Need advice

[JaxRolo]

I had this situation today. Not sure if I handled it correctly. Please advice me what I should have done.

No Outs Runner on First and 3rd. Pop up to F1 who as she tries to catch the ball falls to the ground. I see ball come out but I never saw it hit the ground. I call out on the catch.

In the meantime R3 was headed Home and F1 throws to 3rd for a double play. after the play the HC calls time and very nicely tells me that F1 dropped the ball and it hit the ground. So he ask if I could get help from BU, I get help and BU tells me that the ball definitely hit the ground.

I wasn't sure where to place the runners. I ended up Awarding BR 1st.

I put R3 whom I had called out back on 3rd.

Everyone was happy. The DT must have known that the ball hit the ground because they didn't even question the reversal.

Is there anything I should have done differently? I know I kicked it but we tried to get it right.

Edited June 28, 2010 by JaxRolo

[noumpere]

Under the "new" OBR, you do what you can to get it right. Same under FED.

Under NCAA, you eat the original call.

Since you said "she", I assume this was some version of softball. I have no opinion on the right thing to do in that case.

[calablue]

I had this situation today. Not sure if I handled it correctly. Please advice me what I should have done.

No Outs Runner on First and 3rd. Pop up to F1 who as she tries to catch the ball falls to the ground. I see ball come out but I never saw it hit the ground. I call out on the catch.

In the meantime R3 was headed Home and F1 throws to 3rd for a double play. after the play the HC calls time and very nicely tells me that F1 dropped the ball and it hit the ground. So he ask if I could get help from BU, I get help and BU tells me that the ball definitely hit the ground.

I wasn't sure where to place the runners. I ended up Awarding BR 1st.

I put R3 whom I had called out back on 3rd.

Everyone was happy. The DT must have known that the ball hit the ground because they didn't even question the reversal.

Is there anything I should have done differently? I know I kicked it but we tried to get it right.

I know this is a HTBT situation, so I really am just curious where R3 was and what she was actually doing at the time that F1 threw to 3B. I am asking because obviously F1 knew she had dropped the ball, so she threw to 3B to get a double play she knew she didn't deserve. Was R3 close to home and do you think she would have been safe there if F1 had made a play on her there? Or had she stopped or turned back toward 3B? What she is doing headed for home on a no out popup is beyond me but that's irrelevant anyway.

[catoblue]

Definitely a HTBT, but if R3 came home and scored, and the play at 3B was actually an attempt to keep R1 at 2B, R3' s run scores, leaving R1 at 2B and BR on 1B.

As to R3 running on a no-out infield pop-up, I'd have to guess poor coaching.

[JaxRolo]

Definitely a HTBT, but if R3 came home and scored, and the play at 3B was actually an attempt to keep R1 at 2B, R3' s run scores, leaving R1 at 2B and BR on 1B.

As to R3 running on a no-out infield pop-up, I'd have to guess poor coaching.

The throw to 3rd was not to keep R1 at 2nd but to get r3 out.

It wasn't poor coaching because the 3rd base coach saw the ball hit the ground then he sent her home.

Thinking back to it now Even if F1 had caught the ball R3 didnt leave the base until after I thought the catch was made. So me calling her out at 3rd was another blunder I just now realized I made during the play.

That team batting was the Home team and this happened to be the last inning and they were down 2-1. The next batter smacked the ball past the outdielder and 2 runs scored to win the game 3-2. So everyting worked out anyway.

I am just not sure if putting the runner back to 3rd was the right thing or not.

[catoblue]

If R3 touched HP during the play, then the run would score.

Since hindsight tells you R3 left after F1 touched the ball - that solidifies not putting R3 back on 3B.

[Ump29]

Since you said "she", I assume this was some version of softball. I have no opinion on the right thing to do in that case.

Why would you assume this ?

[noumpere]

Why would you assume this ?

Really?

98% of "she" who play a "bat and ball" game are playing softball and not baseball.

