Bad spot...

[James Walker]

I had a situation come up last night and would like some feedback on how I could handle it better, since I already know I messed it up.

After the 14u game I had the ejection in, I was in the umpire room changing out of my gear. I had already told my partner to go home (strike one on me), so I was by my self packing my gear up. The head coach of the team whos coach was dumped walked in (he is also an decent umpire and I had been working with him to help him improve, but he's got a ways to go). I asked him nicely to please step out of the room, cause we weren't talking about the game. He refused and started in on me.

Him: I've never done this, but you cost us the game!

Me (calmly): coach, I didn't cost you nothing.

Him: your zone was really tight. My pitchers couldn't get in a rhythm cause you wouldnt give them nothing. The other coach even said it.

Me ( a little irritated). Coach, I called the same zone as always (one in, two out, letters to knees). It's not my responsibility to get the pitchers in a rhythm, its yours.

Him: you have no idea how to umpire, these kids aint pros, you can't squeeze them like that.

Me ( this is strike two on me): if you think you can do better, you take the plate tomorrow ( supposed to work a game with him tonight) and I'll tear your zone down and tell you how much you suck!( should've never said that).

After that I left and went home. I filled out my ej report and also another report for what happen in the changing room after the game. I put equal blame on us both as he started it, but instead of doing what I should have (keep my mouth shut and leave), I continued the conversation.

Okay guys, I know I messed up, badly, so please don't beat me up too bad. But are there any other ways to handle this then keep quiet and just leaving?

[maven]

You were right to say that you wouldn't discuss the game with him. The mistake was then to discuss it! But you know this.

 

If I had been in your shoes and the guy was someone I knew, I would just ignore him until he left. If he gets angry/loud/belligerent, I'd warn him that I was calling 9-1-1 and then do that if he did not leave immediately.

 

Had it been someone I did not know, I would have left or called the police immediately. If something happens in that room, who will be your witness?

 

Sounds as if you already know what you did wrong...you've left me no room for bashing!

[HeadHunterLA]

My standard line is:  Coach, the game is over and I am not discussing anything further.  I then go about my business and ignore him.  If at any point I feel threatened in any way I reach for my cell phone and let the offender know that I am calling 911.

[James Walker]

Sorry maven, I know I took the fun out of it. But I'm probably harder on myself than yall could be, and I beat myself up pretty bad on this one.

[James Walker]

I think it totally caught me off guard when he told me its all my fault he lost. I've known him since I was little. I've coached with him, worked with him, went to battle with him and even picked him up when he would miss a call. For him to go completely two face on me got me on my heels.

Guess the sayings right:

Once a rat, always a rat.

[BigUmpire]

“Familiarity breeds contemptâ€

[HeadHunterLA]

I think it totally caught me off guard when he told me its all my fault he lost. I've known him since I was little. I've coached with him, worked with him, went to battle with him and even picked him up when he would miss a call. For him to go completely two face on me got me on my heels.

Guess the sayings right:

Once a rat, always a rat.

 

Yeah, that was really bush league on his part.

[th3]

“Familiarity breeds contemptâ€

thats the truth for sure!

[BigUmpire]

Coaches should umpire in the same league.

Umpires should not coach in the same league.

[James Walker]

Coaches should umpire in the same league.

Umpires should not coach in the same league.

I totally agree, but I'm just an umpire. I've got no say in how they operate. I was the UIC here until they wanted someone who would play there game and not do things the right way.

[Mad Mike]

I am impressed you actually have a changing room! What a nice perk. Alot of people here mentioned using the cell phone to call 9-1-1. However, if it was not serious enough to warrant a call to the police, what about calling your assigner or league president? Put the call on speaker phone. This does two things: 1) You have a witness who can hear what is going on, and 2) it hopefully diffuses the situation to where the guy leaves-especially if the assigner/president and the coach know each other and/or the coach gets assigned games by the assigner/president. The assigner/president might just be able to think clearly in the moment and tell the coach you are not going to discuss the game and it is inappropriate for him to be questioning you!

