Legal Wood Bat? OBR

[johnnyg08]

If you were the decider on if this bat would be legal under OBR, not necessarily MLB...but OBR-based amateur leagues. What would you decide? 

 

https://www.delanobats.com/shop/the-original-gamer?omnisendContactID=64948852d71139c9175a93a2&utm_campaign=campaign%3A+Notify+Me+Restocking+from+The+Pre-Sale+(68137c05bdb63e7adb06c420)&utm_medium=email&utm_source=omnisend

 

[Velho]

No. It's not "one piece of solid wood".

 

[MadMax]

24 minutes ago, Velho said:

No. It's not "one piece of solid wood".

Neither are Baum bats or Rawlings Wood Composites, nor are bamboo technically wood – they're grass. However, each of these I've listed are legal and thoroughly used in adult and teenage amateur wood bat leagues (such as MSBL, NABA, PerfectGame, etc.). I don't think those leagues could function without them – that's how prone to breaking homogenous wood bats are in the hands of amateurs. 

I can't speak for bonafide independent pro leagues, as they likely use the OBR rule to the letter of the law, there are plenty of amateur entities that allow wood-like bats to legally participate. 

[Velho]

7 minutes ago, MadMax said:

I don't think those leagues could function without them – that's how prone to breaking homogenous wood bats are in the hands of amateurs. 

Totally fair and valid point. I'm guessing most of those don't do F1 3 batter minimum either - i.e. they aren't strict OBR as was posited by OP. 😉

[johnnyg08]

45 minutes ago, Velho said:

Totally fair and valid point. I'm guessing most of those don't do F1 3 batter minimum either - i.e. they aren't strict OBR as was posited by OP. 😉

I think I recall writing "OBR-based amateur leagues"  

 

[Velho]

24 minutes ago, johnnyg08 said:

I think I recall writing "OBR-based amateur leagues"  

Shoosh. I'm busy.

[JonnyCat]

It has a BBCOR certification, so I would treat it like any other non-wood BBCOR bat. If the league I'm working in allows BBCOR bats, then that's all I need to know. IMO, no different than a composite or alloy BBCOR bat.

Just curious @johnnyg08, what is your reservation?

[Velho]

3 hours ago, johnnyg08 said:

If you were the decider on if this bat would be legal under OBR, not necessarily MLB...but OBR-based amateur leagues. What would you decide? 

Absent a Tournament director to kick the decision to, the thing is BBCOR certified so, while not letter of the law OBR compliant, doesn't seem like the worse thing you're going to allow in an amateur contest (that isn't likely 110% OBR in other areas).

[johnnyg08]

1 minute ago, JonnyCat said:

Just curious @johnnyg08, what is your reservation?

Thanks for your reply. 

Right now, I'm neutral, but gathering information. 

If the league was a "wood bat league" but allowed Baum...I'm unsure if that makes the BBCOR piece relevant or not. 

Those of you familiar with the DiMarini Sugar Daddy...would you say that this bat is similar to that one or different? How so? 

[JonnyCat]

7 minutes ago, johnnyg08 said:

If the league was a "wood bat league" but allowed Baum...I'm unsure if that makes the BBCOR piece relevant or not. 

I see. If it was a wood bat league, then would this be allowed? I'm not sure about that one. I'd have to lean towards no, if it was a wood bat only league. 

But I guess that would have to be left up to the league administration.

[JonnyCat]

Based on the definition, because it is not one piece of solid wood, I don't believe it would be allowed in a wood bat only league.

3.02 The Bat(a) The bat shall be a smooth, round stick not more than 2.61 inches in diameter at the thickest part and not more than 42 inches in length. The bat shall be one piece of solid wood.

[johnnyg08]

1 minute ago, JonnyCat said:

Based on the definition, because it is not one piece of solid wood, I don't believe it would be allowed in a wood bat only league.

3.02 The Bat(a) The bat shall be a smooth, round stick not more than 2.61 inches in diameter at the thickest part and not more than 42 inches in length. The bat shall be one piece of solid wood.

How do we defend the Baum bat then? That's not a piece of solid wood is it? 

And again, I'm information gathering. So I'm thankful for the engagement. 

[Replacematt]

1 minute ago, johnnyg08 said:

How do we defend the Baum bat then? That's not a piece of solid wood is it? 

And again, I'm information gathering. So I'm thankful for the engagement. 

Since this is an OBR-based league that already allows non-solid wood or bamboo bats, I would suggest looking at (even if it means retroactively defining) the criteria used to allow those. Then applying said criteria to this bat.

[JonnyCat]

1 minute ago, johnnyg08 said:

How do we defend the Baum bat then? That's not a piece of solid wood is it? 

