Lets play a game...

[Rich Ives]

Folks are so locked into the "fact" that the myth is a myth that they act like just like the myth believers instead of actually analyzing the rule.

[Jimurray]

tie can't go to the runner, he has to beat the throw a tie is not beating the throw

The throw has to beat the runner.

6.05 A batter is out when—

(j) After a third strike or after he hits a fair ball, he or first base is tagged before he touches first base;

So if it's a tie, he or the base was not tagged before he touched the base so he's safe.

Same here:

7.08 Any runner is out when—

(e) He or the next base is tagged before he touches the next base, after he has been forced to advance by reason of the batter becoming a runner.

Wasn't the wording of 6.05(j) changed a few years ago to make it consistent with 7.08(e)? Does anybody have the previous wording of 6.05(j) if in fact I am correct in remembering it being changed?

[noumpere]

tie can't go to the runner, he has to beat the throw a tie is not beating the throw

The throw has to beat the runner.

6.05 A batter is out when—

(j) After a third strike or after he hits a fair ball, he or first base is tagged before he touches first base;

So if it's a tie, he or the base was not tagged before he touched the base so he's safe.

Same here:

7.08 Any runner is out when—

(e) He or the next base is tagged before he touches the next base, after he has been forced to advance by reason of the batter becoming a runner.

Wasn't the wording of 6.05(j) changed a few years ago to make it consistent with 7.08(e)? Does anybody have the previous wording of 6.05(j) if in fact I am correct in remembering it being changed?

Yes it was changed. One place essentially said the tie goes to the runner the other said the tie goes to the defense. Now they are consistent at least in pro rules (I haven't checked the others).

[Rich Ives]

tie can't go to the runner, he has to beat the throw a tie is not beating the throw

The throw has to beat the runner.

6.05 A batter is out when—

(j) After a third strike or after he hits a fair ball, he or first base is tagged before he touches first base;

So if it's a tie, he or the base was not tagged before he touched the base so he's safe.

Same here:

7.08 Any runner is out when—

(e) He or the next base is tagged before he touches the next base, after he has been forced to advance by reason of the batter becoming a runner.

Wasn't the wording of 6.05(j) changed a few years ago to make it consistent with 7.08(e)? Does anybody have the previous wording of 6.05(j) if in fact I am correct in remembering it being changed?

They changed 7.08 to match 6.05

6.05 was throw has to beat and 7.08 was runner has to beat.

Now both are throw has to beat.

This is wht keeping up with the changes can be important.

[OHUMP]

Had hands part of the bat last night pitch coming in at high end of zone but in the strike zone kid sticks his hands over the plate and gets hit in hands. I call dead ball strike. After half inning coach comes in and says I know hands part of the bat foul ball. I told him no his batter was hit in the strike zone it is a dead ball strike. He looked at me like I was crazy then said if he got hit in the elbow it wouldn;t be a strike. I had to tell him again if it is in the strike zone it is.

[mstaylor]

Most coaches around here, when explaining DBT lines, say that if it goes in DBT it will be book rule. That way as umpires we decide what that is, one, two, TOT,or TOP.

[Dragon29]

"One base on an overthrow" also comes up often at the plate meeting, when ground rules are discussed.

This is not a ground rule. I wouldn't discuss the details of this rule at the plate meeting.

If the topic comes up while pointing out the places where a ball might go through, I tell them if the ball goes out of play, we'll award bases as necessary - I'm not going to go into a rule dissection at the plate meeting.

[MPLSMatt]

I can't believe no one has given my most recent favorite myth: RH batter, runner stealing third, batter has to get out of the way of the catchers throw or its INT. I hear this at least once a week and it's compounded by the fact that some umpires in my area are actually calling it this way.

[OHUMP]

+1 Matt have been hearing this all year. Even had a coach eject himself in the bottom of the first this year because he did not know when to stop arguing this when all of his coaches were telling him he was wrong.

[bam]

The Hands myth is certainly one of the most entrenched of the myths. I would say,"You have to turn right after overrunning first" "The ball is dead on a bounced ball that hits the batter" and "A RH pitcher has to disengage to throw to first" are among the ones we hear often. A question I get a lot from coaches is, can you use a wooden bat in LL,Pony,HS, whatever level.

Um, the ball IS dead on a (pitched) bounced ball that hits the batter.

You're not up to speed. Wnen a coach says that they mean the ball was dead because it hit the ground before it hit the batter so the catter was not HBP.

Not "up to speed"? I only know what the OP said.

But in all fairness, who would know more about clueless coaches than you, right?

[JHSump]

"One base on an overthrow" also comes up often at the plate meeting, when ground rules are discussed.

This is not a ground rule. I wouldn't discuss the details of this rule at the plate meeting.

If the topic comes up while pointing out the places where a ball might go through, I tell them if the ball goes out of play, we'll award bases as necessary - I'm not going to go into a rule dissection at the plate meeting.

Oh, I agree totally. I was not saying *I* start talking about award of bases on overthrows at the plate meeting. I've never had a HS coach bring it up at a plate meeting when they give the ground rules at their field. If I am giving ground rules (e.g., at tournaments), I never bring up award of bases. I just point out the DBT lines, etc. But some rec/summer/tournament coaches will then mention it, as if they are adding a well known bit of info to the discussion. If I acknowledge it at all, I say we'll award bases according to the book.

I'm really just saying "one base on an overthrow" is a myth that a huge fraction of coaches, fans, and parents believe. Right up there with "hands are part of the bat," I think.