Rennolds

1 man crew, Little League Minors division Play: Bottom 6. 1 out, bases loaded, 1-2 count. F1 throws WP. R1, R2, R3 advance. F2 makes an easy tag of R3 at home. Both teams think this is the third out. F2 tosses ball towards mound as both teams line up on first and third to clap hands. R2 and R3 never leave the field. Home book yells that it is only two outs. Coaches look to me as I stand there saying nothing. Both teams casually walk back to positions with no play being attempted. My Call: A no call. No players left the field of play. No players /coaches assisted the runners. No fielder attempted to PO a runner. Should I have let this go as a "Little League Reset"? Nobody even asked for clarification, but for my own improvement how should I have handled this play. Rennolds

Why did you do this? It doesn't sound like the BR was trying to avoid a tag, but rather just walking to his dugout. This is more of the clarification I was meaning to ask, not having the "rules" memorized in my head as a new umpire. I called him out because in my judgment F2 was making a clear attempt to tag him out. He could have thrown to first, but instead jogged after the BR. Avoiding the tag or not, it is my understanding that as soon as a play is attempted on him he now has one place and one place only to walk / run / skip / dance to and that is first base. I even allowed a little extra room until he was well right of an reasonable line to first. He was walking away from the catcher - back to the catcher. How would he know that there was a play attempt? Use some common sense here. Ignorance of a rule violation isn't my concern I wouldn't think. That's not what's he getting at. Going out of the basepath requires intent by the runner. 7.08 Any runner is out when— (a) (1) He runs more than three feet away from his baseline to avoid being tagged unless his action is to avoid interference with a fielder fielding a batted ball. A runner’s baseline is established when the tag attempt occurs and is a straight line from the runner to the base he is attempting to reach safely; or (2) after touching first base, he leaves the baseline, obviously abandoning his effort to touch the next base; ah got ya, thanks. yeah makes sense now. Hindsight I should have just let it keep going. Will know better next time.

I normally do just that. I know how I would re do it, like most thing, I would have done it differently. In this case as the BR was walking away I was going to just wait for the tag, but it just dragged out so in my head my initial ruling was out of basepath and he is going to tag him anyway. When he pulled the no ball deal it was SH*# or get off the pot so I felt confident in the out of path call. Learn something new every night. thanks for the insights.

Why did you do this? It doesn't sound like the BR was trying to avoid a tag, but rather just walking to his dugout. This is more of the clarification I was meaning to ask, not having the "rules" memorized in my head as a new umpire. I called him out because in my judgment F2 was making a clear attempt to tag him out. He could have thrown to first, but instead jogged after the BR. Avoiding the tag or not, it is my understanding that as soon as a play is attempted on him he now has one place and one place only to walk / run / skip / dance to and that is first base. I even allowed a little extra room until he was well right of an reasonable line to first. He was walking away from the catcher - back to the catcher. How would he know that there was a play attempt? Use some common sense here. Ignorance of a rule violation isn't my concern I wouldn't think.

Why did you do this? It doesn't sound like the BR was trying to avoid a tag, but rather just walking to his dugout. This is more of the clarification I was meaning to ask, not having the "rules" memorized in my head as a new umpire. I called him out because in my judgment F2 was making a clear attempt to tag him out. He could have thrown to first, but instead jogged after the BR. Avoiding the tag or not, it is my understanding that as soon as a play is attempted on him he now has one place and one place only to walk / run / skip / dance to and that is first base. I even allowed a little extra room until he was well right of an reasonable line to first.

