Ejection Situation

[HuskerUmp22]

Freshman (Fed rules) game: Bottom 5, score is 11-0 VT winning. 

2-2 count ball hits batter, but I judged that the batter permitted the ball to hit him and called 3-2 count. Batter is not happy and coach wants explanation. I explain to coach the rule, but he says, "He doesn't have to get out of the way. What are you talking about"? I disregard and we play on. Next pitch is ball four, batter throws his bat back towards their dugout. I warned by telling the coach: Coach, number ...  has one warning for throwing the bat." Coach does not like that either but says hey... cut it..." 

Next play popout to second base. Runner goes back very aggresively and makes contact with F3. I thought it was malicious, so I ejected the player. The player was also on a very short leach.  Coach wants explanation and fans were not happy. My partner talks to the player and gets him calmed down. 

Discussing with my partner at the end of the game. He wasn't sure if the play at first was malicious or not but indicated to me he was watching the play to determine whether the throw beat him or not. 

A fan came after me at the end of the game when we were walking out. He said: Blue! You did not do your job well by taking control. You let that get out of control! My reply. Oh really? Put a shirt on and try it yourself. " I walked away after that. 

A couple things I'm wondering here: 

1) The game was one out from being over. Should that determine whether I should eject or not? In other words, because the game was about over, should I just let it go? 

2) When I warned the player, how should it go? Do I talk to the coach personally or the player? I said it from my position behind the catcher.

Any other thoughts? 

Edited May 2, 2015 by HuskerUmp22

[Justin]

 Long-time lurker, but here is my first shot at giving (rather than receiving) advice on UE. Be merciful 

1) NEVER let MC go unpunished, especially at the freshman level. Ejections in FED games carry a one game suspension here in NY, so hopefully the kid will learn his lesson while he sits on the bench for the next game. Good EJ.

2) I'm not sure about talking to coach vs. player on an equipment abuse warning - if I remember correctly it's a team warning for the first offense, so my guess would be that you were correct to talk to the coach in this situation.

Bonus thought: Don't engage with fans, even after the game. I'm having a hard time imagining a situation where you win that encounter.

Looking forward to the conversation on this one.

[ricka56]

Freshman (Fed rules) game: Bottom 5, score is 11-0 VT winning. 

2-2 count ball hits batter, but I judged that the batter permitted the ball to hit him and called 3-2 count. HTBT, but I rarely keep B in the box.  Batter is not happy and coach wants explanation. I explain to coach the rule, but he says, "He doesn't have to get out of the way. What are you talking about"? I disregard and we play on. Next pitch is ball four, batter throws his bat back towards their dugout. That is what most batters do when HBP, you may have seen more, but I doubt I would have seen more, unless he was really asking for it...HTBT, I guess.  I warned by telling the coach: Coach, number ...  has one warning for throwing the bat." a warning for throwing the bat ??? Coach does not like that either but says hey... cut it..." If I was a coach, I'd be thinking that you're going out of the way to get him.

Next play popout to second base. Runner goes back very aggressively aggressively ??? how so ? is and makes contact with F3 did he have his hands up dulling the collision or did he have his elbow up ? . I thought it was malicious, so I ejected the player. IMO, you are not painting a sympathetic picture of yourself. The player was also on a very short leach.  Coach wants explanation and fans were not happy. My partner talks to the player and gets him calmed down. 

Discussing with my partner at the end of the game. He wasn't sure if the play at first was malicious or not but indicated to me he was watching the play to determine whether the throw beat him or not. That was a wishy-washy way to say he didn't have MC.

A fan came after me at the end of the game when we were walking out. He said: Blue! You did not do your job well by taking control. You let that get out of control! I can't tell if this fan thought that you were an OOO or an UOO. My reply. Oh really? Put a shirt on and try it yourself. " Don't engage disgruntled fans after the game, get the hell out of there.  I walked away after that. 

A couple things I'm wondering here: 

1) The game was one out from being over. Should that determine whether I should eject or not? In other words, because the game was about over, should I just let it go?

2) When I warned the player, how should it go? Do I talk to the coach personally or the player? I said it from my position behind the catcher.

Any other thoughts? 

​Bottom of the 5th, offense team down by 11 and you keep a HBP batter in the box because you judged that he let it hit him. Everything to follow came from that. I don't look for reasons to keep him in the box...I look for reasons to send him to 1B. Most any kind of movement that doesn't include moving into the pitch is usually good enough for me.

If I kept him in the box for ball-4 and he let loose the bat towards the dugout, I wouldn't do/say anything. He's pissed, maybe the HBP still stings. I'd let him have this minor vent. You giving him a warning didn't do anything to calm him down...probably just the opposite.

If I did give him a warning, I have put myself in a corner to where anything that looks "aggressive" and I have to EJ.

All this because you didn't let the player who's team is down 11 runs have his 1B HBP award. I wouldn't have done that.

[HuskerUmp22]

​Bottom of the 5th, offense team down by 11 and you keep a HBP batter in the box because you judged that he let it hit him. Everything to follow came from that. I don't look for reasons to keep him in the box...I look for reasons to send him to 1B. Most any kind of movement that doesn't include moving into the pitch is usually good enough for me.

If I kept him in the box for ball-4 and he let loose the bat towards the dugout, I wouldn't do/say anything. He's pissed, maybe the HBP still stings. I'd let him have this minor vent. You giving him a warning didn't do anything to calm him down...probably just the opposite.