[upnorth928]

I wouldn't be helping, or working anymore games with, "Richard Cranium".  Who needs enemy's if this is a friend?

 

[BigUmpire]

I wouldn't be helping, or working anymore games with, "Richard Cranium".  Who needs enemy's if this is a friend?

 

That is a "NoSH*#ter"!

[carolinablue]

We have had a couple of threads lately about post game confrontations and they all have one thing in common. The umpire that is being confronted is still there after the game. I know you had to change and normally that is fine but in a game with an ejection or high tempers , I say get the Hell out of Dodge. Stop somewhere down the road and change or if you live close drive on to your house. It may be a pain but it's better than a post game confrontation with a coach where you are going to end up doing or saying something you regret.

 

Since he is an umpire ( and I use that term lightly here ) and you have to work with him, at least it would have bought some time for everyone to cool down. I bet he will be apologetic at your game when he knows it's his turn to get back there.

 

Also. Kudos to you for doing your job and tossing a fellow umpire that needed to go.

[BigUmpire]

We have had a couple of threads lately about post game confrontations and they all have one thing in common. The umpire that is being confronted is still there after the game. I know you had to change and normally that is fine but in a game with an ejection or high tempers , I say get the Hell out of Dodge. Stop somewhere down the road and change or if you live close drive on to your house. It may be a pain but it's better than a post game confrontation with a coach where you are going to end up doing or saying something you regret.

 

Since he is an umpire ( and I use that term lightly here ) and you have to work with him, at least it would have bought some time for everyone to cool down. I bet he will be apologetic at your game when he knows it's his turn to get back there.

 

Also. Kudos to you for doing your job and tossing a fellow umpire that needed to go.

As most of you know I advocate " Distance equals safety" BUT we have an umpires room and treat it like Ft. Knox.

This coach/ umpire MUST be removed from umpiring.

He needs s stearn warning at a minimum.

[NFUA_44]

James,

You can't argue with silence. Go back to your OP and stop when you tell him your not going there.  As you pointed out yourself, you continued the argument and provided fuel for the fire.  I would have to say I probably would have responded in much the same manner, mainly because it is someone I know, trust, and work with, who should damn well know better.

 

At the same time, I know better, and you just taught yourself a valuable lesson.  You also helped to make sure it doesn't happen again by getting on here and talking about it.

 

Just stop and think about how different it would have been if you'd just shut down after your initial warning.  It's almost like the hillarity that can ensue when the fans try to ride you and you ignore them 100%, some of the crap they say is nothing more than trying to provoke a reaction from you.  I will almost bet it's the same way with your coach/umpire guy.  Next time you see him, just act like nothing has happened and when he gets around to apologizing, you can smile and give him a whack in the head.

[umpcoachfather]

I'd think about being at every game he ever has, take notes and then show him how horrible he was after the game. 

[ricka56]

How did the game next game go?...details, details

[James Walker]

They took me off the game we had together and moved me to another field (better game). I got to the park early (as always), and watched the first hour or so of his game. Nothing bang-bang, but he did miss a touch of second and called two balks wrong (fielders balk and throwing to unoccupied base). Coaches got on him pretty bad, I would've felt bad if he wasn't such a a-hole.

When I was getting dressed for my game, the president came in and apologized to me about the incident. He had been in the office next door and heard everything, and by the time he got over there to see what the commotion was about I had already left. I apologized for losing my cool, but he said I had nothing to apologize for. No disciplinary action for me, but he has no games left (coaching) and this was to be his last game working. His team is in first, so they took the allstars away and he won't be allowed to coach next year.

[James Walker]

I wouldn't be helping, or working anymore games with, "Richard Cranium".  Who needs enemy's if this is a friend?

 

Definitely not a friend, and I sure as hell ain't stepping on a field to work with him ever.

