Is this a balk?

[Dragon29]

OK, first, let me apologize for posting yet another balk question, but I hadn't seen this before or read a discussion on it (& I think I may have kicked this one)

16U OBR w/slight mods that don't enter into this discussion. R1, less than 2 out. I'm PU.

F1 makes what appears to be a legal move to 1B for a pick-off attempt on R1. The ball 'sticks' in his hand and is released more down than 'across' to F3; the ball bounces/rolls toward 1B. R1 retreated; F3 retrieved the ball (had to come into the infield to get it) and threw it back to F1. We made no call.

This was one of those 'Gee, that looks wrong' moments, but I could not come up with a rule to cover it as a penalty, so didn't say anything.

The only actual rule I could come up with that might apply would be 8.05(k) - The pitcher, while touching the plate, accidentally drops the ball . .

What he did was an accident but the release of the ball was not.

What say you?

[Mike Prince]

I say no balk.

[LMSANS]

I say no balk.

What he said.:nod:

[Stan W.]

F1 makes what appears to be a legal move to 1B for a pick-off attempt on R1. The ball 'sticks' in his hand and is released more down than 'across' to F3; the ball bounces/rolls toward 1B. R1 retreated; F3 retrieved the ball (had to come into the infield to get it) and threw it back to F1. We made no call.

What say you?

I say no balk.....from your post, I have a throw to the base......albeit a poor one.....the balk rule does not legislate the quality of the throw.......

[Dragon29]

Guys - thanks.

I thought we had it right on the field, then I wasn't sure - then I was . . . you know.

Thanks for the opinions.

[sdix00]

From J/R

[it is a balk if a pitcher]

11. steps to first base

(a) but does not complete the throw. [8.05b] This includes an attempted in-contact throw that slips out ofthe pitcher's hand and does not reach the foul line or a fielder within reach of a tag attempt at first base.

Bear in mind that the italicized portion is italicized in J/R and Roder points out that italicized passages are added by J/R and represent interps not specifically covered by OBR. Specifically:

The items in italic print are innovations that the authors believe to be unique or original to The Rules ofProfessional Baseball: A Comprehensive Reorganization and Interpretation. In some cases they are words used to make certain concepts more clear. In other cases they are interpretations of plays or rules that have not yet been specifically addressed by the Major or Minor Leagues. As umpire school instructors, the authors found need to employ certain words and phrases so that everyone in the classroom could clearly understand what a concept meant, and they found need to make certain interpretations so that every rule question and play question could be answered. Bear in mind that the process for making new rules interpretations in the Major and Minor Leagues can be very involved; oftentimes many opinions must be considered. Be that as it may, the words and interpretations herein printed in italics are not to be considered those officially used on the fields of professional baseball.

However, they may very well help you to understand a concept or to decide how to rule on a play that is not specifically addressed anywhere else.

[Dragon29]

Thanks a lot, sdix!

Here I was, all fat, dumb & happy thinking I hadn't blown the call, when along comes J/R.

OK - With this 'new' interp, would any of you have called it in the sitch from the OP?

Does this even get called in MLB (or MiLB)?

[NFUA_44]

I've seen it before, didn't balk it then, and won't balk it if I see it again. what's the purpose? Your going to give an award for what boils down to a bad throw? He didn't do something to actively try to fool the runner and his attempt ,albeit a pretty poor one, isn't going to result in some advantage to him or his team.

I love my J/R, and it's in's and out's provide great insights into a complex set of rules, but not every unofficial Interp. has a bedrock to stand on. Sometimes their more of a roadmap to help us understand how it all fits together.

Sometimes we just gotta umpire, which is what you did.

[mstaylor]

I would leave it alone if it made it most of the way to first and in line. If he throws it at his feet or just a few feet away, then yes I would call the balk.It sounds like you have it right but just remember there is a grey area in the future.

[1dumbquestion]

had this same type of thing almost happen the other night. w/R1, F1 throws what was the ugliest "change up" I've seen, the ball barely makes it to the plate where F2 picks it up. both sides got a good laugh out of the 30' pitch, but I started to wonder if I would have balked him if it didn't make it. It was a pitch not a drop so I don't think I would have. Any opinions? Thanks, 1

[noumpere]

had this same type of thing almost happen the other night. w/R1, F1 throws what was the ugliest "change up" I've seen, the ball barely makes it to the plate where F2 picks it up. both sides got a good laugh out of the 30' pitch, but I started to wonder if I would have balked him if it didn't make it. It was a pitch not a drop so I don't think I would have. Any opinions? Thanks, 1

It was a slipped pitch and its a balk with runners if it doesnt make it past the foul lines