BrianC14

Pete: It seems to me you're attempting to justify the FYC and the neighborhood call. In my situation, I made an incorrect call that was intended (my mind was made up that he was going to be out ahead of the call) to "F" the team. From an integrity standpoint, there is 0% difference between a called K3 that is 6" off the plate and what I did on that base. Both calls are wrong. A pitch 6" off the plate is not a strike, thus, the call is wrong. A throw to F3 that is bobbled and calling BR out is similarly wrong. Either way, both of those calls are intended to "F" the other team. Like I said, this is a slippery slope. This whole system of FYC and neighborhood calls seem to require an accounting system; and I think that there's no place for that sort of thing. This is precisely why I think that FYC's especially have no place in the game. This is an umpire making a concious decision to inject himself into the game - be it that he's angry at a player, a coach, the weather, doesn't matter. That umpire has decided that he will "show" who's boss, and in doing so, purposefully makes a call that is incorrect. I just can't get my head around that sort of thinking. But like I said, if an umpire decides he's going to do it, he has to live with it.

I have that one by Epic as well, I like it. Mike Taylor: the problem with your link is a missing bracket on the front end. It's also available at: http://www.umpire.org/store/index.php?cPath=3_45 for $27.95 member price.

My calculator works that way as well !

Santa's got a few things in his sleigh for me this year Though I'm not supposed to know that... Sometimes his auxillary sleigh (UPS) arrives when the wife is out running errands. :HD:

Jim, Thanks for bringing this in. I find some pretty glaring flaws as well; not the least of which is the fact that they used the All Star gear used by ... Little League. I was shocked when I read that they test it at 60 MPH well, now I know why. Skeet shooter? What? There are no JUGS machines available near to Kettering U? I'm also wondering how the flatter traditional mask (Nike Titanium?) would hold up to direct shots in a test like this. (but please, lose the skeet shooter!) Thanks again! :HD:

Attention! Colorado High School Baseball Umpires Association (CHSBUA), Denver District 1 will hold Rules Study Classes for new umpires beginning on January 5. Classes are required for new umpires or those who wish to become CHSAA certified. Meetings / Classes will be held on the following dates: 2009: Jan 5, 7, 12, 14, 19, 21, 26, and 28 Location: Denver Elks Lodge, 2474 West 26th Avenue, Denver (near I-25 and Speer) Time: 7:00 PM Test-New Umpires Only: Jan 28 7:00pm Denver Elks Lodge Field Clinics (Mandatory For new Umpires) Location and Time to be Announced at a Later Date Plate Mechanics Clinic: Jan 18 8:00am Boys & Girls Club, Cope Branch, Denver (8th Ave. & Inca St.) JV/Lower Selection Meeting Feb 2 5:30pm Denver Elks Lodge New umpires and Mentors at 5:30 You must be in attendance to accept game assignments. Regular CHSBUA meetings Feb 2 7:00pm Denver Elks Lodge New rules and Test hand-out Master Clinic Feb 22 7:00am-12:30pm Thornton HS Lead Clinician: Jim Evans Mar 2 7:00pm Denver Elks Lodge Test return and Rules study Mar 16 7:00pm Denver Elks Lodge Rules Study; Area Nominations Mar 30 7:00pm Denver Elks Lodge Rules Study

First of all, I don't bring a ruler onto the field with me. If 1 or 2 inches off the bag is acceptable, then why not 3, or 4 or 8? He had 'im by a mile anyway, right? What player wouldn't begin taking advantage of that? As a former player, I know that I'd be tempted to get a bit more off the bag, just in case the B/R is fast. What the heck, right - ol' Blue's going to give me the call because R1 is a fat slob jogging his way to 2B. So what happens when the teams change sides? Hey, now their F4 is only a few inches off, since I gave the other team that call, it's only right to give one to the other team. This is the slippery slope I'm talking about. Where does it end? Here's my experience with this sort of thing. In 1995, (yeah, 13 years ago) I stuffed a call up a team's arse. Thought they had it coming, since the head coach was griping about the zone in Game 1. Then Game 2 comes around, and now I"m on the bases, and they're griping - being chippy. I gave them an FYC on a play at first base; it wasn't terribly close, not what I'd call a banger... but my timing was way too quick, but I didn't care (ethics, anyone?) - their runner was out - the ball beat him (and yes, it did beat him, so I made the call 'Out', since "everyone" knew they had him). Problem was, as F3 steps off the bag, he's bobbling the ball. But it's my call, and he's out. I don't blame them for coming unglued, I would have, too - it was pretty clear what I had done. So my FYC just made things even worse. I've replayed that play over and over since 1995, I kid you not. It sickens me every time I think about it. Well that's my motivation. These days, if a runner is out, he's out. If he's safe, he's safe. I don't take into consideration what time it is, whether Team A is ahead by 19 runs, or whether I don't like the color of their uniforms, or whether or not some kid is 6,000% less talented than the All Star of the team who's dating the head cheerleader and who has a guaranteed full boat ride to USC. I don't take that into consideration, because doing so tilts the field. I'll say it again: I do not agree with, nor do I like 'neighborhood calls'. Any umpire that uses them, that's his business. But I do not. Oh, and I don't work games solo. That's another topic, anyway. It shouldn't matter if your crew is 2 or 6. You see a tag? Call him out. As for me, all I'll have left when I'm done working games is the integrity that I brought into it. /end of rant

