SteveJ

This is a joke right?

When I'm doing youth games with time limits and run rules (or other "different" rules) I always go over them quickly at the plate meeting. "Tonight's game is 7 innings or 2 hours, no drop-dead; run rule is in effect 10 after 5; CR mandatory for F2 with 2 outs; and etc". Takes very little time and could save you some problems. I do not warn coaches when a game is about to be called due to the run rule or due to time running out (unless directed to do so by some league rule). I track the score & confirm it with the "official" book. My partner tracks time. As far as the OP -- Before we get to the "You're pissing me off" part I'm going to tell the coach that the run rule is in effect per league rules and will be enforced per said rule. If he continues the argument then I will warn him that we are through talking about it. Then anymore comments regarding this subject I will toss him.

Better check your state's gun laws. Me Someone coming to my house uninvited, screaming, and making me fear for my life. Amen!

ok ..... regardless of how you present those words ....... THAT'S GOT to come across redass If I was his UIC, I'd come onto the field and correct this immediately. If you were my UIC and you came out on my field to correct anything I said or did you'd better have your plate gear on.............

Beginning of the game, pitchers warming up. HTAC comes up and asks where my zone is. I tell him were not discussing balls and strikes tonight ( too defensive?). No malice in either of our tones. No one heard but him and I and maybe the catcher. I had that asked at lower levels (10U-12U) a couple of times -- Years ago my response would have been "You have 9 innings (or how ever many) to figure it out"! But in today's "kinder/gentler world my response is (at the lower levels) "Big zone [insert coach's name], tell them to swing the bat". Top of 3. I ball an outside pitch. I hear, guess you have to be from a certain place to get calls. I call time, remove my mask and warn. Didn't raise my voice and stayed calm. "Time", mask off, look at the coach with my most intimidating glance and say "[coach's name], I've heard enough" -- that was the first and last warning that the coach will receive from me. After the 3rd. I'm up the 3rd baseline. HTAC is walking back to 1st base dugout. I see him out of the corner of my eye. I take a step back trying to give him room. He walks by and brushes me with his arm. I ignore it, not knowing if it was accidental or what. ( should I have tossed here?) If I am standing where I should be in-between innings and a coach that I have had issue with brushes me.....he's gone -- in the league I work for he's fined/suspended (if not kicked out of the league altogether). Top 4. I ball a pitch outside. HTAC says " no way that missed!". I call time, remove my mask and say " that's enough, we are not discussing balls and strikes!" I stare into the dugout for a few seconds to make it clear he's about to get a one way ticket to the parking lot. If the coach had not brushed me -- I am running him for this comment. I've already warned him, now he has forced me to eject him. Next pitch, same location. Ball it again. HTAC, "That's two!". Boom! He gone. I walk up the third base line. Partners take out the trash. Too many warnings! Two batters later, R1. I think they tried to throw at me. Catcher bailed like it was a pitch out and I get hit in the shin with a lollipop curve. I just don't know. The pitching/catching wasnt great and this particular team called a lot of pitch outs. Even the coach acted like it was supposed to be a pitch out. But I wouldn't put it past them. Got to be careful here -- don't read too much into the situation. You said that they had called a lot of pitch-outs and the pitching/catching wasn't great. What were the actions by the players/coaches prior to you being hit? And they hit you with a lollipop curve? Maybe if they wacked you with a fast-ball???

Honestly, I'd never done it until this year when I got an early evaluation and the guy told me it was my responsibility (as PU) to inform the pitcher of the situation. Uh, unless there's a pitching change in the middle of an at-bat, I've never done it until this season. Still feels wrong. Ugh, I hate it. It feels wrong because it is wrong. that said, if the evaluator is in a position of power, and everyone in your group does this -- you have to go along until you get to the point where you can change things/ Ask them if they have ever seen it done at HS and above. It's done by guys who like "inserting themselves into the game". Honestly, I'd never done it until this year when I got an early evaluation and the guy told me it was my responsibility (as PU) to inform the pitcher of the situation. Uh, unless there's a pitching change in the middle of an at-bat, I've never done it until this season. Still feels wrong. Ugh, I hate it. It feels wrong because it is wrong. that said, if the evaluator is in a position of power, and everyone in your group does this -- you have to go along until you get to the point where you can change things/ Ask them if they have ever seen it done at HS and above. It's done by guys who like "inserting themselves into the game". I often see the PU or BU walk toward the new F1 and let him know the # of outs and point to each base runner. I never do that regardless of the age group! I'm there to umpire, not coach. A few years ago I was working bases for a D1 intra-squad scrimmage and a freshman reliever asked me if I was going to tell him the situation (outs and runners).... I thought that he was joking and smiled but I did tell him how many outs there were.

