USSSA Coaches' Behavior

[JaxRolo]

The following is part of an email I sent to the USSSA HQ about a tournament we had this weekend.

Have any of that work USSSA had this type of behavior before?

"I was recently asked to Umpire some U-Trip USSSA games for the first time ever. I am an experienced Umpire that have worked T-Ball to College Games.

But what I experienced recently is not acceptable.

We were told to try our best not to eject any coaches. I didn't think much of it at the time since that is actually our goal as Umpires to try to keep the coaches in the games.

My partner and myself worked 8 games during the weekend and we were questioned on about every single pitch location. Questioned on every single close call. At times we had Head Coaches and Assistant coaches running on the field screaming and yelling.

In the championship game after the game ended we were told by the losing team how much we sucked and should not be there. Calling us names in front of the kids.

Other Umpires said that we should not bother ejecting because we would just get moved to a different field and the coach allowed to stay.

It is a shame because the kids played decent ball even though they were berated by coaches several times during the games in front of everyone.

This behavior was just not on our field but I witnessed it watching several other games.

I am sorry to rant on this but WOW! In all the years of Umpiring I have never seen anything like this."

[mstaylor]

I have worked a fair amount of USSSA tournament ball and generally they want to keep coaches in the game but that doesn't mean to let them run rampant. If the TD has that little backbone or the umpire group doesn't either, then maybe you need to pass the next time they call. I have ejected managers from a finals game playing for a national berth. If your group is not tossing because you will simply be moved to another field, then maybe the whole group needs to pass.

[Mr Umpire]

I have not experienced this behavior from any level including USSSA coaches. But, I have dealt with the pitch location issue but that was an East Cobb vs. West Cobb mentality and they don't like each other only for that fact (GA thing).

Now, I have to ask why it is the goal of umpires to keep coaches in the game? Is this some new umpire rule or protocol I haven't heard of?

Coaches come running on the field screaming and yelling with no EJs? It sounds like more needs to be done while on the field than off it. Sending this email is far too late. What will it accomplish? If you didn't deem it necessary to stop it on the field, why should some administrator who wasn't there deem it as bad behavior? They didn't see it and only get an email about it but the offenses weren't enough by the umpire to EJ, so why should they do anything about it. The email was a waste of time IMO.

If you would have been moved to another field and the coach stays, why did you take the games? If enough good umpires quit taking games, then they will get what they deserve. If this intimidation works, then it doesn't speak very well for what you did this weekend. IMO, don't take the games or EJ enough times until they run out of fields to put you on. Not my concern to keep coaches in the game. Otherwise, don't worry about sending an email afterwards unless it makes you feel better about what was done on the field.

[JaxRolo]

I have not experienced this behavior from any level including USSSA coaches. But, I have dealt with the pitch location issue but that was an East Cobb vs. West Cobb mentality and they don't like each other only for that fact (GA thing).

Now, I have to ask why it is the goal of umpires to keep coaches in the game? Is this some new umpire rule or protocol I haven't heard of?

Coaches come running on the field screaming and yelling with no EJs? It sounds like more needs to be done while on the field than off it. Sending this email is far too late. What will it accomplish? If you didn't deem it necessary to stop it on the field, why should some administrator who wasn't there deem it as bad behavior? They didn't see it and only get an email about it but the offenses weren't enough by the umpire to EJ, so why should they do anything about it. The email was a waste of time IMO.

If you would have been moved to another field and the coach stays, why did you take the games? If enough good umpires quit taking games, then they will get what they deserve. If this intimidation works, then it doesn't speak very well for what you did this weekend. IMO, don't take the games or EJ enough times until they run out of fields to put you on. Not my concern to keep coaches in the game. Otherwise, don't worry about sending an email afterwards unless it makes you feel better about what was done on the field.

