detailshp

Mr. Umpire: Apparently, I am sadly mistaken. Mistaken in the fact that you are flexible enough to look at other opinions and not shout them down. I wonder, then, how coaches feel after you do one of their games? Like they got run over by a train? You strike me as the kind of umpire that all the coaches I talk to HATE to have work their game. I would imagine you get lots of "respect" on the field, and carry lots of "credibility" Seriously, I am happy for you. What I do know, is that if you want to work with and umpire the best most skilled athletes in the game of baseball, you strive to work in the MLB. If their "lifestyle" and "perks" are the reason you dont want to work with the most skilled baseball players around, that is certainly your choice. I agree that not all umpires may strive to work with the best athletes. Like I have stated on a couple of threads now, I am just an idiot who likes to umpire. It amazes me that I see guys like you on all of these forums, shouting down dissenting opinions, constantly carping about how the umpire world is unfair, and how MLB umpires stink, and that the best dont work with the best, and nobody should emulate anyone except what the rulebook and the schools teach you. Then I go to camps, watch games, umpire with veteran NCAA umpires, NAIA umpires, and all levels of FED and Youth leagues, and see that everyone does it differently, and lots of guys work "at the top" ( sorry borrowing your analogy of mine that you so conviently changed ) of each level of umpiring they desire, and coaches give them tons of respect and credibility. I had mentioned earlier that the schools teach a certain way so that in times of stress, your more likely to repeat it. I am not going to tell you a lot about what I do for a living ( although my screen name may give you a hint ) but I have spent the last 15 years of my life molding young men ( and a few women) to do a certain task a certain way over and over and over again. However, about 8 years ago or so, I alo realized that maybe one of these kids might actually perform that task better and faster if he "personalized" it a little to his liking. Kinda like different batting stances, I figured in my head. I do a lot of comapring the game of baseball to my employees and their actions, and I get constant eye rolls, guess I have a certain way too. It works for me. Seriously, though, I am glad it works for you, that ability to fall back to what the schools teach you and repeat it. But, in my years of watching and umpiring baseball, I just don't see the rigid adherence to a specific mechanic or process you so greatly espouse. So, my logical brain tells me that even though the schools are trying to create a better umpire, the game of baseball is still played by boys ( and girls now, isnt that fantastic?) and umpired by human beings. ( Even though I guess Gerry West isnt much of a human being to you ) Not robots. Sometimes I think that guys like you would be happier IF the game was umpired by robots. Al the umpires I know that have reached the top of the level they want to reach, do not do it the way the schools do it. Your almost fanatical devotion to the "same mechanics, no matter what" so that you dont make a mistake takes no account into the fact that many many men and women have done a fantastic job doing it the way that is the most comfortable to them, and they have all the respect and credibility they need. What the real goal here is to get the call right, right? Without becoming the center of attention in the game? Or do you not agree with that opinion?

