Left first after being called safe

[blp79]

Here is the situation,no on no out.Br hits to f6(who boots it)Br is tearing down the line and beats the throw SAFE.For some reason I do not know ,he walks off the bag down the first baseline half way between first and home headed towards the dugout f1 throws back to first,OUT.HC comes unglued says the runner never made an attempt for 2nd.I reply true coach but he gave up his right to the bag when he left it,by this time my partner(UIC) comes out we confer and he has him as safe that he didn't make an attempt so runner goes back to first and we play on.Now this play had no effect on the game home team won by 10 in 5.Whats your call?

[Astrosdawg07]

I'm gonna have to say out for the same reason. Once he came past the bag on his way back he gave up his right in my opinion, thats a good one.

[JaxRolo]

He has to be out once he stepped off the base on his way back and was tagged.

[carolinablue]

The runner has telepathy( or some mental gift ), he thought he was out, and it came true. OUT.

[blp79]

He has to be out once he stepped off the base on his way back and was tagged.

I'm going off FED rule 8-4note:any runner,after reaching first base,who leaves the baseline heading for the dugout or his defensive position believing that there is no further play,shall be declared out if the umpire judges the act of the runner to be considered abandoning his efforts to run the bases. This is all I can find to support the call.

Edited April 6, 2010 by blp79

[blp79]

I'm gonna have to say out for the same reason. Once he came past the bag on his way back he gave up his right in my opinion, thats a good one.

Thats what I had by fed rule 8-4 Note but my call was overturned by my partner .This was only a J.V. game,but come on the runner should know better than that.:banghead:And since the game I talked to a vet in my association and he agreed with my call,that the runner gave up his right to the bag when he headed for the dugout weather he crossed in to fair territory or not.

Edited April 6, 2010 by blp79

[NovaScotiaBlue]

Here is the situation,no on no out.Br hits to f6(who boots it)Br is tearing down the line and beats the throw SAFE.For some reason I do not know ,he walks off the bag down the first baseline half way between first and home headed towards the dugout f1 throws back to first,OUT.HC comes unglued says the runner never made an attempt for 2nd.I reply true coach but he gave up his right to the bag when he left it,by this time my partner(UIC) comes out we confer and he has him as safe that he didn't make an attempt so runner goes back to first and we play on.Now this play had no effect on the game home team won by 10 in 5.Whats your call?

I will add to the unanimous decision..OUT. A baserunner can't just wander around the area of 1st base and remain out of jeopardy He can be put out and he was and you got the call right:yippie::. Your partner threw you under the bus :crazy:

[carolinablue]

No tag is required here right ? Once you judge he has abandoned the bases you just call him out ? Everone seems to be responding like he needs to be put out by a fielder.

[blp79]

No tag is required here right ? Once you judge he has abandoned the bases you just call him out ? Everone seems to be responding like he needs to be put out by a fielder.

That's what I had.I do not see why he has to be tagged after he left the bag and headed towards the dugout.But I ended up under the bus :clap:

[BrianC14]

That's what I had.I do not see why he has to be tagged after he left the bag and headed towards the dugout.But I ended up under the bus

Now the important question: have you corrected your partner who overruled your call?

And how did that work, anyway? How in the world does your partner just take over what should be your call?

[mstaylor]

How far up his butt did you stick your foot in the parking lot. He blew it twice, he got the rule wrong then jumped on your call and overruled you.

[BrianC14]

How far up his butt did you stick your foot in the parking lot. He blew it twice, he got the rule wrong then jumped on your call and overruled you.

^^^

Yeah, what he said... :clap:

[blp79]

How far up his butt did you stick your foot in the parking lot. He blew it twice, he got the rule wrong then jumped on your call and overruled you.

Well we ended up in a heated discussion after the game,My biggest question was how is he not out? My partner replies now that I think about it you might be right,I reply you think,thats common sense baseball,and you made me look like a jack A$$.Needless to say when I left I was not a happy camper.:BD:But he was the UIC so he can live with that one.

[BrianC14]

Well we ended up in a heated discussion after the game,My biggest question was how is he not out? My partner replies now that I think about it you might be right,I reply you think,thats common sense baseball,and you made me look like a jack A$$.Needless to say when I left I was not a happy camper.:BD:But he was the UIC so he can live with that one.

Doesn't matter that he's Umpire in Chief or Pinhead in Chief - he should not, nor CANNOT overrule a call that is not his.

Buck up, though. He's the jackass, not you.

[blp79]

Doesn't matter that he's Umpire in Chief or Pinhead in Chief - he should not, nor CANNOT overrule a call that is not his.