If I did give him a warning, I have put myself in a corner to where anything that looks "aggressive" and I have to EJ.

All this because you didn't let the player who's team is down 11 runs have his 1B HBP award. I wouldn't have done that.

You are correct that I made a bad move by keeping batter in the box. I guess I wasn't thinking about the game situation and the entire game context. I feel like game management situations like this is where I have a lot to learn.  ​

He had his arms up and intentionally interfered with the fielder trying to catch the throw. There was contact, in my judgment it was MC. My partner said he did not think it was MC.

Edited May 2, 2015 by HuskerUmp22

[ricka56]

This episode will probably stick with you longer than the player or his coach. It's OK to let it go.

Good judgement comes from experience...experience comes from bad judgement...Will Rogers

[HuskerUmp22]

Yes. I feel really bad about it now looking back. I have umpired for 8 years since I was 17 years old, but still feel like I have A LOT to learn.

[Tksjewelry]

HS ball has one week left. Forget about it now. Take this as a game management learning moment. Tomorrow, new games, new day. (shouldn't you be in bed, we have games in the morning!) 

[maineump]

HBP - your call to keep him or not. Some would keep him, some would not -

If this is the kids first 'outburst', when he threw the bat (and was it a toss or throw that could have injured someone), that would help decide on the warning or not. Did he say anything when he threw it? Can't read his mind on his intent. We all probably have different ideas on that.

MC - HTBT, your made the call, so you stick to it.

As far as interacting with the fans - NEVER go there, nothing but bad could come from it.

As you get more games and situations under your belt, your game management skills will get better. Instead of second guessing yourself, after the calls are made - learn from your self-evaluation and fix whatever you think you need to fix. Tomorrow is another day.

[maven]

You are correct that I made a bad move by keeping batter in the box. I guess I wasn't thinking about the game situation and the entire game context. I feel like game management situations like this is where I have a lot to learn.  ​

He had his arms up and intentionally interfered with the fielder trying to catch the throw. There was contact, in my judgment it was MC. My partner said he did not think it was MC.

​Game management is the most difficult aspect of officiating any sport. Pro school will tell you that it's what distinguishes the tiny percentage of guys (and so far, it has been all guys) who get to the show. Most any goofball can learn proper mechanics and the rules, but only the very best have the person skills and experience to manage every game well.

The reason it is so difficult is that 95% of the game umpires itself. Obvious outs, obvious safes, balls and strikes within reason. It's the 5%, and coach and player reactions to that 5%, that create all the problems. The rarest situations cause the biggest problems. Since they are so rare, we sometimes don't know how to handle them (don't know the rule, don't know how to handle a coach who's losing his mind, etc. etc.). Then, sometimes after the game, we figure it out, and file it away for next time (which might be 5 or 10 years away, so have a good filing system!). The best umpires can draw on a wealth of experience and handle anything that comes at them, and you can't study experience the way you can learn the rules and mechanics — there's no "experience manual."

As for your INT/MC situation: I wasn't there, so I don't know, but from everything you've said it sounds like INT but not MC to me. The INT call sounds like a no-brainer, obvious call, which is exactly what you want. That's where the bar is for INT: it should be obvious to everyone in the park, and even his own coach should be thinking to himself, "Uh oh, he can't do that." Then you've got INT.

The same is true for MC: the classic example is F2 with the ball, waiting to tag the runner, and the runner just goes right into him, linebacker-style. You want MC, if anything, to be even more obvious than INT, because the penalty is more severe (in my state, he sits a couple games, carrying over to next season if necessary). Borderline MC isn't, so don't call it. Call the INT, if that's what it is, talk to him and the coach if it's borderline, but don't dump him unless you've got a no-brainer, obvious to everyone in the ballpark call.

[HuskerUmp22]

​Game management is the most difficult aspect of officiating any sport. Pro school will tell you that it's what distinguishes the tiny percentage of guys (and so far, it has been all guys) who get to the show. Most any goofball can learn proper mechanics and the rules, but only the very best have the person skills and experience to manage every game well.

The reason it is so difficult is that 95% of the game umpires itself. Obvious outs, obvious safes, balls and strikes within reason. It's the 5%, and coach and player reactions to that 5%, that create all the problems. The rarest situations cause the biggest problems. Since they are so rare, we sometimes don't know how to handle them (don't know the rule, don't know how to handle a coach who's losing his mind, etc. etc.). Then, sometimes after the game, we figure it out, and file it away for next time (which might be 5 or 10 years away, so have a good filing system!). The best umpires can draw on a wealth of experience and handle anything that comes at them, and you can't study experience the way you can learn the rules and mechanics — there's no "experience manual."

As for your INT/MC situation: I wasn't there, so I don't know, but from everything you've said it sounds like INT but not MC to me. The INT call sounds like a no-brainer, obvious call, which is exactly what you want. That's where the bar is for INT: it should be obvious to everyone in the park, and even his own coach should be thinking to himself, "Uh oh, he can't do that." Then you've got INT.

The same is true for MC: the classic example is F2 with the ball, waiting to tag the runner, and the runner just goes right into him, linebacker-style. You want MC, if anything, to be even more obvious than INT, because the penalty is more severe (in my state, he sits a couple games, carrying over to next season if necessary). Borderline MC isn't, so don't call it. Call the INT, if that's what it is, talk to him and the coach if it's borderline, but don't dump him unless you've got a no-brainer, obvious to everyone in the ballpark call.

​Great stuff! I agree with your analysis, especially on game management.