Balk or no Balk?

[Chance]

Had this situation yesterday. Fed rules. Top of third or fourth inning, home team down by quite a lot (6-8 runs) Needless to say they were struggling to get outs. Home team starter still in game. His windup and stretch positions have been normal and consistant so far. R1, outs do not matter. He deliberately steps to mound in windup, wanting for runner to take off for second. I have nothing so far. However he then, stepping off with his pivot foot (rh pitcher) raises his arms in an overhead pitching motion simultaneously with stepping off. The runner was not fooled and he did not attempt this again as he was removed a few batters later. I have seen (and used in my day) the deliberate windup step off with pivot foot with runners on for the exact reason to see if they would take off for second. However my concern was with him raising his arms in a pitching motion. At the time I had no call as I was second guessing myself. Is this an act of deceiving the runner by raising his arms in pitching motion and should a balk have been called?

-AC

[Paperipper17]

Just read through the FED rulebook and casebook on the wind-up position and there's nothing (that I saw) prohibiting it. However, if you can rule that he started to lift his arms before stepping back with the non-pivot foot, then you have a balk, as he started his motion, then stopped it by stepping off. Any movement of the arms after the hands have been brought together is construed as starting the delivery.

[noumpere]

Is this an act of deceiving the runner by raising his arms in pitching motion and should a balk have been called?

-AC

Unless your association has removed the last part of the balk rule (sorry -- no books with me -- 6-2-5?), you should call it.

[Replacematt]

Had this situation yesterday. Fed rules. Top of third or fourth inning, home team down by quite a lot (6-8 runs) Needless to say they were struggling to get outs. Home team starter still in game. His windup and stretch positions have been normal and consistant so far. R1, outs do not matter. He deliberately steps to mound in windup, wanting for runner to take off for second. I have nothing so far. However he then, stepping off with his pivot foot (rh pitcher) raises his arms in an overhead pitching motion simultaneously with stepping off. The runner was not fooled and he did not attempt this again as he was removed a few batters later. I have seen (and used in my day) the deliberate windup step off with pivot foot with runners on for the exact reason to see if they would take off for second. However my concern was with him raising his arms in a pitching motion. At the time I had no call as I was second guessing myself. Is this an act of deceiving the runner by raising his arms in pitching motion and should a balk have been called?

-AC

There is one of two balks here. If he started to raise his arms before disengaging, then he has started his motion to pitch and interrupted it. If he disengaged before raising his arms, then he is simulating a pitching motion while not on the rubber.

[mstaylor]

Matt is exactly right, either he started his motion and disengaged or he is simulating a pitch off the rubber. Either way it's a balk.

[Astrosdawg07]

As soon as he started to move his pivot foot I've got a balk. Once he starts it he has committed in my book!

[Mr Umpire]

As soon as he started to move his pivot foot I've got a balk. Once he starts it he has committed in my book!

I think you have the "pivot" foot confused with the "free" foot.

[Penguin]

Similar to our game last night. VT down 21-1. They can't seem to make an out. Bases loaded again and HT not aggressively running bases at all. New pitcher comes in. Windup position. Brings hands together and stops - then raises both hands, brings them back down and stops again, then completes pitch. It sailed over everyones head into backstop. I call ball as I see partner speaking with pitcher. Same thing next 3 pitches and another run walked in. Finally batter bunts, beautiful as ball stops just outside batters box and catcher only has to grab ball and step on plate for final out. Had discussion with coach but just was not going to call the balk and continue walking runners home at 21-1. Home coach just smiled and nodded knowingly.

The following inning (final) we did call two balks for this on first batter. Pitcher went to stretch and no problems. He has to work out a bad habit.

[JaxRolo]

The following inning (final) we did call two balks for this on first batter. Pitcher went to stretch and no problems. He has to work out a bad habit.

Balk with no one on base?

[Penguin]

per coaches request as teaching tool

[JaxRolo]

Someone please correct me if I am wrong. But isn't considered an illegal pitch and a "Ball" awarded to the batter?

[catoblue]

You are correct, sir!

[spiritump]

it is a balk--he has to step of first then move his hands--saying this while on or near the rubber a pitcher can not simulate a pitch--it is a balk any time.

[mstaylor]

Similar to our game last night. VT down 21-1. They can't seem to make an out. Bases loaded again and HT not aggressively running bases at all. New pitcher comes in. Windup position. Brings hands together and stops - then raises both hands, brings them back down and stops again, then completes pitch. It sailed over everyones head into backstop. I call ball as I see partner speaking with pitcher. Same thing next 3 pitches and another run walked in. Finally batter bunts, beautiful as ball stops just outside batters box and catcher only has to grab ball and step on plate for final out. Had discussion with coach but just was not going to call the balk and continue walking runners home at 21-1. Home coach just smiled and nodded knowingly.

The following inning (final) we did call two balks for this on first batter. Pitcher went to stretch and no problems. He has to work out a bad habit.

In Fed the pitcher is allowed two pumps as part of his wind-up.

[Astrosdawg07]

I think you have the "pivot" foot confused with the "free" foot.

Yes I'm sorry.