Grand Slam Tournament Batted ball hits runner

[ZebraStripes]

R2 1 out.  F5 playing in for possible bunt.  BR lines the ball past F5 into R2's foot.  F6 was not in position to make a play on the ball.  

 

What should have been the call in Fed?  What should have been the call in OBR?

Edited May 8, 2015 by ZebraStripes

[Tksjewelry]

In Fed, I believe you draw an imaginary line between fielder's, if past that line, nothing, live ball. 

In OBR, if the ball was close enough for F5 to make a play on the ball, then it's nothing and live ball. If not, dead ball,  runner is out, BR gets first. 

[maven]

In Fed, I believe you draw an imaginary line between fielder's, if past that line, nothing, live ball. 

In OBR, if the ball was close enough for F5 to make a play on the ball, then it's nothing and live ball. If not, dead ball,  runner is out, BR gets first. 

​That's correct.

In practice, unless the infield is playing in (all of them) in front of the runners, I'm probably getting INT here. It's the "expected call," among other things.

In the OP, if F6 is at normal depth, this should be INT: the ball is dead, the runner is out, and other runners return. Since a DP is rather unlikely here, I'm not getting 2 outs.

[ZebraStripes]

F6 would have had to have a rocket up his butt to have fielded the ball.  F5 should have caught the liner but didn't react quick enough.  One step and he would have gloved it.  F6 had been holding the runner, strange with a right hander batting.  R2 had a huge lead due to F1 never looking back that way.  First time I've ever had one past a fielder to even wonder if I got something right on this one.  The next game the R2 was hit in the foot in front of F6 so it was a no doubter.

[Jimurray]

​That's correct.

In practice, unless the infield is playing in (all of them) in front of the runners, I'm probably getting INT here. It's the "expected call," among other things.

In the OP, if F6 is at normal depth, this should be INT: the ball is dead, the runner is out, and other runners return. Since a DP is rather unlikely here, I'm not getting 2 outs.

​I don't understand your logic Why would you misapply the rule in practice? 

[maven]

​I don't understand your logic Why would you misapply the rule in practice? 

​I don't understand your question. I don't recommend misapplying it.

[Jocko]

you working for Jesse?

[Blueump]

​That's correct.

In practice, unless the infield is playing in (all of them) in front of the runners, I'm probably getting INT here. It's the "expected call," among other things.

In the OP, if F6 is at normal depth, this should be INT: the ball is dead, the runner is out, and other runners return. Since a DP is rather unlikely here, I'm not getting 2 outs.

Does a double play need to be likely for the B/R to be called out or is he out if the fielder could have and most likely would have thrown him out had the interference not occurred? Wouldn't you have the runner out for interference AND the batter/runner out if you judged he would have been thrown out?

[noumpere]

Does a double play need to be likely for the B/R to be called out or is he out if the fielder could have and most likely would have thrown him out had the interference not occurred? Wouldn't you have the runner out for interference AND the batter/runner out if you judged he would have been thrown out?

​Yes (although FED might use the word "possible" sometimes).

 

No.

 

[maven]

FED ill-advisedly uses the word "possible" in the rule addressing whether to call the BR out for another runner's INT. A DP is always possible in some sense of that word, but we should not always call a DP.

FED wants the bar lower than OBR's "willful and deliberate attempt to break up a double play," but presumably not so low that every act of runner INT results in 2 outs. So we have to interpret "possible" somehow: some folks like "plausible," some prefer "likely." Where OBR asks us to judge intent, that's clearly not part of the rule for FED.

[Blueump]

So R2 with one out. BR hits an easy ground ball to F6.  R2 collides with F6 as he begins to throw to first base. Of course you call an immediate dead ball and declare R2 out.  But, since there was no way they would have turned a "double play" on the ball, but a typical throw from F6 would have retired the BR, do you call the BR out as well?

I'm just trying to grasp this whole thing...

[maven]

So R2 with one out. BR hits an easy ground ball to F6.  R2 collides with F6 as he begins to throw to first base. Of course you call an immediate dead ball and declare R2 out.  But, since there was no way they would have turned a "double play" on the ball, but a typical throw from F6 would have retired the BR, do you call the BR out as well?

I'm just trying to grasp this whole thing...

A double play was not likely with R2 only, so I'm not getting 2 outs on that one.

With R1 & R2, a slow roller to F6 plus runner INT will not yield 2 outs, because a double play was not likely (on a really slow one, they're lucky to get one out). But if it had been a "double play ball," then yes, I'll get 2 on that. Any benefit of the doubt to the defense.

[noumpere]

So R2 with one out. BR hits an easy ground ball to F6.  R2 collides with F6 as he begins to throw to first base. Of course you call an immediate dead ball and declare R2 out.  But, since there was no way they would have turned a "double play" on the ball, but a typical throw from F6 would have retired the BR, do you call the BR out as well?

I'm just trying to grasp this whole thing...

BR gets first.  Easy to grasp (now that you know)