umped up

Ok, here I am getting ready for my first ever college game. Without going into too much detail, it's game 2 and I'm behind the dish, it's the TOP of the 2nd w R-1 and R-3. I get back into position behind the catcher, look down for a moment at my feet and when I do this I hear "balk". Coach from the dugout is hollering, "are you kidding me, he hasn't been called on a balk in 2 years". I have no idea what the balk was. The pitcher, when I looked up at that instant was still in his "stretch" position. I'm thinking, "what the fk did this guy possibly do"? Oh well. After the rumbles from the coach and fans simmered a tad, I position myself back behind the catch and again glancing down at my feet and again...."BALK". S#!@ hits the fan. I look up and the pitcher has his hands to his side, palms up as to say "WTF" and I am clueless of what he did. Side note: Just to keep people from responding about me looking down at my feet (which yu should) I do it occasionally and have never had an issue until this back to back moment. How weird is that. Onward. The coach comes storming out of the dugout and meets the U1 close to the mound. I, at this point am observing and waiting to see what happens next. I'm noticing that voices are getting louder (including my partner...a big no no) and a little posturing going on and I'm thinking, ok, here we go. I start to walk out there to restore order and get the game back on track. I position myself next to them potentially getting myself between them to break it up and move the head coach away and start barking at me. As soon as I said, "ok guys, lets keep it down a tad here", the head coach directed his attention to me and yells," THE REASON I'M YELLING IS BECAUSE THIS IS THE ONLY WAY I GET MY PLAYERS ATTENTION, SO I THOUGHT IF I KEEP DOING THIS MAYBE I CAN GET HIS ATTENTION AND MAKE SENSE OF THIS SH!@. I said, "alright coach, he then said " all I want him to do is explain to my pitcher what the balk was. And I thought this was my first college game and here is this guy with many years of experience yet to explain it. As the coach said this to me, my partner says, "coach, I have already explained it to him, if maybe you would explain the rules better to him, he may be able to understand what a balk is. I immediately put my hands up towards him before the coach could respond and said," would you please tell the pitcher what he did to cause the balk. I gently put my hand on the coaches shoulder and walked off the mound with him. (I know people say never put your hands on a coach) I just wanted play to resume. My partner was so out of line!!!! I have my suspicions of a few things but my feeling is that I better not say. After the game, I put the balls in the home teams dugout and headed toward the parking lot and my partner looked up at me and said, "later" and walked away. Obviously, he had nothing to say about it. I then waited until he left the lot and patiently waited for the home coach to finish his post game and motioned him over to me. And to no surprise, he welcomed me with both hands behind his back with a glaring look as to say, "what the fk do you want"? I then extended my hand and said, "what was your name again"? He extended his and said, John. I then wanted him to know that I cared about the situation and if he was satisfied with the calling. NO! He still had no clue what the balk was about. He then called his pitcher over who explained to me that he was still unsure of his balk He said "from what I can surmise, I think blah blah. Heres the deal. He called a balk on him while in the stretch position because he threw the ball to his glove hand while on the rubber, still in the stretch position mind you. Twice! He simply had the ball in his throwing hand and once he stepped on the rubber, he tossed it into his glove while ready to recieve the signs. And I thought that in college ball the umpires would be good. Since he didn't talk with me, I have no idea his thoughts or what he "thinks" he saw but given that....... My first college game........... :hopmad:

