When is the Batter/Runner out on an IFF?

[johnnyg08]

R2, R1, zero out. 

Batter hits a high fly ball that is directly over the F6. 

The two umpire crew properly signals and verbalizes IFF as textbook as it could be. 

By rule...when is the batter/runner actually out? 

Does the verbal declaration by the umpire(s) make the batter/runner out? 

Is it once the batted ball is officially a fair, batted ball that meets the requirements of an IFF? 

Is there some other arbitrary measurement of when the batter/runner is actually out? 

Hopefully I articulated this well enough so you all understand the point I'm attempting to make. 

NFHS, NCAA, & OBR Defines a Fair Ball as and the OBR definition of an IFF
 

[Replacematt]

I know the answer, but not your point.

[noumpere]

15 hours ago, Replacematt said:

I know the answer, but not your point.

I was going to respond:

1) yes

2) what difference does it make? (Maybe I am missing something)

[Velho]

I'm guessing @johnnyg08 is taking this somewhere such as:

IFF, F2 punches BR at a) while ball is on it's ascent and before umpires verbalize IFF, b) when ball is at apex, before umpires verbalize IFF, and before INF is settled under it, c) while ball is at apex, before umpires verbalize IFF, and INF is settled under it d) while ball is on descent, after umpires verbalize IFF, and INF is settled under it

[MadMax]

3 hours ago, Velho said:

IFF, F2 punches BR at… 

Waaaaiiiitaminute. We cannot have OBS upon BR on a (pop-)fly ball, because we have yet to determine not only Fair/Foul, but Catch/No-Catch. We cannot erase the Out on the catch, and award BR 1B, unless we had CI on the ball being put into play by the bat. 

I mean, if you really want to get whimsical, and call (and EJ) F2 for malicious contact (punching the batter), his actions do not affect the flight on the ball, and whether it is Caught or Not. Now, if it is Caught, then the BR is a retired runner, and is treated as such. What that means in your odd scenario is that, again, the F2 can be culpable of MC upon him… but there’s no additional penalties (beyond the EJ) or awards to make – the Out (on the catch) stands. If it had been not-caught, and fallen for a hit, then that’s entirely different. We’d call OBS, and resolve things accordingly. 

Why’d I get so exhaustive about this? Because in an IFF situation, the B/BR is Out the moment his batted ball checks the requirements of an IFF… regardless whether or not the ball is caught or not-caught (of course, once adjudged and resulting in Fair). 

Let’s have some fun with this… say we have Bases loaded, less than 2 Outs… amateur baseball… and we have a pop-up, silo shot straight up over the plate… for the sake of argument, take Tangle/Untangle out of the equation: 

• In this, IFF called. F2 gets the brilliant idea to let it drop. Ball lands, untouched, and rolls Foul. How many Outs (on this play)? 0. 
• In this, IFF called. F2 lets the ball drop,  immediately touches it Fair, scoops it up, and touches the plate. How many Outs? 1, BR on the IFF. 
• In this, IFF called. BR, in frustration, spikes his bat, which makes contact with F2. INT called. How many Outs? 1, in this case the INT. It’s best for us to call INT and kill it. We needn’t wait to determine Fair/Foul because the BR is Out either way. 
   

[Replacematt]

2 hours ago, MadMax said:

 Because in an IFF situation, the B/BR is Out the moment his batted ball checks the requirements of an IFF… regardless whether or not the ball is caught or not-caught (of course, once adjudged and resulting in Fair). 
 

Disagree. The batter is out the moment the ball is hit--we just don't know it until all the requisite things happen, similar to a caught fly ball.

[MadMax]

2 minutes ago, Replacematt said:

The batter is out the moment the ball is hit--we just don't know it until all the requisite things happen, similar to a caught fly ball.

I concur with your assessment and explanation. 

[johnnyg08]

Now we're rolling...

[grayhawk]