Well Pete, we disagree. And today is still Tuesday, and neither your nor I will lose any sleep over this. You know, baseball used to have lots of traditions. Some good, some bad. Any call I make is done with 100% integrity of what I'm seeing happen. 128 feet away on a steal of 2nd? I give it my best call. Yes, if it appears to me that the ball beat the runner, then I'm going to have an out. This is not a comparison for "close enough". If both teams are getting "hosed" as you say, then it seems to me that an accounting system would be needed to ensure that there are an equal number of calls against each team. That's a bit laborious, and IMO, can only lead to a bad situation (recalling the concept of many lies being used to cover one). So getting the call right is overhyped, is it? If that's the case, why have umpires at all? That's a slippery slope, IMO. And there is a big difference in the concept of getting a call right and asking for help. But, like I said, we disagree. The sun will come up tomorrow. If it doesn't it's going to be darn cold. :P

Ditto to Mike and Stan. Too many vendors/retailers these days don't take the time to listen to the input from their customers. (Remember the digital hand-held Phaser/Indicator that was featured on the other forum...) :P

I've heard some guys same similar things. Then, out of the other side of their face, they brag about what a "consistent" strike zone they have. For the love of all that is holy, I do not understand this. If it's a strike call the thing a strike! If it isn't, well, you know... :rantoff:

See, and here is where I have a problem with this sort of thing; both ethically and experiential (for the umpire). I would have to ask this "must wiser umpire" which he thinks is worse: Making a call ("giving a call") that never really happened, or CHANGING your call because you were somehow convinced otherwise. If you don't have the call on your own, then get some help - there's no shame in that. The concept of "I've got to get this out" is BS. The DEFENSE makes the out - the UMPIRE is there to confirm it. To me, this is little different from a man who tells a "little white lie"; just one. But then he tells 17 to cover for the one that he originally told. The outs will come. But why can't they just be called (safe OR out) as they happen? Why do some umpires feel the need / desire to inject their own selves into the game? Sure, we're all human, we all make mistakes, but these things are not mistakes.

I do not use this "mechanic" (a strange thing to call this sort of thing, IMO) and I do not like it.

I don't like the patent-leather look around the toe area.

I'm a Red Sox fan. Have been since about '65. :confused:

This was the Red Sox v. Rays game on Tuesday night; I was listening to it on MLB radio. There wasn't much to it, really - a ball got loose from the (Sox?) bullpen, just as the Sox pitcher was delivering. The ball had rolled in toward the infield, moving near the F6 position. Tropicana Park has those open bullpen areas along the 1B and 3B lines. Jerry Meals was 3B umpire and he called 'Time'. Terry Francona came out to question what the story was, and he quickly returned to the dugout. I would have handled it in the same fashion - it's really all you can do - you've got to stop play ASAP, otherwise, letting a play go in that situation, and where the ball was, you could end up with a real problem if the batter hits a ball that goes into the same area as the loose ball - - what do you do then? If the batter had hit a home run - too bad, so sad - time was called. (Ed Hochuli, anyone? Similar sitch in the NFL this past Sunday, Broncos v. Chargers... Broncos got a lucky break on a quick whistle). Here's the story from RedSox.com:

Wow, $67+ ... of course, the real bidding will come in the last 5 minutes. I wonder why the seller talks about a "Buy It Now" option and there's not one available...?

Actually, I voted for the Dbacks.... don't know what I was thinking there...

PFFFFTTT!! Who's voting for the METS?!? They should change the name from "Shea Stadium" to "Crater Town, USA".

