Ball a Dropped Strike Or not?

[jkumpire]

Hi Men,

Had this in an upper level adult game the other day. Both teams with college and ex-professional or college players:

I had two pitches, on for each team which were good strikes, and F2 dropped them. I called them anyway.

I will talk about #2 to make the call simple. 1-1, 1 out, R1. Pitch was thigh high, almost at the hip level, three inches inside the inside corner (ie. between the inside corner and the point of the plate). F2 has the ball tip off his glove, and it rolls 8-10 feet behind F2. R1 moves up. Batter is really upset and the he doul tips the next pitch for strike 3.

He turns and says "That all on you blue."

"No it isn't ********."

"Yes it is, he dropped it."

'"Hit the ball 21." He' s already gone as he heads back to the dugout, but he's mad enough to take himself out.The poll question is simple, and really for guys who do above HS ball; do you call strikes on balls dropped by F2? I used to ball them all, but i've changed recenty. If the pitch is an obvious strike, why ball it? I'm not ringing a guy up on a marginal pitch, or one on a corner, but if the thing is a good pitch in the middle of then zone, why not? Frankly, I'd like our Big Dog NCAA guys to talk about this. Frankly, if I was working an NCAA game, I'd call the pitch anyway, no matter what static I got.

Thanks for your opinons.

[noumpere]

F2 doesnt need to catch the ball for it to me a strike but letting a strike tip off the glove and go 8-10 feet behind is unlikely in a college game or a high level game like you said you have so its possible that you missed it.

[NFUA_44]

It's more about what is expected at that level and that particular league. There are plenty of places, mostly smaller diamonds, where you have to grab whatever strikes you can, but when your at a level that F2 should be catching a ball your going to get more flack about balls that are rolling around behind you being called strikes. It's one thing when F2 just butchers the catch and it winds up in the immediate vicinity, but something that goes out of the immediate reach is making both of you look bad. I'm not an NCAA guy, though I do a good bit of NAIA and JUCO during the summer, and we have a very competitive Adult League here. I have never had an F2 who questioned a ball/strike call when he didn't catch it.

I know JM recently talked about this in another thread, but I can't remember the name of that thread, so maybe he can jump in and shed some light.

[jkumpire]

noumpere,

I understand your point, but I know I didn't miss the pitch. It wasn't a marginal pitch, it was a clear strike that tipped off the end of F2's glove. It was a fastball F2 had and I was very surprised he missed it.

[mstaylor]

The obvious pitch, go ahead and call. The borderline pitch, probably not.

[Guest]

Depends on how much I like (or dislike) the catcher, pitcher, and / or batter, as well as how the pace of the game is moving.

In your situation, I would've taken the strike away because the catcher missed the ball so atrociously, allowing another runner to advance.

[UmpJM]

...

I know JM recently talked about this in another thread, but I can't remember the name of that thread, so maybe he can jump in and shed some light.

Indeed I did, just on another board: http://forum.officiating.com/baseball/57988-catching-called-strike-too-much-ask.html

JM

[NFUA_44]

...

I know JM recently talked about this in another thread, but I can't remember the name of that thread, so maybe he can jump in and shed some light.

Indeed I did, just on another board: http://forum.officia...o-much-ask.html

JM

Great reading there JM, thanks. The one I'm thinking of though is more recent, and the discussion turned to this in the confines of another thread topic, so I would be hard pressed to find it, although it may have been at the ABUA site, and these are the only two I really follow, with some Officiating.com thrown in for spice.

[carolinablue]

Higher level, boarderline must be caught but an obvious strike is a strike. Lower level, a ball is a strike.

[UmpJM]

NFUA,

Perhaps you were thinking of this one then: http://umpire.org/vb/showthread.php?t=10348

JM

[NFUA_44]

NFUA,

Perhaps you were thinking of this one then: http://umpire.org/vb...ead.php?t=10348

JM

Yes sir, that was the one! Two good sources in one thread. Wow. I'm on a roll today. I might actually post more than 10 times in a 24 hour period. Proof that the end of the world is near.

[spiritump]

if the ball rolled one foot where it can be reached then it is a strike--but 8-10 feet away--the catcher just cost his pitcher a strike IMHO

[Mr Umpire]

Questionable ones, ball. Obvious ones, strike. It sounds like it was obvious. Why is he waiting to see if F2 catches it before he swings at it? Seems a little late to be swinging to me.