This will be the first and last time that I work with this particular association. I took the games because I didn't know it was going to be that way. That is not my way of Umpiring. The reason many coaches act like they do is because Umpires let them get away with it. It is a shame. I got my check at the end of the tournament and and told the UIC not to call me again unless we were allowed to take control of the games.

[semper_fi_72]

I work plenty plenty of USSSA Games and we don't have that problem.

Below is straight from the tournament rules.

We have a ZERO Tolerance.

In 3 years I have only been on the field for three EJ of a manager or coach.

All 3 times I was the BU and my partner was the one who did the EJ.

All conversations with an umpire should be conducted after a time-out has been called and be handled in a calm and professional manner. Verbal abuse of the umpire will not be tolerated and may result in ejection from the game.

Any manager or coach ejected from the game is required to sit out the next game also. After being ejected, a manager or coach must vacate the premises of the current game and the next game in which he is suspended. Any manager caught continuing to coach after being ejected or suspended will be suspended for an additional period of time. Any player ejected from a game is subject to a one game suspension at the tournament director's discretion.

Managers are responsible for the conduct of his players and fans at all times. Managers are subject to ejection if his players or fans are out of control.

[mstaylor]

I worked an USSSA tournament where if the manager or players are ejected from a semi or final, they are out of the final and two additional tournaments. In the situation I referenced in the previous post I dumped a player in the semi for one team, the scorekeeper/coach for the same team in the final and the manager of opposite team in the final. The only question I was asked was if I felt any others should have gone.

[jjb]

I’ve workedtoo many U-Trip Tournaments than I can count, and UIC’d a World Series forthem, and I think you don’t have a U-trip problem, you have a TD problem.

To be fair,Associations don’t like to EJ coaches, fans and players: these people comeseveral hundred miles and pay a lot of money. Making them sit in their hotelroom doesn’t help when they make the decision to come back the next year. Butdisrupting the games affects the whole tournament, not just the nitwit’s team.So, it wasn’t your problem, it was the TD/UIC.

Here’s whatI told my Umpires at the WS: “I’d rather you didn’t toss anyone, but will backyou 100%. You toss him, he’s history. I’ll be wandering around all week: if youthink you’re having a problem, have the scorekeeper find me. I’ll pull thecoach aside and try and hose him down. If it works, great. If it doesn’t, dowhat you gotta do.â€

I had totalk to a couple coaches, but we had zero ejections, and everything went great.Call it Preventative TD’ing.

[JaxRolo]

I’ve worked too many U-Trip Tournaments than I can count, and UIC’d a World Series for them, and I think you don’t have a U-trip problem, you have a TD problem.

To be fair,Associations don’t like to EJ coaches, fans and players: these people come several hundred miles and pay a lot of money. Making them sit in their hotel room doesn’t help when they make the decision to come back the next year. But disrupting the games affects the whole tournament, not just the nitwit’s team.So, it wasn’t your problem, it was the TD/UIC.

Here’s what I told my Umpires at the WS: “I’d rather you didn’t toss anyone, but will back you 100%. You toss him, he’s history. I’ll be wandering around all week: if you think you’re having a problem, have the scorekeeper find me. I’ll pull the coach aside and try and hose him down. If it works, great. If it doesn’t, do what you gotta go.â€

I had to talk to a couple coaches, but we had zero ejections, and everything went great.Call it Preventative TD’ing.

you are right I should not have said USSSA problem. I think is not really a TD but a District mentality. From what I was told it happens at all the parks in the district. And you are right they pay money to travel here and try to qualify for Finals and they want them to come back.

Well, its not worth the headache. I have plenty of other work. They came looking for me and I thought I would try it. :shakehead:

[mstaylor]

Definitely a TD or staff problem. I've umpired and TDed USSSA and ejections were not plentiful but done when needed. Sorry for a bad experience.

[kylejt]

. At times we had Head Coaches and Assistant coaches running on the field screaming and yelling.