Buck up, though. He's the jackass, not you.

Ok so in the opinion of this forum what is the best way to handle a situation like this where your partner over rules you?Me personally, I was hot about it and didn't really fell like arguing with him in front of the crowd even tough I new that was the right call.I'm sure each situation would be different but after the HC came out and argued and I told him and my partner what I had,my call was hijacked,and there I was hung out to dry.If your partner wont back you up what can you really do about it?

[mstaylor]

What did he do to overrule you? Did he do it across the infield in front of God and everybody or did he call time and come to you that you were wrong? If he did across the infield. call time and get together. Tell him that it is your call, he has no business in it, you aren't changing it, end of discussion. If he did it quietly then tell him the same thing but you can be a little less forceful. If in your discussion he convinces you that you are wrong then it is still your call to change, not his. In this case you were right, but in the future you may be wrong. Right or wrong, it is up to you what to do is up to you.

[blp79]

well when me and the HC were discussing what i had he came out I told him what I got and then he announced for everyone to hear that the runner is safe and back on first.

[mstaylor]

WOW! Strike three, what the devil is he doing in your discussion. So let's recap:

1) He walked into the middle of your discussion. That is a cardinal sin.

2) He overuled you publicly. Wrong and bad form.

3) To top it off he was wrong.

[blp79]

yeah that sums it up

[Umpire in Chief]

I wouldn't say or do anything on the field. No matter how much of an assclown this guy is to you on the field the umpires have to present a unified front.

After the game I'd have to say something, and I'd probably kindly request never to work with the guy again.

I had a situation where in a Pony game I'm BU R2, the batter hits one in through the infield. R2 is heading home the whole way, but F5 bumped into R2 just before he gets to third and throws him off his stride. I call the obstruction, we have a play at the plate and my partner bangs him out. I called time and went to meet with my partner. I told him I was protecting the runner home on the obstruction. My partner who is much more senior than me told me my obstruction only protected him to third. I said, its my obstruction call and it's my award to make. We discussed it for a second, but he wasn't budging. I told him he's kicking a rule and potentially setting us up to come back for free. He continued to insist I was wrong and he stayed with his call.

On my way back to the C position I got an earful from the 3rd base coach who heard and saw me call the obstruction. "What happened to the obstruction???"

I replied, "In my partner's judgement the runner would still have been out w/o the obstruction." When I really wanted to say,'That's a really good question, but my partner is a stubborn idiot who doesn't care what I have to say. So go talk to him.'

Coach went apes:censored:t and probably crossed the line, but I let him vent since he just got screwed. And I had to take all the heat for my partner's blown call. When he should have been man enough to come up and take the coach off of me for his call. But I wasn't going to say, "We'll geez coach, that was my partner's call. So you'd better talk to him because I'm just out here for decoration"

After the game I tried talking to him, but he was still insisting he was right even after looking up the rule. So I let it drop. I still cringe when I see him on my schedule.

Points of the story:

1. Be unified out there, in appearance if nothing else.

2. Don't throw your partner under the bus.

3. Don't let your partner take the heat for your bad call.

[BrianC14]

First off, you NEVER argue with your partner on the field. You state your case, and cite the appropriate rule, if it is applicable to the situation.

Once in the parking lot, you hold your *ahem* "discussion" so that no one else can hear it, but make no mistake about it, you have to figuratively kick some ass here - there's no reason for doing what he did. If he needs something in writing, refer him to FED rule 10-1-4, which reads in part:

No umpire shall criticize or interfere with another umpire's decision unless asked by the one making it.

And even when you ask for help, the final say on any of your calls will stand unless you agree to change it. If you agree to change the call, then YOU make the call and the explanation for the change (should the other coach ask about it).

Does your association hold regular meetings?

If so, I'd bring this situation up in a 'quick hurry' for open discussion.

You don't have to mention the name of the jackass in front of the group (take the high road, unlike what he did with you on the field) but you sure can make sure he gets the message so that it's crystal- - clear that what he did should get him terminated from umpiring.

You could broach the subject this way:

"Suppose you had this situation in a game... yada yada yada.... is this the correct way to handle this, for the home plate umpire to intervene and then simply overrule the call?"

And yes, I am serious. His actions on the field and his ignorance of the rules are both un- -believable.

Edited April 7, 2010 by BrianC14

[blp79]

Well Warren and Brian I agree 100% about never arguing with your partner,And yes i have a local association meeting this weekend so I am going to bring it up,just so happens this guy is is the same local I am,should be fun.And to make things worse i have to work with him today.