Called time too early

[MPLSMatt]

Had an interesting one last night. 15U FED, working alone. B7 is HBP on the wrist, goes to first without incident (henceforth, R1). 2 pitches later, B6 (now R2) steals 3rd. Close play, I move up the line and call him safe. Play settles and I hear a request for time from behind me, I look to 2nd and see no signs of R1 advancing (F4 has the ball). I put my hands up and award time but as soon as I do I hear DC yell tag him, tag him. I look behind me and see that R1 has thrown his helmet down and is walking back toward home, almost to the plate and continues to his dugout (3rd base side). I take a second to process and call R1 out for abandonment... 3rd out, inning over. Turns out R1 had had an issue with the 1BC and decided he was done (although he was also apparently hurting from the HBP too). OC comes to talk (he is really civil just wants an explanation) and I explain that, I was quick on my trigger to call time but he had abandoned his attempt to run the bases before time was awarded so he is out. He accepts this and life goes on but I know that it was a questionable call at best.

So I know I kicked it by calling time without double checking the runner, but am I right that R1 is out by abandonment as soon as he goes back up the 1st baseline (I think it's a judgment call) and 2) once time is awarded, is it more appropriate to eat the call and tell DC "look, I called time too early but once it's called I can't award an out."?

[semper_fi_72]

Once you called "Time" play is suspended.

It can not be undone.

You therefore can not call R1 out for abandonment.

He can go to dugout to confer with coaches or have his possible injury checked.

They could have put in a sub or pinch runner etc if he was injured or pulling himself from the game for any reason.

If you actually observed him throw down his helmet, then you have something else to deal with.

[buddywilshire]

I don't think you were quick on the trigger. Should you have looked at first before granting time? Probably, but that is a mistake that we all make.

I wouldn't have called him out. Time was called, he can go do whatever he wants. Who asked for time anyway? I don't get that.

[JaxRolo]

Once you called "Time" play is suspended.

It can not be undone.

You therefore can not call R1 out for abandonment.

He can go to dugout to confer with coaches or have his possible injury checked.

They could have put in a sub or pinch runner etc if he was injured or pulling himself from the game for any reason.

If you actually observed him throw down his helmet, then you have something else to deal with.

+1

I agree with this. Can't undo a time.

I had a similar situation. Close play at 3rd. I call safe. 3rd base coach ask for time. I grant it then I see R1 headed for 2nd. Had to send him back to 1st.

[MPLSMatt]

Time came from the 3rd base coach but the 1B coach was yelling "call time, call time" after he realized that his runner had given up (of course, at the time, I figured he just wanted protection for his sliding runner to get up and clean himself off - not at all uncommon for a coach to have to remind a player to ask for time before they come off the base in this league).

The only reason I called the runner out is because there is no doubt in my mind that the kid was 30 feet away from 1st by the time I awarded time. In retrospect, I would have done it the other way and taken my licking from the DC but I thought that it was the "most just" outcome (punish he who has screwed up).... Thanks for the feedback though - this site is such a great resource.

[semper_fi_72]

In retrospect, I would have done it the other way and taken my licking from the DC but I thought that it was the "most just" outcome (punish he who has screwed up).... Thanks for the feedback though - this site is such a great resource.

I really hate that term and do not believe it belongs in umpiring.

As umpires we do not punish. We follow the penalty for a infraction of the rules under the penalty authorized by the rules.

Under your situation there was no infraction of rules, therefore you have no penalty to enforce.

Also on the request for time from coaches after a player slides into the base to allow them to get up and back on the base protected.

Remember a request for "Time" is just that a request. You do not have to grant it. The coaches should be teaching their players to climb the ladder and get back on base without needing Time.

[th3]

when has he abandoned his attempt to run the bases (forgetting about the "time")? if he walks 5 steps across the infield towards the 3b dugout - is he out for adandonment? and, if not, could he just run straight to second from there is he realizes his mistake? would he have to retouch 1st?

[catoblue]

when has he abandoned his attempt to run the bases (forgetting about the "time")? if he walks 5 steps across the infield towards the 3b dugout - is he out for adandonment? and, if not, could he just run straight to second from there is he realizes his mistake? would he have to retouch 1st?

Depends on the rule set... some require the runner to enter DBT before they can be called on abandonment, others simply require that the runner abandon any attempt to run the bases.

[noumpere]

when has he abandoned his attempt to run the bases (forgetting about the "time")? if he walks 5 steps across the infield towards the 3b dugout - is he out for adandonment? and, if not, could he just run straight to second from there is he realizes his mistake? would he have to retouch 1st?

The rules almost all say something like "obviously leving the base bath heading for the dugout or a defensive position, believing there is no further play."

As a practical matter, if you call this twice in a career, that's too much. It's a call/rule of last resort.

[Dragon29]

Also on the request for time from coaches after a player slides into the base to allow them to get up and back on the base protected.

This is one of my pet peeves when I'm working the bases. (happened in my game last night - LL All-Star 11 year olds) When this happens (player or base coach) and the ball is still near them, I give an emphatic 'No.'

Once the ball is returned to the pitcher, I'll usually ask, "Do you still need time?" and of course, they almost always say they don't.

Had a kid in LL Juniors a couple of seasons ago (whose dad was also the 1st base coach) do this every time he dove back to first on pick-off attempts. He was the fastet player on his team, so you can imagine how often that was. Even after explaining to both the player and his coach (dad) what I was doing and why, they continued to not only request Time on every dive-back, but would get visibly upset when I refused to grant it. The 'coach' even tried reqesting time from the PU a couple of times. What a tool!