k

mstaylor...thank you. You and others have been very insightful to say the least. I was taking some situational testing and there is no way in hell I would have gotten some of those questions right without me reading the post about "Balk w/ CI". I read through that post until I felt that I understood it. One of the questions posted was: There are runners at 1B and 3B w/ 2 out. As the pitcher starts his delivery, the umpire signals "balk". The pitcher, however, continues and the batter connects for an apparent extra base hit. Both runners cross the plate and the runner pulls up at 2nd. then the SS calls for the ball, touches 2nd and appeals that the runner from 1B missed 2B. The umpire agrees and calls the runner out. Is this the right call? I see this and without a doubt, I knew exactly what the call was before looking at the answer. I was absolutely correct. I wouldn't have had a prayer with that one if not for this forum. My answer of course is that the umpire is correct for calling the runner out AND the runs do not count since that was a force play at 2B. The balk play was satisfied with the runners advancing plus the BR but there is no protection past the bag your entitled to. (my words obviously) There were 3 similar ones like this and without a shadow of a doubt, I knew the answers, thanks to you guys here. To answer your question or concern about game management, I wont lie to you and say Im a veteran but I'm ok at it. I may have a little longer rope and put up with a little more than the seasoned ump but I'm not the extreme. I'm to where I need to tighten it up a tad. No one at any of my games would think, "holy sh@% blue, get in controll will ya. Now last year when I thought I was gonna do a few college games but ended up not doing any (I was kinda dissapointed) my game management wasn't that good for that level. That would have been my 2nd year so in hind site, Im glad I didnt get any college games. I got a lot better at it with one more year under my belt. I guess my assigner knew what he was doing. At the time I'm thinking "come on dude, give me some college games". I can now see why he didn't. I'll get better at all facets of this job and as long as I do it, I will continue to get better and learn. Thanks again

That righ there folks is some good comic relief. Forgive me for saying, bless his heart.

Yes thats Hoglund park and No it wasn't a KU game. I wish I could lie and say it was but was actually a highschool showcase that was held at their facility. Damn! I had the chance last year to do D1 ball in the fall because in he fall, umpires don't get paid so they look for umpires who need experience and give them the opportunity to do some of those games. Unfortunately, I was working during the time the games were played or I would have jumped on them like hobo on a hot pocket.

hey grayhawk. I live just east of K-7 right off Johnson Drive on Montecello. I live right up the street from Mid America Sports Complex, yes baseball fields. Would you believe I have never done a lick of highschool ball yet? I did college games before doing a highschool game. Now in the past two years, I of course have done mens league, Ban Johnson league (college teams), two college showcases, a few highschool showcases, a lot of players who play highschool ball but to say have I "technically" done highschool baseball? No. Not in the school setting. I took the FED test last year to do that level but the assigner (I wont give any names) never returned my calls. I paid the $50 fee, got all the information, rule books, study guides, yadi yadi and it was all for not. While I was at the Topeka camp last year doing the plate, some of the instructors slash assigners asked of my experience and I told them two years. They couldn't believe it. They asked if I did any highschool ball yet (I'd assume because Im doing a college level camp) and I told them the situation with the assigner and they asked me who he was and I told them and all 5 guys that were there (in unison) started shaking there heads. Obviously, he's terrible and unreliable. My first year of umpiring was awesome. I've kept a journal of my travels (umpiring) and look back at it every now and again and think.....wow. I'm usually relentlessly hard on myself with things and good is never good enough but I look back at what I accomplished in my first year of umpiring and I actually feel damn good about it. I started off the year doing 9 yr olds and by the end of the year, I find myself in Kaufmann Stadium doing a college showcase. At the time, I'm looking around at my partners and I'm asking myself, "what the hell am I doing here"? I was so nervous to be out there. I was hoping like hell none of them asked my experience because they would have SH*# their pants when I say, "this is my first year". The least experience of the umpires I was with was 10 yrs. One was an instructor. One of the reasons I moved up so quickly is because this game is my passion and it comes 2nd nature to me (at least playing did). But I have so much knowledge as a manager, coach and player that it wasn't that bad of a transition. I umped initially with a bunch of guys that did it solely for the money (not all but the majority it seemed) and I did it to learn and move up as quickly as possible. I'm at the point now where I've moved up past my knowledge and experience level should place me but I'm not going to complain. Every umpire I umpire with assumes I have 7-15 years under my belt. I never tell them, I just let them think it. Well, now you all know. Your so right about the conversations, there is so much my wife can take (and she's the most supporting wife a guy could ask for). My baseball team doesn't even want to hear me vent. I have to do it with my fellow umpires. So this site has been fabulous. I've already learned so much from just reading past and present post. For anyone who thinks Im full of myself, your wrong, I've been blessed. This is the one and only time I have actually been proud of what I have accomplished. I know now that the ride is going to slow down tremendously. I'm going to have to put in quality time before I move up from the college level. I mean like from Juco ball to D3 or NIAI etc. It's been a very interesting ride thus far............I'm going to have to give you my first college game experience. Believe it or not, I had to do a report and send it to my assigner. Not because of me but my partner. Yikes.... stay tuned for that one.