[bleacher_bum]

They took me off the game we had together and moved me to another field (better game). I got to the park early (as always), and watched the first hour or so of his game. Nothing bang-bang, but he did miss a touch of second and called two balks wrong (fielders balk and throwing to unoccupied base). Coaches got on him pretty bad, I would've felt bad if he wasn't such a a-hole.

When I was getting dressed for my game, the president came in and apologized to me about the incident. He had been in the office next door and heard everything, and by the time he got over there to see what the commotion was about I had already left. I apologized for losing my cool, but he said I had nothing to apologize for. No disciplinary action for me, but he has no games left (coaching) and this was to be his last game working. His team is in first, so they took the allstars away and he won't be allowed to coach next year.

This probably hurt him worse than anything you could of said or done to him.  It's been my experience that this is the main reason a youth coach looses it during a game or in the course of a season.  They put pressure on themselves to coach the all-star team.  "If you aint first, you're last" mentality, instead of teaching young kids how to play the best sport ever invented.  I've coached A LOT of years, and can honestly say, that when I first began coaching, I felt the same way.  Over the years tho, I've come to realize that its more important to teach the game than try and win 'em all.  Some coaches will learn it later than others....be patient, some of us grow up.

[SoCal Lurker]

 

They took me off the game we had together and moved me to another field (better game). I got to the park early (as always), and watched the first hour or so of his game. Nothing bang-bang, but he did miss a touch of second and called two balks wrong (fielders balk and throwing to unoccupied base). Coaches got on him pretty bad, I would've felt bad if he wasn't such a a-hole.

When I was getting dressed for my game, the president came in and apologized to me about the incident. He had been in the office next door and heard everything, and by the time he got over there to see what the commotion was about I had already left. I apologized for losing my cool, but he said I had nothing to apologize for. No disciplinary action for me, but he has no games left (coaching) and this was to be his last game working. His team is in first, so they took the allstars away and he won't be allowed to coach next year.

This probably hurt him worse than anything you could of said or done to him.  It's been my experience that this is the main reason a youth coach looses it during a game or in the course of a season.  They put pressure on themselves to coach the all-star team.  "If you aint first, you're last" mentality, instead of teaching young kids how to play the best sport ever invented.  I've coached A LOT of years, and can honestly say, that when I first began coaching, I felt the same way.  Over the years tho, I've come to realize that its more important to teach the game than try and win 'em all.  Some coaches will learn it later than others....be patient, some of us grow up.

 

 

Which is a reason not to simply award the allstar team to the coach of the team that wins . . . kudos to the league for taking it seriously and imposing meanigful consequences.

[BigUmpire]

They took me off the game we had together and moved me to another field (better game). I got to the park early (as always), and watched the first hour or so of his game. Nothing bang-bang, but he did miss a touch of second and called two balks wrong (fielders balk and throwing to unoccupied base). Coaches got on him pretty bad, I would've felt bad if he wasn't such a a-hole.

When I was getting dressed for my game, the president came in and apologized to me about the incident. He had been in the office next door and heard everything, and by the time he got over there to see what the commotion was about I had already left. I apologized for losing my cool, but he said I had nothing to apologize for. No disciplinary action for me, but he has no games left (coaching) and this was to be his last game working. His team is in first, so they took the allstars away and he won't be allowed to coach next year.

"Actions have consequences"

Bumper sticker.

[mstaylor]

 

 if you think you can do better, you take the plate tomorrow ( supposed to work a game with him tonight) and I'll tear your zone down and tell you how much you suck!( should've never said that).

 

This is the only part of the conversation that you should have left out. Generally the other part should not happen but you said you knew him so I can see how  it started. 

[blue23ll]

This guy should not umpire anymore either. Probably the worst thing you can do as an umpire who coaches is to criticize your fellow blues. I found that I could not do both, so I retired from coaching.

 

As for what was said in the umpire room, I was given some advice a while back, and I try to follow it to this day, "they can't use what you don't say against you".