I don't know if I can defend the Baum bat in a wood bat only league. I don't think it should as it doesn't meet the criterion.

If Baum is allowed, then it stands to reason that the Delano bat should be allowed, as well.

[Replacematt]

6 minutes ago, JonnyCat said:

I don't know if I can defend the Baum bat in a wood bat only league. I don't think it should as it doesn't meet the criterion.

It does, though, because of the note (which really creates a case-by-case exception.)

[JonnyCat]

8 minutes ago, Replacematt said:

It does, though, because of the note (which really creates a case-by-case exception.)

I get it. I guess given the wording of the note, any exception could be made by the administrators of any league.

As for @johnnyg08's question, if I was the decider, I would not allow any exceptions. It would have to be a solid piece of wood.

Luckily, not many people care about my opinion! 

[johnnyg08]

2 minutes ago, JonnyCat said:

I get it. I guess given the wording of the note, any exception could be made by the administrators of any league.

As for @johnnyg08's question, if I was the decider, I would not allow any exceptions. It would have to be a solid piece of wood.

Luckily, not many people care about my opinion! 

There are exceptions. Another notable exception is this one by Macdougal...legal. 

 

[Velho]

8 minutes ago, johnnyg08 said:

There are exceptions. Another notable exception is this one by Macdougal...legal. 

 

We've got one of those in the garage. Bought after I got tired of my son cracking ash bats.

[johnnyg08]

Just now, Velho said:

We've got one of those in the garage. Bought after I got tired of my son cracking ash bats.

Certified by the NCAA as a solid piece of wood. 

The OP bat...has that carbon fiber core that makes me rub my forehead like Columbo. 
 

[Velho]

FWIW (not sure it influences the opinion) but found this perusing the nets:

1) Cape Cod League" Players must bat with wooden or composite wood bats"

2) https://betterbaseball.com/blog/banned-bats-for-perfect-game-tournaments

The following are the only wood composite bats allowed:

Rawlings

• 5150 Composite Pro Wood WC5150
• Big Stick R243CH
• Big Stick R243CS
• VELO Composite Wood R110CV
• VELO Composite Wood R110CH
• VELO Composite Wood R110CR
• VELO Composite Wood Y151CV
• Rawlings Composite 243MBS
• Rawlings Composite 243CUS
• Rawlings Composite 110CMB
• Rawlings CompositeY151CB
• Rawlings Maple/Bamboo Composite 271 MBC
• Rawlings Maple/Bamboo Composite SL151G

Baum

• AAA Pro Maple Baum Bat (Gold & White editions)
• AAA Pro Ash Baum Bat (Gold & White editions)

DeMarini

• Models: D243, D271, I13, D110

MacDougall

• PowerWood

Marucci

• AP5 Hybrid Pro Model

Pinnacle Sports/BamBooBat 

• All models allowed

 

[Velho]

1 minute ago, johnnyg08 said:

The OP bat...has that carbon fiber core that makes me rub my forehead like Columbo. 

I hear you.

Given that it has "BBCOR certification, which stands for Batted Ball Coefficient of Restitution, is a performance standard for baseball bats used in high school and college baseball. It ensures that non-wood bats perform comparably to wood bats" makes methinks it's not getting a performance advantage from the carbon fiber core. It's more likely marketing durability related 

 

So, in summary, it's a wood bat that performs like metal bats made to perform like wood bats.

 

[Replacematt]

37 minutes ago, JonnyCat said:

I get it. I guess given the wording of the note, any exception could be made by the administrators of any league.

That's exactly the reason.

If an innovator were to find a metal alloy that duplicated the effects of wood exactly and was able to produce enough bats to test and supply MLB, MLB would allow that the minute testing was done (and maybe even mandate it.)

[JonnyCat]

24 minutes ago, johnnyg08 said:

Certified by the NCAA as a solid piece of wood. 

As a building contractor, I can tell you that is not a solid piece of wood!

Now I am a fan of laminate lumber in the construction industry, particularly Versalam beams for large headers and long spans. More load capacity and straighter than conventional beams.

As far as bats go, the note to the rule can make almost any bat legal. I get why it's there, but I don't like it. The again, I'm just grumpy in my old age!

I wonder how long the exception has been in the rule book and when was it added?

[Replacematt]

5 minutes ago, JonnyCat said:

I wonder how long the exception has been in the rule book and when was it added?

I'm digging for versions...the oldest I have found is 2000, and it was in there (slightly different wording regarding approval authority, but substantively the same.)

[JonnyCat]

3 minutes ago, Replacematt said:

I'm digging for versions...the oldest I have found is 2000, and it was in there (slightly different wording regarding approval authority, but substantively the same.)

Interesting. Thanks for that, let me know if you find anything else.