I'm trying to figure out why it matters who wins the NL pennant... :confused:

This could also be placed in the thread about umpires who can't run the game correctly due to their age or physical impairments. There's a guy in our association that's been around for 45+ years; he's in his 70s now, and is a real stick in the mud when it comes to changes in the rules. He's a nice guy, but of course, that and $2.50 will get you a short latté at Starbucks. As for umpiring, well, he just can't get around the field anymore. I've had a couple of double headers scheduled with him - and interestingly, on both occasions, the 2nd game wasn't played. Of course, on both occasions, he insisted on taking the stick. That's fine, he's senior and all that, so I defer. To him, I'm just a "kid". A 50 year old "kid". In the first game, the guy RARELY made his way up to 3B on a rotation. At one point, I've got a call at 2nd on a B/R double, I'm in position near the cutout, but the SS cuts off the throw and tries to get R1 into third. I turn with the ball, and "Old Charley" is STILL making his way up the line - just a tad over 1/2 way, maybe 2/3 of the way up the line, and is nowhere near in position to make the call. Luckily, F6 threw the ball up high to F5, and R1 slides in underneath a late tag. Of course, my partner gives me this angry look as though I'm supposed to have been there to make that call. Thank goodness the game was a blowout. We only went 5 innings, and the second game was canceled due to twilight setting in, and they pushed the game to the next day (Weekend tournament). In the next outing, my "pal" wants the stick again. Fine. Defer. It's FREEZING cold out - this is mid April. We start the game, and as usual, nothing of an agricultural nature stands a chance with him behind the plate. By the start of the 2nd inning, a few snowflakes start to fall. By the end of the 3rd, it's a freakin' BLIZZARD. I'm looking in from the B, as B1 slashes a hard 2-hopper - right at me - but I can't see this thing coming until - WHOA! I've got no other way to move except - UP. And I am severely challenged when it comes to moving vertically. Lucky me, the ball stays down low on the hop; had it bounced up at all, I'd have been singin' in the Vienna Boys Choir, or I'd have taken in right in the chops. So the game goes on, still a blizzard, and mercifully, the top half of the 4th comes to an end. I jog in, "Hey, 'Old Charley'", I inquire, "What do you think, should we wait until we can see the ball? I'm hearing complaints from the infielders about visibility; I'd hate to see the third baseman or pitcher get clocked because of this snow." His response was incredible: "Oh, I don't know, I think we can get another 1/2 inning in, let's keep going." Midway through the last 1/2 of the fourth, it's a white out - no exaggeration at all on that. The snowflakes are HUGE - and wet. I'm covered from head to toe - but only only my backside - with snow. Worse yet, the wind is blowing so hard that the snow is going SIDEWAYS - and you guessed it - right in toward home plate. Even in the B or C, I can't even see the ball leave the pitcher's hand, let alone see the ball come off the bat. Batter, catcher and UIC are just some shadowy figures, even though they're only 100 feet away. Every "ping" from bat meeting the ball was cause for my arms to come up in front of my face, just in case. Finally - common sense enters the picture, when both coaches come out and basically TELL HIM that they want to stop and wait. Thank goodness (again) - the snow kept falling so hard it was now accumulating on the field. We waited maybe 1/2 hour to 40 minutes, and there was easily 1" to 2" of snow on the field, and the game was called, as was the second game. This guy, nice guy that he is, is simply too old to get around the field anymore, and his lack of concern for the safety of the players has made me definite about not working with him again.

And this is what I mean by stating my confusion here, with there being an intermediary (in this case, the assignor) having the responsibility to file the ejection report. In my state, filing the ejection report is the sole responsibility of the umpire that did the ejecting. And based on our HSAA's policy, the reports are due in to the HSAA "immediately". (e.g., as soon as possible after the conclusion of the game). There's no requirement to involve the assignor, but I do that just as a courtesy, which is just a telephone call to him.

I'm chuckling over the Yankees being an option! :confused:

And I agree with that approach, and I do that as well (verbally), but your assignor has the right to withhold the ejection after it's been made? :confused:

Ejection reports are sent to your assignor? That's pretty weird - why the intermediary? That makes no sense to me. In my association, we have several assignors, and games can be assigned by any of them to any (qualified) umpire. When it comes to ejection reports, our HSAA instructs officials to notify the HSAA directly. If a coach is ejected, then the HSAA is notified, and the official is required to contact the school's AD the next morning. Nowhere in the Ejection Procedures are we umpires instructed to inform the assignor. As a courtesy, I will let the assignor know of the ejection, but that's just to keep him in the loop, so that he isn't caught off guard should the offending coach call him to complain. And again, I typically do this out of common courtesy to the assignor.

ND was pretty impressive against Michigan last week, though - I think they've got some upcoming opponents worried.