to any MiLB game at AA or up, and you'll see it a lot.

 

U3 in B with R1 only gives him a much better look at the steal of 2B.

 

 

For me the angle from deep "C" to see the throw and turn to look at the play is better than in "B".  I will essentially move towards "B" to make my call, but I prefer the distance and angle I have from the throw in "C".  But I guess it does make more sense than I was giving it credit for.  In reality deep "B" and deep "C" are not that far away from each other.

[JaxRolo]

Really? I've never heard of U3 ever being in "B" in 3-man. To me that is extra confusing. U2 has "A" or "B" and U3 has "C" or "D".

That justification makes no sense to me. One of the reasons to be in "B" in 3-man is to watch the pick-off at first. Well with U2 in "A" there is no reason for that and thus, in my opinion, no reason to have U3 in "B".

Go to any MiLB game at AA or up, and you'll see it a lot.

U3 in B with R1 only gives him a much better look at the steal of 2B.

it was taught to me by a AAA guy.

[mhoffman]

b is the correct position for U3 with runner on first in three man, why because rotation play works perfectly in that situation with PU coming to third and U2 goes home and u3 already in b can stay there and cover 2nd/1st.  3 bases 1 plate with 6 eyes easy to cover that with rotation properly.  and if the ball is down right field line then u2 can go out and they work the 2 man rotation together.  Sweet as pie!  Love the three man mechanics.

 

As long as i'm not straight lined out, I like my chances but also make any steal plays big window not small window play because things can get hairy if you lock in to early and look for a perfect situation that's where you get yourself into trouble....read the flight of the ball then react don't assume a good throw....the best umpires still screw it up because of the A word gets pumping!!

[noumpere]

 

Really?  I've never heard of U3 ever being in "B" in 3-man.  To me that is extra confusing.  U2 has "A" or "B" and U3 has "C" or "D".  

 

That justification makes no sense to me.  One of the reasons to be in "B" in 3-man is to watch the pick-off at first.  Well with U2 in "A" there is no reason for that and thus, in my opinion, no reason to have U3 in "B".

Go to any MiLB game at AA or up, and you'll see it a lot.

 

U3 in B with R1 only gives him a much better look at the steal of 2B.

 

NCAA allows either deep B or deep C.  Some conferences prefer one or the other, otherwise you see 50% in each, and some who take B on a RH batter but C on a LH batter.

[grayhawk]

 

 

Really?  I've never heard of U3 ever being in "B" in 3-man.  To me that is extra confusing.  U2 has "A" or "B" and U3 has "C" or "D".  

 

That justification makes no sense to me.  One of the reasons to be in "B" in 3-man is to watch the pick-off at first.  Well with U2 in "A" there is no reason for that and thus, in my opinion, no reason to have U3 in "B".

Go to any MiLB game at AA or up, and you'll see it a lot.

 

U3 in B with R1 only gives him a much better look at the steal of 2B.

 

NCAA allows either deep B or deep C.  Some conferences prefer one or the other, otherwise you see 50% in each, and some who take B on a RH batter but C on a LH batter.

 

 

That's how I understand it as well.  It's necessary for U3 to be in C for a LH batter so he's in a better position to rule on a half swing appeal.  It's also good to be on the "spray" side - much less likely to be hit with a heat seeking rocket.