Just b/c we are not in the MLB does not make us any lower of an umpire. We just don't get paid as much as they do. And, to get paid that much and do lazy mechanics is ridiculous. Associations drop umpires for that same stuff b/c they want ALL of their umpires to do it correctly, including the ones at the top of their association. It is not someone at the "bottom taking shots at the people on the top". It is someone who cares enough about his avocation to want those considered "at the top" to do it correctly for their ENTIRE career. Honestly, I'll listen to Bellino before I listen to West based on what I have observed between the 2. Being in MLB does not make an umpire "at the top". There are far better ones who didn't want that lifestyle calling other levels today and when West got into it. Especially now, since PBUC underpays the umpires for what they deal with. It has been said before, "Do not emulate what you see on TV" except for Bellino's mechanics. West has shown that before with how he handled Guillen this past year. It is for a show. 30 years ago is not today. There is no comparison since the umpires have to now be trained before even being considered to go through the ranks. And, umpires do not get put in the MLB before they are considered ready for it unless a mistake was made. Comparing 30 years ago to today is not good since today's umpires are trained far better than the ones of 30 years ago. Part of why West gets away with what he does b/c he is the president of the WUA, the union which MLB umpires are part of. But, again, he shouldn't be doing lazy mechanics. I do not think "time in" should afford anyone to be lazy. West is only "at the top" of those who are currently going through the PBUC ranks b/c that is their association and he is where they aspire to be. He is NOT at the top of the umpiring ranks. Treat them better and change the lifestyle, then we may actually get to see the ones "at the top" of umpiring. It's a big world and that isn't even 1% of all the umpires out there. I doubt we will ever see more than a handful in the MLB per generation which can be considered "at the top" of the umpire profession unless things change. Ok, I read all of this and see all your points, and sounds liike a lot of sour grapes towards guys who you don't think should belong "in the show." Is that really necessary? I agree that Joe West may have a different mechanic set than a guy fresh out of Umpire school, I dont think anyone would defend him on that. Correct me if I am wrong, and I am ok with that, but wasnt there a strike that got a lot of good umpires "retired" because they made so little money "at the top" that the rate that PBUC pays guys now would have been a luxury? Wasn't he one of the guys who was around before the "lifestyle" was such a drag and umpires were paid peanuts and leftover cokes from the concession stands? Didnt he get re-hired? You really think that he's a waste even though he got re-hired after the strike? Also, I get tired of hearing from guys who say, "do it like I say, and not how you see it." Where is the magical cut-off in any career arc where how you do it isnt as important as what the conclusion is? Its hypocracy to me, but I am just an idiot who likes to umpire. This fanatical devotion to a particular method of voicing a call, moving your arms, I don't know how you can say that has to happen for you to be the best umpire you can be. I say this because I watch the LL world series ( unpaid ) Babe Ruth WS ( paid) College WS and regional tourney games ( paid ) and MLB guys ( "the top" I guess- longtime White Sox season ticket holder ) and rarely do I see one PU do it exactly like another. I sure do hear a lot of guys in clinics, camps, and guys on various forums like this constantly harp about how you have to do it a certain way no matter what, so I go turn on the TV and what do I see? Not what I hear in the camps. Seems like an incongruity to me.

It's not about respect, it's about credibility. You cannot take MLB mechanics and assume that is the right way to do things at other levels. You see guys act nonchalant, move with pitches, etc. That does not mean that is the way to do it. If a guy does stuff like that in the MiLB, he WILL get marked down. Once you're in the show, all bets are off. If a guy stays healthy, he is pretty much there until he wants to leave. There is a different standard that is applied to the minor leagues and amateur ball. Your probably right. Especially about the MiLB and the MLB. Amateur ball? Cripes I have seen so many different and worked with so many different guys at all levels the one thing that I can safely say is that no two guys do it the same. I don't think it would bother me too much if I got eval'd and was told to do something a certain way, I would most likely change it to the way they wanted it done. Ive had NCAA and NAIA tournament veterans eval me and give minor tweaks, but got good marks over-all. I dont want to come off as a guy who thinks that everyone on here is a over-demonstrative "rulebook" ump, as I have heard lots of guys talk about over the years, but I read a lot of posts on here where I think to myself, "Wow, that seems like your tossin gasoline on a fire, there, man" Maybe if I won the lottery and one of the pro schools would take a currently 42 ( soon to be 43) year old man with 10 years of FED experience and allow me to see if I conform, I might feel different. I watch the LL world series every year and marvel at how so many guys do it so differently, yet they are there with wild mechanics every year. I know, I know, its unpaid. I get that.

He had to be big on the first call because he killed it right off but he still had runners running and plays being attempted. Looking at it again, I agree. You are right. Hopefully I wouldnt have gotten yelled at too much...... You guys are all trying to make me a meaner SOB out there, arent you....LOL ( just kidding ) Seriously, though, I really dont have many arguments, or ruling situations that escalate into arguments. I can't explain it. My 5 kids are all quiet and respectful when I am around too, maybe thats it. Heck, I dont know.......My head is starting to hurt.....

LOL- is it good that an umpire would admit that he cant read the small type in a rule book? I got a chuckle out of that one, thanks.

