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dumbdumb

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dumbdumb

dumbdumb

Posted
Posted

Where is the on field video????????

 

 

 

http://www.theadvertiser.com/story/sports/college/baseball/2014/05/02/sun-belt-suspends-umpiring-crew/8630217/

 

http://espn1420.com/sun-belt-suspends-all-three-umpires-from-ul-vs-tx-st-series/

 

 

http://espn1420.com/lessons-in-accountability-from-the-birds-nest/

 

short clip here-start at .34

 

http://www.katc.com/videos/robichaux-ejected-as-cajuns-lose/

 

Come on where is everbody?????????????? I see nothing here to get a suspension for the umpires. This is why travel ball and TD's rule. I thought NCAA does not put up with this crap.

I see an upset coach make an aggressive move towards the umpire, not the other way around, and now a commissioner coming down on the umpires.

What happened in the clip we did not see starting at .34??? Did the umpire make that type of aggressive move at the coach first? What in Sam's hill is this all about.

 

All that happened, was a questionable pull of the foot that the umpires got together and made a ruling and the crew chief and original calling umpire agreed to. Sometimes, just like MLB (last year without IR and now even this year with IR) the call should have been reversed and wasn't, and sometimes the call should not have been reversed but was.

 

Why did they let the coach get to the umpire who saw things differently. Why didn't the original umpire own the call after the discussion, since he and the crew chief agreed the original call should be overturned and should have been ruled the opposite to start with?? The crew chief and all the umpires got together and agreed to go with another umpires take and view on the play, right or wrong. The calling umpire and crew chief do not have to go with the 2nd opinion.

 

So why did the calling official and the crew chief let the coach get to the umpire who had a different opinion of the call, that they both agreed should now become the proper call?

 

What is going on that is missing in the clip??? Was the coach aggressively approached like it shows him doing to the umpire in the clip first??? Did the umpire curse the coach before the coaches actions.

 

Why are the umpires being treated like they get treated by TD's and coaches in travel ball?

 

Please enlighten me.   Where is the justice for the umpires. What is missing that is so bad that the umpires did. There have been several missed calls and unfavorable reversal's all over the country, right or wrong, so why are the umpires being punished. The umpire who was bumped immediately walked away. Come on, what gives.

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Majordave

Majordave

Posted
Posted

I am lucky enough to know two of the umpires-the two named as the culprits, Hudson and Fulks.  I was in their collegiate baseball association in my former state.  Both are considered to be great umpires.  Fulks is one of the few guys I have worked with who is more obsessed with umpiring than I am.  He works hard.  We traveled and roomed together at Tony Thompson's International (3-Man) camp in 2008.  I think he got the call right.  Roger Fulks is a damn fine umpire.  He stays in shape and works hard.  He helped me immensely when I first started working college ball.

 

What I gather, from reading the articles you gave us links to, DD, is that the umpires' ejection report stated that the UL coach bumped Hudson twice.  From the article and the video, it doesn't appear he was touched at all other than incidentally.  Definitely not intentional bumping and contact. In fact, Hudson looks like he might have acted as aggressively as the UL Skipper.  I'm pretty sure all 3 umpires have to file a report or sign off on the Crew Chief's EJ report.  The other two probably backed Hudson and thus are bearing the same blame when the video does not back up the report.  That is what I think.

 

My .02.......YMMV

dumbdumb

dumbdumb

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Posted

I am lucky enough to know two of the umpires-the two named as the culprits, Hudson and Fulks.  I was in their collegiate baseball association in my former state.  Both are considered to be great umpires.  Fulks is one of the few guys I have worked with who is more obsessed with umpiring than I am.  He works hard.  We traveled and roomed together at Tony Thompson's International (3-Man) camp in 2008.  I think he got the call right.  Roger Fulks is a damn fine umpire.  He stays in shape and works hard.  He helped me immensely when I first started working college ball.

 

What I gather, from reading the articles you gave us links to, DD, is that the umpires' ejection report stated that the UL coach bumped Hudson twice.  From the article and the video, it doesn't appear he was touched at all other than incidentally.  Definitely not intentional bumping and contact. In fact, Hudson looks like he might have acted as aggressively as the UL Skipper.  I'm pretty sure all 3 umpires have to file a report or sign off on the Crew Chief's EJ report.  The other two probably backed Hudson and thus are bearing the same blame when the video does not back up the report.  That is what I think.

 

My .02.......YMMV

Thanks MD

 

Not trying to argue the play. At that .34 part it obviously shows the player when everything is over, has fallen to the ground and his foot has come off by the end of his fall. That happens a lot. There is a view later, where just like MLB earlier, the player was leaning but the toe was touching when the ball hit the glove, but just briefly, but that is all you need. This is just how it looked IMHO on the screen without 18 million cameras and angles.

 

Now, personally, to start, I think the NCAA needs to come out with some standard protocol for when the umpires get together and either let the call stand, or overturn the original call. The standard should not be a preponderance of the evidence or beyond a reasonable doubt, it should be 110% sure, to make a correction even though that correction may be wrong in the end. It happens. I will assume that 110% is the standard to start with anyway, without knowing NCAA protocol.

