Should have run him.

[Vegas]

12U game, 1st Inning. I'm the PU - close play at the plate. Called the kid out, from what I could see, ball left the catchers mitt as he was pulling the ball up to show me he had the ball. Coach goes nuts, I advise him to stop, explaining what I saw, and the game goes on. The next inning, I have a check swing I call a strike, 1st base coach (who isn't the problem guy) appeals, partner says he didn't go, and we play on. Coach yells "Look, that guy's paying attention to the game - you aren't!" I take off the mask and give him a stern warning of "That's enough." The inning ends, I go up to him and tell him this is a youth league game, and no one needs to show anyone up, and he responds "You're horrible - you got a date or something? You're cheating the kids." and walks off. He snipes and says some things throughout the game that I can't pick up, but tries to stare me down as he passes every half inning.

Looking back at it - I should have ran him after the date remark, but I didn't. Am I justified at totally kicking myself and not tossing him?

[UmpIowa]

12U game, 1st Inning. I'm the PU - close play at the plate. Called the kid out, from what I could see, ball left the catchers mitt as he was pulling the ball up to show me he had the ball. Coach goes nuts, I advise him to stop, explaining what I saw, and the game goes on. The next inning, I have a check swing I call a strike, 1st base coach (who isn't the problem guy) appeals, partner says he didn't go, and we play on. Coach yells "Look, that guy's paying attention to the game - you aren't!" I take off the mask and give him a stern warning of "That's enough." The inning ends, I go up to him and tell him this is a youth league game, and no one needs to show anyone up, and he responds "You're horrible - you got a date or something? You're cheating the kids." and walks off. He snipes and says some things throughout the game that I can't pick up, but tries to stare me down as he passes every half inning.

Looking back at it - I should have ran him after the date remark, but I didn't. Am I justified at totally kicking myself and not tossing him?

I toss after the check swing and the "Look, that guy's paying attention to the game - you aren't!" comment. He was warned the previous inning after he went nuts with the call at the plate. That is my opinion.

[scrounge]

I can see not running him earlier, depending on the timing of the comments and your tolerance that night, but not a chance after the "you're horrible" stuff. Even if you initiated the conversation, he directly insulted you and accused you of bias. Intolerable.

And why is your partner ruling on an appeal from a coach, when you already called it a strike? That didn't help matters much.

[JaxRolo]

Once you call a strike you never ever call for an appeal. Only on a check swing that you call a "ball" or say "no, he didn't go" would you appeal.

And yes he should have been long gone!

[mstaylor]

You have a classic case of,"I should have tossed him" syndrome. If you leave thinking you should have dumped him then you should. I agree that he goes at you're horrible.

[Mr Umpire]

Yeah, he should have been tossed anywhere along the way after the plate play.

But, why is an appeal being made after a strike call? Worse yet, why is a strike being changed to a ball call? Neither one should have been done but the second one is against the rules. Once a strike is declared, no appeal should be made and it cannot be changed to a ball call per the rules.

[mstaylor]

Exactly right, once it is called a strike then it is what it is.

[Thunderheads]

The next inning, I have a check swing I call a strike, 1st base coach (who isn't the problem guy) appeals, partner says he didn't go, and we play on. Coach yells "Look, that guy's paying attention to the game - you aren't!"

RIGHT THERE IN BOLD..... buh-bye!! :wave:

[alcrisp]

The coach should have been ejected when he decided to make things personal when he said you are horrible. Anytime the coach uses any form of the personal pronoun "you" in reference to you, he just punched his ticket for an early beer...unless of course he says, "You are a terrific umpire." Try to nail that quickly because if you don't then it's going to be a long game for you. Good job on trying to defuse things before the horrible comment.

[Guest]

1) "You're horrible" - ejection

2) Classic case of trying to be too nice. While I agree with your disposition, especially that some people take 12U ball and below way too seriously, there was no reason for you to have gone to talk to the coach. The conversation between the two of you should've ended at "that's enough" (until this moron popped off again, which I plate at 'higher than likely')

[dumbdumb]

Al Barlick-HOF-on ejections

Barlick often told his umpires,"Though it's very bad to eject a player when he shouldn't be ejected, it's far worse to keep someone in the game who should be ejected."

By not penalizing the coach you are condoning his actions and verbal insults. This leads him to believe this is acceptable conduct for you next time, or when dealing with other umpires, if you let him off the hook. Believe me, he will say to the umpire who ejects him for this, "Vegas didn't eject me for that, Why are you ejecting me for that?"

If you would get in trouble in your area for ejecting a coach for this, and they would put the blame on you rather than him, good luck. You will have to make a decision to keep working and put up with the insults, umpire in another area, or quitting.

Remember, there is no where in the rulebook that says you have to put up with this type of unsportsmanlike conduct. Just the opposite is in the book.

[HokieUmp]

[Another ugly story involving a coach who's a jerk....]

Looking back at it - I should have ran him after the date remark, but I didn't. Am I justified at totally kicking myself and not tossing him?

Yes.

(And although you've already been hit with this a few times - don't appeal a strike.)

[Vegas]

Thanks for the advice and the rules clarification, guys. I should have known and tossed him. Gotta have a talk with the head of program management as well - apparently he's some big shot lawyer in town and is known for being a jerk. I have him today. We'll see how it goes. It's nice guy syndrome all over again.

[NFUA_44]

Keep everything on the field.

Once the game starts he is a coach, nothing more or less. You are the official who is designated to handle that game, which includes making sure his conduct doesn't cross the line. I have too often seen newer umpires be intimdated by who they have on their field. His status in whatever capacity outside the fence has ZERO bearing on anything in that game.

If it's Father Matthew from the local church, and he's gotta go, then he's gotta go. Work with your partner to focus on the game at hand and focus on what your trying to improve, instead of worrying about a lawyer or suit who is strolling around in a coaches box. All to often those folks feel that their status is something that can be brought onto the field, you are there to gently (at first) remind them, that the Umpiring Crew is there to manage the game, and he is there to manage his team.

As to the rest, dump him when it gets personal, you will be saving future umpires a lot of extra headaches once this guy starts to learn what is and is not acceptable on a ball field.