[Umpire in Chief]

I had a PONY pre-district tourny tournament. The #1 team has a girl first baseman (will never say firstbase person) The other team and their parents wer saying things about her. She hit 3-4 with 2 doubles and a triple, bringing in a bunch of runs. Made an unassisted double play and made another great diving catch on a line drive which was smoked up the line for what would have been a sure triple if not an in the park HR. By her second AB the other team was pretty quiet.

[PeteBooth]

I had this situation today. Not sure if I handled it correctly. Please advice me what I should have done.

No Outs Runner on First and 3rd. Pop up to F1 who as she tries to catch the ball falls to the ground. I see ball come out but I never saw it hit the ground. I call out on the catch.

I do not understand. If you saw the ball come out how could you NOT see it hit the ground unless F1 hit the ground in an upright position and the ball came out but landed right on top of her or something like that, however, if she fell forward and you saw the ball come out chances are it hit the ground.

You asked what should I have done.

I do not know what kind of mechanics you are using BUT you could have taken a quick look at your partner BEFORE making the catch / no catch call. Since your partner said the ball was CLEARLY not caught he would have given you a quick no-catch signal and then you rule accordingly.

In the meantime R3 was headed Home and F1 throws to 3rd for a double play.

I wasn't sure where to place the runners. I ended up Awarding BR 1st.

I put R3 whom I had called out back on 3rd.

Why did you call R3 out originally?

Remember the player can tag up as soon as the ball is TOUCHED not caught. Therefore, did you "line-up" the catch / no catch with R3 in mind? As soon as F1 touched the ball if R3 was on the bag she can now legally score.

As far as the BR goes that is a HTBT situation. You called Catch so chances are the BR "gave-up" and went back to the dugout. The question to be answered is this: If you didn't kick the call would the BR had made it to first base safely?

In Summary: There are certain times you can "use your partner" before making the call. Take a quick glance to see if your partner can help. If NOT then make the call based upon the most likely outcome or Evidence presented to you. Also, examine why you kicked the call to begin with so that you are better prepared next time it happens. Players catching the ball and falling down happens freqently.

Pete Booth

[cardinalfan]

I had a PONY pre-district tourny tournament. The #1 team has a girl first baseman (will never say firstbase person) The other team and their parents wer saying things about her. She hit 3-4 with 2 doubles and a triple, bringing in a bunch of runs. Made an unassisted double play and made another great diving catch on a line drive which was smoked up the line for what would have been a sure triple if not an in the park HR. By her second AB the other team was pretty quiet.

Yeah, when I was coaching high school ball, we played a team with a very attractive girl on third base. At the first comment from the dugout, I told my guys to hush because she wouldn't be out there if she wasn't pretty good.

At the same time, I'm not sure I thought so. Our leadoff guy, a quick lefty, stepped in and I gave him the bunt sign.

He laid down a nice one down the line that the girl barehanded and threw to first. My guy was safe on a banger, but it was an unbelievable play. We treated her like one of the guys from that point on!

[JaxRolo]

I do not understand. If you saw the ball come out how could you NOT see it hit the ground unless F1 hit the ground in an upright position and the ball came out but landed right on top of her or something like that, however, if she fell forward and you saw the ball come out chances are it hit the ground.

She was laying on the ground blocking my view. I saw that it came out but didn't see it hit the ground.

You asked what should I have done.

I do not know what kind of mechanics you are using BUT you could have taken a quick look at your partner BEFORE making the catch / no catch call. Since your partner said the ball was CLEARLY not caught he would have given you a quick no-catch signal and then you rule accordingly.

You can do that with a good partner but my BU was a rookie that didn't know much. He would stand there with has arms crossed looking at the stars all day.

Thats why the UIC had me do the plate during tyhis game

Why did you call R3 out originally?

Remember the player can tag up as soon as the ball is TOUCHED not caught. Therefore, did you "line-up" the catch / no catch with R3 in mind? As soon as F1 touched the ball if R3 was on the bag she can now legally score.

Like I said that was my second srew up of the play. Originally I thought she left before the catch. When I got to thinking about afterwards I realized she left after the catch..

I won't let something like this happen again.