You can disagree with West and McClelland all you want. But, it should be noted, that they are both long time MLB umpires, which is more than you can say for anyone I have read on here. Not dissing the people on here AT ALL, but its easy to be at the bottom taking shots at the people on the top. And, as I understand it, West and McClelland are generally considered better umpires than what worked say, 30 years ago. Not to say that Bellino is a poor umpire, again, hes at the top so he must be pretty dang good. I would certainly sit down in a room and listen to anything he had to say about mechanics and how to do something, and try to emulate it, as I would with ANY regular umpire at the MLB level. I also think that its not just because they have been in the league a long time that they get respect from coaches. Umpire schools teach a certain way because that they know that if they ingraine a certain behaviour into your brain, in times of stress, your likely to repeat it, instead of breaking down and making a mistake. Not because they expect everyone to be a robot. I've been an MLB season ticket holder long enough and watched enough guys at the top to know that there are a lot of different ways to arrive at the same conclusion, and how you point and shout out a call is not the real reason that you would get respect on a baseball field.

D is going to be a three base award but the ball stays live. Ok, that was what I was wondering. DDB on D and the base award comes at the end of the play. Hey, I got one right!

well, I havent been to a pro school, and too old to be considered for one, and so far on my evaluations, I havent been marked down for lackadasical mechanics. Of course I am not an NCAA umpire either. I will say, though, that I have been told that i am not that demonstrative of an umpire, but not marked down by evaluators for poor mechanics or not voicing my calls. You may be correct. I have had plenty of hot head coaches HS ranks, in the Travel ball leagues I do, and Babe Ruth and LL district, state, and regional tournaments. I don't know, never really thought about it. Now your making me think. Ouch. But, your probably right. Now I will be thinking about it the when I first start up next month, sheesh, thanks.....lol...... Thinking about it, I rarely throw managers out based on the number of games I do a year ( usually well over 150 ) fact, but I have had lots of requests by league officials and UIC's and Athletic Directors to work games. I guess maybe I just get the respect of coaches because I expect it., know what I mean? Hard to explain. After looking at the second clip, it doesnt look to me like he went over the top at all, but he wasn't gesturing wildly, and screaming at anyone. He was up the baseline pointed, gave his signals. Maybe my explanation the first time wasnt written well. Based on the plays I saw, he probably reacted more than I would have on the first clip, and we would have been very similar on the second. I don't know. Personal style I guess, and my natural reaction is not be the play, but rule on the play.

Ok, before I read all the posts, I would have said based on the original question, that only C is an immediate dead ball. If I was working a FED game and D happened, I would have had a DDB. Is this correct?

I agree with smtaylor, this rule "trickled up" I saw this play in the MLB last year with my beloved White Sox and the catcher everyone loves to hate, A.J. Pierzinsky, who actually "tricked" a defender into running into him without the ball in a run-down. I was actually at the game, and stood up and yelled, and felt like a total moron after I sat back down and remembered OBR is different than FED rules. All my family and my friends in the seats around me had a nice laugh at the "over-reaction" of a fan/umpire.

Your not an idiot. In a 36 team 18U travel ball tournament last year in the game to decide winner goes to play for the championship, I had the exact same play. The O coach went utterly ballistic when I called the batter out and called time immediately. Every cuss word in the book, PLUS a Pinella rant. On an 18U national travel ball team. TWO ejections later from the O side, play resumed and they lost, because they lost their composure and had no coach in the dugout. At least you didnt have that.

I compare this play to a ball that is hit on the baseline, and ends up being fair. We don't shout " FAIR BALL" and make huge pointing gestures and ridiculous antics. A simple point in the fair direction is enough to show people that you have ruled on the play. A simple point at the "event" and a safe signal would be enough for me. I would not need to verbalize my ruling. I'd point at the batter/catcher and signal safe, a few beats after the "play" occurred.

I just receivced a pair of Honigs low cut patent plate shoes. They have exactly the same "sole" and tread pattern of my 3 year old Pentagon low cut patent plate shoes. The rest of the shoe is completely different, and the Honigs are narrower and slightly longer than my Pentagons. Next time, its Reeboks for me.

Your additional information doesnt change my call. I still got nothing.