Yeah, that's just not happening. If if were me, the TD would have been the one not asking me back, for tossing every one of these knuckleheads. NOBODY runs on the field screaming and yelling at me more than once. Nobody.

Two reasons that this is happening. The TD wants the $ from the coaches, and the umpires want the $ from the TD. Fair enough. If the TD wants you to play rodeo clown, and he's got enough umpires will to do so, that's cool. His rules, his tourney, and he gets to employ anyone he wishes to make his customers happy. Heck, if he wanted to give coaches boxing gloves and have them take shots at the plate umpires, I'm sure there would be guys willing to take his money.

But at some point you have to draw the line. For me, to would be screaming, yelling and running on the field. You wouldn't do that to me at the Costco, so you'd better not do that to me on a baseball field.

[cyclonehokiece]

The lack of consequences is what gets me. In USSSA where I am working, there is no further consequences. I may talk to my tournament director about this but am still working on the message. However, I believe that ejections need to be done when necessary and consequences have to be in place in order to make coaches behave.

[jjb]

If it makes you feel better, the consequence is that you don't have to listen to him for the rest of the game.

[Umpire in Chief]

The lack of consequences is what bothers me about the whole USSSA and/or AAU system and why there are teams that are notorious for such bad behavior. Their "governing bodies" are toothless.

Not to mention the talent is now so watered down in most AAU/USSSA because there are just so many teams. Not that long ago I use to look forward to these games because these were the "elite" youth baseball programs. Now, every time little Johnny doesn't make one of the elite teams, Daddy goes and makes his own.

[mstaylor]

That is a fact UIC, travel ball used to be elite baseball, now not so much. Luckily most of the USSSA in my area is run by one group and if you are a problem at one tournament the everybody at the next six tournaments know about it. The same is true with softball. One group runs everything in the areaand even if you screw up in a local league it translates to tournaments. I know guys that have been caught loading bats or suspended for fights and it takes them out of all USSSA.

[JaxRolo]

I know some of the Travel type leagues around here the parents pay upwards of $300 a month for a kid to play. So little Johnny and Daddy and the coach get upset if they think you did them wrong during the game.

[Umpire in Chief]

I know some of the Travel type leagues around here the parents pay upwards of $300 a month for a kid to play. So little Johnny and Daddy and the coach get upset if they they you did them wrong during the game.

I actually had a parent tell me once at an AAU game tell me "We're paying a lot of money and deserve better calls than that."

It took every ounce of my being not to make a smart remark back along the lines of "For what you're paying I'd expect the kids to have some level of ability and actualy make a routine play."

[mstaylor]

I know some of the Travel type leagues around here the parents pay upwards of $300 a month for a kid to play. So little Johnny and Daddy and the coach get upset if they think you did them wrong during the game.

The same parrents throw the same fit in a LL that they aren't paying anywhere near as much. My problem isn't what the parents are paying or what tournament fees they are paying, my job is to administrate a game. What they pay, what priviliges they feel entitled to or they lack of rules knowledge, I don't care. I will still be as fair and as accomindating as usual but they are not act an ass just because it's travel ball.

[Dean]

- deleted -

was gonna post my bad experince with travel ball -

[mstaylor]

- deleted -

was gonna post my bad experince with travel ball -

Go ahead, it's slow.

[kylejt]

Travel ball coaches answer to no one. Plus, factor in that TD's want their money tournament after tournament, year after year, and I get where they don't want some umpires killing their golden geese. So, if the TD's allow their idiotic behavior, and the umpires are willing to look the other way for $, what's the problem?

So you've got a decision to make. Work the games as your employer is asking you to. Or, pull up your big boy pants, toss 'em as you see fit, THEN see what happens.

Just don't get yelled at, not eject anyone, then complain about it later. That makes no sense.

If it were me, I'd ask for extra $ NOT to eject guys. And it really depends on how desparate the TD is for umpires. Sometimes there's a glut of us, but most times not.