IFR...not!

[Pops]

High school varsity game... My partner was at the plate and called an IFR by mistake. The ball was blown by the wind down the left field line and landed fair at least 70 feet behind third base. Instead of having bases loaded with one out, the team at bat had R1 and R2 with two outs, and their inning was over with the next batter.  My partner admitted he called it too early but insisted that it could not be undone.  So the batter was out and the coach had some words for him when he found out why his batter was out.

I wondered about why a call like that can not be undone, especially when it is obviously a blown call.  Why couldn't you move everyone up one base after admitting it was the wrong call?  

[maven]

20 minutes ago, Pops said:

I wondered about why a call like that can not be undone, especially when it is obviously a blown call.  Why couldn't you move everyone up one base after admitting it was the wrong call?  

You can.

10.2.3 SITUATION F: With R1 on third and no outs, B2 hits a high fly in the infield above the second baseman’s head. The base umpire erroneously calls “Infield fly. The batter is out.” F4 subsequently drops the ball. R1 scores from third and B2 ends up on second base. Does the play stand or is B2 out but the run allowed to score?

RULING: The play would stand. Both teams have the responsibility to know when conditions exist for an infield fly. The batter-runner should attempt to reach base safely and then inform the umpire that his call was in error. (7-4-1f)

 

[stkjock]

 

@maven the situation you post seems different than the OP in that there is a single runner on base, in the OP it's first and second.  my reading of the OP suggests that the "error" in the call is where the location of the fly ball was??

[maven]

5 minutes ago, stkjock said:

 

@maven the situation you post seems different than the OP in that there is a single runner on base, in the OP it's first and second.  my reading of the OP suggests that the "error" in the call is where the location of the fly ball was??

I see what you mean. In the case I posted, it's not an IFF by rule, but in the OP, it's a judgment call that is changed.

In that case, we should go with 10-2-3L, which allows the UIC to: "Rectify any situation in which an umpire's decision that was reversed has placed either team at a disadvantage."

So, still, fix it. If that requires moving runners, so be it.

[stkjock]

Thanks for the clarification 

[Pops]

After the call the PU and I talked...he admitted his mistake, so I asked him if he would "undo" the call and make it right. He said he wouldn't/couldn't.  Should I have put more pressure on him to get this right? He insisted he was right at the time.

[ElkOil]

7 hours ago, Pops said:

After the call the PU and I talked...he admitted his mistake, so I asked him if he would "undo" the call and make it right. He said he wouldn't/couldn't.  Should I have put more pressure on him to get this right? He insisted he was right at the time.

Ultimately, it's his call and pressuring someone probably isn't such a good idea. If his mind was made up that he was unable to change the ruling and you said that he, in fact, could by rule, would he have believed you?

[scrounge]

By definition, the rule says the situation creates the IFF, not any umpire call. So yes, it could be reversed, as it is the corollary of the below case. But...be prepared for an 'animated' discussion. This is a no-win either way.

Rule: 7.4.1


7.4.1 SITUATION G:

With R1 on second and R2 on first and one out, B4 hits a high fly to second base which could have been caught by F4. Neither umpire declares “infield fly.” F4 unintentionally drops the ball but picks it up and tags R2 who is off the base.

RULING: The half-inning is over as R2’s out is the third out. The infield fly out for the second out holds even though it was not declared. The situation determines the out, not the declaration. The umpires should always declare “Infield Fly, If Fair” to lessen any confusion.

[noumpere]

And there's a similar play to 7.4.1G somewhere in 10.2.3.

 

Basically, in FED, it's the situation that matters -- and that can cause quite a bit of confusion.

[maven]

2 hours ago, noumpere said:

And there's a similar play to 7.4.1G somewhere in 10.2.3.

 

Basically, in FED, it's the situation that matters -- and that can cause quite a bit of confusion.

As @stkjock pointed out about my post, these case plays don't really address the issue of the OP. In the case play, the status of the fly as an infield fly is not in doubt. As a result, the situation clearly is/is not an IFF situation, and the umpire merely botches the announcement: announces one that isn't, or fails to announce one that is. In such cases of botched announcements, we have clear guidance that, as @noumpere says, it's the situation (not the announcement) that matters.

In the OP, we have a judgment call regarding the fly ball that determines whether it's a IFF situation at all. This is not a botched announcement situation, but a substantive change of judgment call regarding a fly ball. The umpire initially ruled that the batted ball met the criteria for an infield fly. He subsequently changed his mind about that. And he mistakenly thought that he could not change his judgment call after the fact, like changing foul to fair perhaps.

And this question is indeed more complex, because there are situations where we cannot by rule (for FED anyway) change a judgment call (a fair ball that touches the ground ruled foul cannot be changed). There are cases where we usually should not change, though we could: bang-bang tag play that I boot, for example.

But this call is one that we can change, and IMO we generally should (I can imagine a blowout game in which outs were precious where I might not give it back).

[Pops]

Thank you all.  I emailed my partner this information in case the situation arises again in the future.  I'm on the dish today, and we're looking at a beautiful day to play baseball (sunny and 57)!

[JaxRolo]

I agree you can undo this.