Morning Blues, Little League Major game working alone. Batter swings at dropped third strike and begins to walk to home dugout. F2 retrieves ball and at a skip goes after the BR. Due to the distance between them and the fact that F2 did not run after him this takes longer then you would think to reach the BR allowing BR to walk pretty far towards dugout. I call BR out just before F2 applies a glove tag with no ball in it. BR continues to dugout where coach physically stops him from entering and pushes him towards first base. This is LL, mom is already in my ear, volume set to excelsior. As a league Board Member I have to wear two hats even as I umpire so my steps may seem a little off, disregard the spectator portion. I call time louder then anyone should have to. I get my parents back in their seats and explain again for the 100th time how I am the volunteer umpire and how there are only two managers. Due to this my parents also know that I explain things like this to the managers at HP where they can hear as well and hopefully learn something new. I call BR out for leaving the set base path created when F2 attempted to apply a tag. I explained how if F2 did not attempt a play I would have waited until BR reach dugout (again LL) and he can walk to center field for all I care. The no ball tag had nothing to do with the out call. Everyone seemed to accept this as the correct call except one, I am an umpire too, parent who keep the issue going. Two inning later I made a point of making this same parent Google another call he said I have backwards, he seems to thing the hands are made of wood. Good call, blown call, given wrong reason? Either way the BR is out as my final shut the hell up about the play was the fact that the manager can not help the BR by stopping him from entering the dugout and pushing him to first so he is out twice in my books.

Welcome

Yes and no in truth. I never thought we would see judgement calls review able so times are changing. As a fan I have seen my team lose a few replays late in a tight game where if a tag was held the runner would have been out and we would be sitting in a wild card spot instead of 3 games out. At the end of the season would a MLB player trade looking like a 10 year old for a playoff spot instead of sitting home. Sometimes a 162 game season comes down to small things.

That is extremely close. Not even 100% sure I see an out in slow motion lol. The commentators bring up a good point I have heard all year long and do not see guys doing. MLB level infielders are too used to phantom tags / base touches; they need to go back to basics and apply and hold tags with replay. I have seen a dozen if one replays where the runner would be out if a snap tag was not applied regardless of the initial contact.

That is correct. LL 7.13 is a no-lead rule. Leaving early IS leading off.

@Rich Ives In his scenario any advancement of a runner shall be returned to their previous base once he has decided 7.13 is good. That's the part I meant about question 3 being bigger then he thought. Unless I am reading his question wrong, he doesn't mean to say Lead Off. Looks to me like he is asking if a runner can be off the base trying to steal and at what point does he have to return prior to the next pitch.

Question 3 is actually a bigger question then you realize in LL and a headache for new umpires, see rule 7.13 Leaving Early. Also you use the term "lead off" and I don't think you really mean that. Depending on the division you are working, the skill level of a runner can be greater then the ability of the defense. That is to say that you will come across runners that will dance off the bases because they know the pitcher is not good enough to throw him back and will dance off the base every time the pitcher turns towards the rubber. This is not leading off, the ball is still live and the previous play is still ongoing. Some leagues will even put wording in their local rules to mirror softballs Look-Back rule and include the pitching circle and not the rubber as the criteria for Rule 7.13 Pretty much what you need to be looking for in this scenario is the runner is still advancing (even moving an inch) or is he just off the base in a stare down. Once the pitcher has his foot on the rubber AND the catcher is ready to receive the ball with his gear on (catcher does not have to be squatting) AND the runner is not advancing Rule 7.13 is in effect. Like I said though a Coach that wants a late inning run with his fast player on third will dance that player off because he knows that he can get home due to the physical ability of the kids involved. Once you have judged the criteria for 7.13 to be in effect any advancement of a runner shall be returned to their previous base.

Welcome to the site, I pretty much started the same way. Like @Richvee said there is a lot of information to be found here. I was active here the first year I got into it and just read everything before finally officially joining. Lot of experience passes through here on a daily basis, I even just bought a membership to support the people that give all this info for free. As far as the patch, your UIC should be able to give you a few of them free of charge. If he doesn't send me a PM and I will get some to you myself. Honigs will also sell LL shirts with patches and embroidery already set to go found here; http://www.honigs.com/detail.asp?Item=446&Sub=171 little higher in price, but nice shirts, I prefer them to other brands myself.

Do you think this guy will accept an Ump-Attire discount since he is using their images to sell things at twice the going rate lol http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Wilson-Shock-FX-2-0-Steel-Cage-Umpires-Helmet-/151400208017?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item234027d691

During a high school game a pitcher throws a fastball 88 MPH sending the umpire back in time where he bumps into Shoeless Joe Jackson and Kevin Costner. In order to get back to his own time they must all team up and win a Inter-galaxy tournment, but who would play with them... in walks Jordan in a White Sox uniform followed by Marvel characters. Movie gold