Double Tag Mechanic

[ElkOil]

2017 FED rule book, page 69, fig. F shows the double tag mechanic. There as many opinions about what this means as there are umpires, which probably means there's a lot of confusion about it. Literally every partner I've had thinks it means something different.

So definitively... what does the mechanic mean and when do you use it?

[noumpere]

With R1 and R2 ONLY (not just R2, not bases loaded, not R2, R3), on a fly ball to the outfield, PU will have any play on R2 at third,, U1 will have any play on R1 at second. R1 back to first, R2 back to second.  However, it PU is "on the line" then U1 has it all.  U1 also has all retouches of the bases  ('tag ups")by the runners.

 

If the ball is dropped in the outfield (not caught) then PU returns home and U1 has all plays on the bases.  PU is responsible to see that R1 (and R1 if it gets that far) touch third on the way by.

[Kevin_K]

It's also a good idea for PU to be communicating with his partner during the play. Whether it's covering 3B or leaving 3B for HP, U1 will likely not be facing PU and needs to know where his partner may or may not be.

[ElkOil]

4 hours ago, noumpere said:

With R1 and R2 ONLY (not just R2, not bases loaded, not R2, R3), on a fly ball to the outfield, PU will have any play on R2 at third,, U1 will have any play on R1 at second. R1 back to first, R2 back to second.  However, it PU is "on the line" then U1 has it all.  U1 also has all retouches of the bases  ('tag ups")by the runners.

 

If the ball is dropped in the outfield (not caught) then PU returns home and U1 has all plays on the bases.  PU is responsible to see that R1 (and R1 if it gets that far) touch third on the way by.

So when these conditions are present, you're signaling for IFF and the double tag?

[noumpere]

53 minutes ago, ElkOil said:

So when these conditions are present, you're signaling for IFF and the double tag?

Since the "double tag" implies the infield fly (re reverse / converse / inverse is not true), there's no reason to signal both.

 

If you want/, just starth the move by pointing up with your indexfinger before / as you bring the top fist down on the bottom one.  (ther's probably a better way to explain that)

[ElkOil]

13 minutes ago, noumpere said:

Since the "double tag" implies the infield fly (re reverse / converse / inverse is not true), there's no reason to signal both.

 

If you want/, just starth the move by pointing up with your indexfinger before / as you bring the top fist down on the bottom one.  (ther's probably a better way to explain that)

I am grateful. Thank you. I hope others were as confused as me and learned something, too.

[maineump]

2 hours ago, noumpere said:

If you want/, just starth the move by pointing up with your indexfinger before / as you bring the top fist down on the bottom one.  (ther's probably a better way to explain that)

This is what we do. The mix-up that newer umpires have, is they assume the PU is rotating on everything. We need to remind them that it is only on a fly ball to the outfield, and R2 tags on the play - it has nothing to do with the IFR.

[Stk004]

We signal the infield fly before the "double tag/I've got third if he tags" signal. I think of it as signaling a situation before signaling the possible rotation, but as long as you're both on the same page you're good to go. 

[KenBAZ]

Infield fly signal, (usually​ fist with no outs or index for one), then double tag. PU communicate on a fly ball is, "I've got third if he tags, I've got third if he tags". If R2 tags, "I've got third, I've got third".

Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk

[noumpere]

It's kind of like the "two outs, time play, I'm staying home" -- that can (and should) be done with one signal -- not three.  And, it's very quick and (almost) casual -- you don't have to look like you are landing a plane on an aircraft carrier with any of the signals.

[ElkOil]

15 hours ago, noumpere said:

It's kind of like the "two outs, time play, I'm staying home" -- that can (and should) be done with one signal -- not three.  And, it's very quick and (almost) casual -- you don't have to look like you are landing a plane on an aircraft carrier with any of the signals.

You tell me this NOW?! I JUST BOUGHT TWO FLASHLIGHTS WITH ORANGE CONES ON THE END.

[noumpere]

8 hours ago, ElkOil said:

You tell me this NOW?! I JUST BOUGHT TWO FLASHLIGHTS WITH ORANGE CONES ON THE END.

This comment belongs in either the equipment forum (where you can debate whether +POS can get them to you on time, or whether the Official's Choice brand is a good substitute or just a cheap knock-off, or wonder when Force 3 will come out with the new-and-improved model), or in the buy-sell forum (where you can try to sell them to someone for a different use)

[ElkOil]

13 hours ago, noumpere said:

This comment belongs in either the equipment forum (where you can debate whether +POS can get them to you on time, or whether the Official's Choice brand is a good substitute or just a cheap knock-off, or wonder when Force 3 will come out with the new-and-improved model), or in the buy-sell forum (where you can try to sell them to someone for a different use)

Or I'll keep them and apply for a job on an aircraft carrier.

[Richvee]

Props where props are due...At out state interp meeting, we actually went over the use of the double tag signal and the proper mechanics.