I was inspired to start a post to have umpires post the things they've never seen before. With F8 throwing the ball over the fence to save a run made me think of all the things I''ve witnessed in my baseball career that made me shake my head or hold my head in awe. I think it would be funny to hear some of the stories and also some pretty good umpiring opportunities. I'll start it with one that is the freshest in my mind cause it just happened. KS and the catcher blocks the ball (good slider) and rolls just up the first base line. The BR starts down the line and as he hears F2 call out "outside", he times his bat toss. Yes, a bat toss. He takes his bat and tries to time the throw and he catapults it above his head to the right of him and the ball strikes the bat in flight. Hilarious! Obviously, the ump called the batter out for interference (detatched equipment) and that was that. A warning ensued.

What is this "NUTTY BUDDY"? Is this a term you are making up or is there in fact a brand or cup called that? If you can take an 85+mph foul ball there, I am very interested in what cup you are using. Wait a minute! R U a female? :wow:

Knock on wood (pardon the pun) I have never been hit there from behind the dish. Came close but no cigar. I did think at one point I broke or dislocated my jaw from taking one directly to the mask, it even left a small dent where it hit me. My ears even started to burn, that's when I got nervous. About 2-3 minutes later it subsided but my jaw still clicks every now and again.

My first instinct would be to take action for unsportsmanlike conduct and I think I would also toss. I would also be very generous in my judgement of where the runner was at the time of throw. And if I got that wrong and awarded an extra base, I would lose zero minutes of sleep. That play is so chickenSH*#, it's hard to compare it to anything. I coached hundreds of players, including dozens who went on to D-I, D-II and the minors. I would never coach a team or a player to do something that chickenSH*#. I toss the player and sternly warn the douchebag posing as a baseball coach. I love it! I knew there would be all sorts of hair raising on this one, I just chalk it up to "if your around the game long enough, you'll see something you've never seen before". And that's definitely one of them. Not that i'm disagreeing with anyone on this, it just doesn't ruffle me so bad, I tend to laugh a little bit about the play. I love your quote BTW, I've used it since. That totally describes me to a "T". I also love how you described the "douchebag posing as a coach" Very nicely put.

I dont want to start a new post for this question but does there have to be contact on obstruction to be called? I just thought of this because last year as a player, I was rounding 1B and the 1st baseman was impeding my rounding to 2nd so I went around him then stopped, noticing I probably wouldn't have made it. I asked the ump about it and he told me that If I would have ran into him he may have called it but since I made the choice to go around him, it's not obstruction. I'm thinking it is. :shrug:

Thank you. Thanks for helping a lazy brotha out. Today anyway! I've been spending a lot of Time in the rulebook lately and just wanted a small break.

I definitely can see your point, trust me. Either way, your going to hear it. This is the first time I've ever heard of something like this. Some people see it as unsportsman like and others see it as intelligent thinking. I think its both. You take a player that throws his equipment or throws a glove at another player to where everyone knows it's unsportmanship then it's easy to toss them. The problem with the other, your going to have those who don't see it that way and some that do. The bottom line is that ultimately, it's the umpires ruling and that's all that matters. Just be ready for the storm.

What rule are you referring to? Crew chief said to "tell him by rule if the pitcher pitches the ball on a balk call, plays continue to see if the balk will be nullified". Is that in the actual language?

INDEED! i NOW understand that. :wow:

We are charged $4 per game and a check is written from me to him at the end of every month. No turn down fees, just less games if you do it more than a few times without good reason.