We dont use assignors in the upper part of the state ( indiana ) so you contract personally with the individual Athletic departments of each school. There is no mileage. If you take the game, you take the fee, and we get paid normally before the game. Depending on the Athletic Director, fees can go anywhere from 45-70, There is no rhyme or reason that I can see, its what the school is willing to pay.

It was the fake spike play: http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/miami-dolphins/sfl-dolclock121208,0,2966660.story

I looked over this stuff pertty closely, and agree with all posted on the bubble stuff and so forth. Maybe, though, the "vero beach" authority wanted something for their facility for 4-5 weeks in Jan-Feb? After the Dodgers left, they had some pretty big shoes and money holes to fill. Maybe this is nothing more than the MiLB or the MLB trying to find more and more ways to get revenue out of the Vero Beach facility.

I had this happen to me last year in a HS game. As soon as the interference was detected and he hit the ball, I gave the delayed dead ball signal. I cleared the catcher, and advanced to the edge of the dirt circle 1st base side to check for a pulled foot, and then be in proper position to call a play at the plate. After the ball went under the fence ( thats a whole nother story, lousy field) I called time and allowed the run to score. Normal end of play action ensued until the coach came out and said " what about catchers interference?" I explained the either or rule, and coach elected to trade the out for a run. Then defensive coach came out and I had to explain to him that it was offense decision, I could not force the runner back to third and award 1st base ( which is what he wanted) if offense wants the run to score. In my opinion, I would allow the result of the play to stand, unless the offensive coach came out to question it.

I'm not saying what you are doing is wrong. Timing is proper use of the eyes. Tracking the ball all the way into the glove, making a mental decision, then verbalizing your decision. Some guys think artificial means of timing means proper timing. Ummm, confused here. I guess I should have put "track the ball all the way to the mitt" wait a beat, still locked.....etc. etc...... Not getting the "artificial means of timing means proper timing." Unless of course its a "simulated ball" thwown by an "artificial life form"

I agree that its hard, but very necessary. I am a firm believer in "locking" into your crouch, whatever style you use, and not moving at all. Another method I use is on a ball call, I wait a beat, still "locked" and without moving say "ball" and then wait another beat, and then move out of my stance. Its also a good reminder to keep your timing right.

I got one of those super light Champro masks for Christmas Going to that from an old Honigs. I can't WAIT to try it out. Going from the Honigs to the Champro ( and the thinner bars too ) just feels weird to me, in trying it out at home. How long has your buddy used the Champro mask?

I've got to disagree with the "it's showing the kid up" or makes him "feel bad" thought. For those LL/youth umps that don't want to call the big strike 3 so the batter doesn't "feel bad", what about the pitcher? he just won himself a hard fought battle... I'm ringing up the 3rd for the pitcher not the batter. just my thoughts. 1 Pitchers get 20-35 batters in a typical youth league game. Batters get 3-4 at bats. No reason for a pitcher to get a big demonstrative call for a punch out any more than for me to give a ridiculous over the top huge gyration "circle the bases" hand signal and shout "HOME RUN!!!!!" when a kid hits one out.

I must be from a different era. I have never used a huge big demonstrative strike three call, with large gyrations, punchings, hooks, whatever. My normal strike call " Strike!" which is loud and not overly long or dramatic is enough for the 3rd strike, followed by the proper arm giving the traditional point. Then a normal voiced "Three.", followed by taking my extended arm and drawing it to my body in a hammer motion is enough. I also wait a beat before I start the hammer motion. I have also had hitters strike themselves out ( especially at the lower levels ) and start the walk back to the dugout, and when that happens I usually don't even vocalize the "three" just give the motion. Personally, in my opinion, especially in any league below HS, big huge calls unless its bottom of the 7th in a one run game with runners on, is showing up the kid. I have had lots of parents come to me after a game, in the parking lot, and compliment me on not over emphasizing a called third strike. I guess is because I have a kid who is now playing varsity ball. I can't tell you the number of times I saw PU destroy my kids mood by giving him a huge 3rd srike call. He already feels bad enough.

I got nothing,.

Never bought this brand before. You have a pair? Base or Plate?