 

Now for the possible confrontation after the call stands or is overturned needs to be addressed as is evident in this play. Either the coach gets to go chew out the original umpire who made the call and has gone and asked for help to start with, or they need to have the crew chief deal with any blowback and head the coach off if he tries to get to the original umpire or the one who had the best angle to offer an opinion that upholds the call or overturns the call. The one who says they saw the play 110% different upon being asked for help, should not have to deal with the coach. The other umpire and crew chief do not have to agree with that umpire to start with when they huddle and the crew chief should be making the final decision. Isn't that one of his calls to make in case there is disagreement and they have to huddle. So, either make the coach go to the original umpire with his grievance after a huddle situation or the Crew Chief with his grievance, but not the one who may have caused the change since it was not his primary responsibility to begin with. I would personally go with the Crew Chief handling all situations when a huddle is called for and all communication involved. If the coach tries to blow past the CC he is automatically ejected by the CC for trying to get at the others. You could go with the standard penalty for an ejection, or upon a huddle reversal and blowing past the CC to get at the other crew members, it could be the remainder of the current game plus 1.

maineump

maineump

Posted
Posted

By reading the comments here and watching the video -

Could the umpire suspensions be for 'not being truthful' on the report? I am not saying they lied, but some facts were left out of the report?

 

The NCAA does have rules governing the overturned calls. If the manager wants the umpires to confer - he must go to his dugout, then he can't argue the call that is made. It is an ejection if he does. Surprised he didn't get more of a suspension - arguing after the conference & the bump

th3

th3

Posted
Posted

By reading the comments here and watching the video -

Could the umpire suspensions be for 'not being truthful' on the report? I am not saying they lied, but some facts were left out of the report?

 

The NCAA does have rules governing the overturned calls. If the manager wants the umpires to confer - he must go to his dugout, then he can't argue the call that is made. It is an ejection if he does. Surprised he didn't get more of a suspension - arguing after the conference & the bump

It's gotta be something like this, right? Especially since all three umpires were suspended @Majordave - When you say that you think Fulks got the call right, do you mean his initial call or the final call?

Majordave

Majordave

Posted
Posted

@th3

 

I feel that Roger's initial call of out was correct. He had to have deferred to his crew chief to change it.  

 

The culture we worked in was to defer to the Chief.  Don Hudson is a very senior umpire in the organization I was in.  I think he is, or at least was, on the board of directors.  The big dogs ruled there and you had best not cross them.   Don was an instructor and evaluator for the new guys at the organization's fall development camp and at various colleges' fall scrimmages.  I had minimal dealings with him but I knew who he was and his status.

 

@maineump

 

I am not saying they lied outright but errors of omission can be construed as being untruthful thus the suspension.  

I find it hard to believe so much controversy from a no big deal call in a beat down of a game especially considering that the ejection for arguing after a crew conference is pretty much automatic.

zm1283

zm1283

Posted
Posted

By reading the comments here and watching the video -

Could the umpire suspensions be for 'not being truthful' on the report? I am not saying they lied, but some facts were left out of the report?

 

The NCAA does have rules governing the overturned calls. If the manager wants the umpires to confer - he must go to his dugout, then he can't argue the call that is made. It is an ejection if he does. Surprised he didn't get more of a suspension - arguing after the conference & the bump

 

 

@th3

 

I feel that Roger's initial call of out was correct. He had to have deferred to his crew chief to change it.  

 

The culture we worked in was to defer to the Chief.  Don Hudson is a very senior umpire in the organization I was in.  I think he is, or at least was, on the board of directors.  The big dogs ruled there and you had best not cross them.   Don was an instructor and evaluator for the new guys at the organization's fall development camp and at various colleges' fall scrimmages.  I had minimal dealings with him but I knew who he was and his status.

 

@maineump

 

I am not saying they lied outright but errors of omission can be construed as being untruthful thus the suspension.  

I find it hard to believe so much controversy from a no big deal call in a beat down of a game especially considering that the ejection for arguing after a crew conference is pretty much automatic.

 

The coach the requests the conference (In this case, Texas State's coach) has to return to his dugout and may not come back out to argue or risks ejection. 

 

The opposing coach (In this case UL-Lafayette) IS allowed to come out for an explanation after the call is reversed. That's not to say he can't be ejected, but if a call is reversed against you, you are allowed to get an explanation.

 

FWIW, I think the original out call was correct.

Thunderheads

Thunderheads

Posted
Posted

Same thing on the back end of a double play last night. Original call confirmed. No ejections. Looks like the OP here that looked correct with the first call IMHO also.

 

 

http://m.mlb.com/video/topic/63817564/v32714877/baltb-call-confirmed-at-first-in-the-5th

of course no EJ's here .......nothing to EJ for .... nice play, nice call, ...IR easily confirms .....

 

in the OP ... not so much ;)

Majordave

Majordave

Posted
Posted

@zm1283

 

You are correct sir.  UL-L coach has right to explanation.  I neglected to state that.

 

Wonder why he was out on the field though instead of over by his dugout?  Heat of the moment for all involved for sure.

dumbdumb

dumbdumb

Posted
  • Author
Posted

 

Same thing on the back end of a double play last night. Original call confirmed. No ejections. Looks like the OP here that looked correct with the first call IMHO also.

 

 

http://m.mlb.com/video/topic/63817564/v32714877/baltb-call-confirmed-at-first-in-the-5th

of course no EJ's here .......nothing to EJ for .... nice play, nice call, ...IR easily confirms .....

 

in the OP ... not so much ;)

 

come on thunder cut me a break==i found the one I really wanted from last year, one of yours by the way, but the clock was ticking. 1:57 gives the best shot and yes it led to an ejection, and with no IR last year. May or may not have led to one this year with the same result since there is IR. IMHO thought he was out last year, with or without a huddle (no huddle in this one obviously, so nothing to overturn) or IR.

 

 

 

http://umpire-empire.com/index.php/topic/54676-did-tulo-have-2nd-hurdle-doesnt-think-so/

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