Very interesting! So much wrong with this whole thing...on a playing level and on an umpiring level. What to do, what to do. On a playing level, is it unsportsman like or just heady? Players will do anything to win. Goes back to the ol' saying,"if you aint cheatin, you aint trying". The hidden ball trick. Some think thats bogus and unsportsmanlike but you see it tried a lot. I was at a game where I witnessed the hidden ball trick to end a game and the players that it was against went ape s@&*. It almost started a brawl they thought it was so cowardly. It was a one run game BTW. They even blamed the umpire for allowing it to happen. I was told (as an umpire) if I ever see this being done, find a way to call timeout to nullify the prank. Sweep off the plate kinda thing. To me, the hidden ball trick doesn't bother me one bit. Hey runners, wait until the pitcher is on the mound (or rubber) before you take a lead, that will solve that little issue. There is always a coach or player trying to gain an advantage however they can, I see it all the time. TRICK PLAYS are just that, a way to TRICK the opposition. Look up the word "trick" and you'll see a list of 14 definitions one being (the first one): "a crafty or underhanded device, maneuver, stratagem, or the like, intended to deceive or cheat; artifice; ruse; wile. So what F8 just did was an obvious trick play. You can all come up with trick plays in baseball, there are tons of them and some pretty darn clever ones. Me personally, it doesn't really bother me that much because I just catagorize it as a heady play. As an umpire, I would have to simply apply the rule TOT, 2 bases and let the coaches and players deal with that guy. Your ejecting a guy for doing whatever he could to win (even though it was cowardly, add any adjective you like) he simply did what other teams do all the time just more obvious. And this was already mentioned but with a gap shot, what in the hell is the runner on 1st doing? he should have been halfway to 3rd by then. Oh well. Guys are competitive and will go to extreme measures at times to win. I accept that.....

Now that's funny right there! I cant think of many situations where you wouldn't take 4 runs over 1. I know from playing ball that sometimes a HR kills a rally (believe it or not) but I doubt this is what he was thinking. What you said makes sense. Where is that rule by the way? Im being lazy :ZZZ:

Actually, Im on the Kansas side. I went to the Topeka Premier Umpire Clinic my first two years which put me in front of the assigners. They seemed to have liked my mechanics (can always get better) so this year (my 3rd) I only got 3 college games (double headers) so far. I'm hoping to get a few more but being my first year, I can't expect much more than that. It's the rules that Im working real hard at. I never thought that would be the hard part. I played since I was 6 years old and played at high levels as I got older so of course I thought the rules would be easy. Wow, until I stepped on this side, I would never have imagined........

I ask this in all seriousness. Why is it that "whoever" thinks it's necessary to have different rules for different organizations, FED,NCAA, MLB, MSBL, USSSA and so on? I understand a few rules need to be altered but My God. What is the reason for all the changes? Why can't we just have the rules of baseball be the rules of baseball widespread? In MLB, I think it was the Yankees playing and there was a smash up the middle, F1 swiped at it and it lodged in between the fingers of his glove, he pulled off the glove and threw it to 1B for the out. In FED it's considered lodged and BR is safe and additional bases are rewarded to the runners. Why? Why cant this just be the same? What is the advantage of changing so many rules in all these different organizations? Besides making it difficult for the umpires, I have no clue. I've read so many post on here where someone states the rule and someone else states "well in the FED is states this or in the "fill in the blank" it states this. Why is this necessary? Seriously? Baseball rules need to be understood "why" it's the rule besides simply just knowing the rule. Example: pitcher shall be on the rubber when taking signs from the catcher. (I know theres no penalty) but the reason is to eliminate the quick pitch. I get that. IFF is to protect the offense, I get that and so on and so on. Maybe I'm ignorant here but why all these different rules for a game thats an american past time????????

I finally came across this in OBR, 2.00 A CATCH is in the act of a fielder in getting secure possession in his hand or glove of a ball in flight and firmly holding it; providing he does not use his cap, protector, pocket or any other part of his uniform in getting possession. So in this case he would not be out.

A hard ground ball to 1B, it hops off his glove and drops into his shirt, which obviously wasn't buttoned at the TOP. He couldn't extract the ball in time so he puts his hand over the ball (in his shirt) and beats the batter to 1B. Is he out?

They were taking the situation where the balked pitch was batted so the batter became a runner. Then the batter must advance. Otherwise if the batter doesnt become a runner of course he doesnt need to advance. Here the balk will still be acknowledged in the sense that the pitch is disregarded but the play stands for the runner or runners who advanced. This has been a very enlightening thread. I have a question. What if a coach comes out to argue that the balk happened before the batter was a runner, therfore, how can you enforce that rule. Is it simply because he threw the pitch, therfore remains a live ball and by him hitting it is a continuation of the balk call. Hope that makes sense.

Let me ask you this. How many times did the pitcher have a 3 ball count?

OBR 6.07 E note: If a runner advances, while the improper batter is at bat, on a stolen base, balk,wild pitch or passed ball, such advance is legal.