I do not announce the outs unless I am asked. I signal outs to my partner(s).

Screw him! Do it! Who needs friends when you can have money! Seriously, I would let my friend know what is going on. If it were a friend of mine I would not consider the job unless he knew what was going on. I wouldn't sit back and let a friend be blindsided.

That's what my grandfather always says. USMC Vietnam Veteran 1966-67. My grand-kids grandfather says the same thing. USA Rangers, Republic of South Vietnam, 1970-1971

Like I said earlier I appreciate everyone’s comments. I knew right away that I had mishandled the situation and was very disappointed in myself because I know better. It helped to hear from everyone. Now I have “Worst game of my career†story to tell. I think that I have discovered what the problem was…it was my attitude. I guess working at levels lower than I am accustomed to where the coaches/fans/players are more vocal bothered me more than I realized. So the other night I was, as my mom would always say, “Crusin’ for a bruisin’†and that’s a piss-poor attitude to take on the field. So after kicking myself (and having others kick me), plus a couple of talks with my psychiatrist (it helps to be married to one) I was on the field again last night for another semi-final game (plate). This time I took the proper attitude. The game went very smoothly and I had a great time (hadn’t done that for awhile). On a positive note, I have documented how I mishandled the situation and will use it as a tool to help train new umpires coming into our league. I worked with the same (fairly new) partner last night that I worked with the night of my “melt-down†so I was able to go over the things I did wrong and how it should have been handled. Now it’s break time from baseball for me since our league will take a break until mid-May and I will soon head off to Las Vegas for two WSOP events in early June flowed by 3 weeks of vacation traveling around in my motorhome with grandkids. Thanks again & good luck to you all!

I don't like either EJ. If you don't EJ the AC, you'd never have to EJ the HC. First, the AC is entitled to his opinion. When he tells you his opinion, say, "OK," and walk away. What the hell difference does it make if he thinks you missed the call? Second, he was complaining about a call, not about you. He has not violated the 3 P's (personal, prolonged, or profane). Let it go. Third, if you feel that you must address his comment (due to its tone or volume, perhaps), say, "that's enough, coach," and walk away. Then you've warned him: if he persists, you can EJ him for that, not for thinking you missed a call. And again, when the HC comes out about it and you explain that you had warned the AC and he kept at it, you're not going to have to EJ the HC (unless he decides to be a jackwagon himself). Finally, the HC was also complaining about a call (the EJ of the AC), and had not violated the 3 P's. So let that go, too. Look: we're never going to convince everyone that we're right, and it wouldn't matter if we did. Get to your spot, see the whole play, and make your call. Some won't like it, but too bad for them: yours is the only opinion that counts. They are entitled to their opinions, and we should not be EJ'ing people left and right for disagreeing with us or for expressing that disagreement. You are 100% correct..... I know this. I have been in this game for a long time. I guess what concerns me most is why I didn't use the skills that I have learned over the years to handle this situation properly. Maybe it's due to my growing dislike for the the overall lack of respect shown umpires (of course this didn't help). That's something only I can figure out and correct (or hang up my mask if I can't deal with it). Thanks again everyone! I appreciate everyone's feedback although I already knew what it would be. I guess it helped to hear it from others.

I had just jogged over to "A" from my position in shallow right field (on the grass watching the warm-up pitches). AC was around the coach's box. Like I said, After "calming down" and thinking about it I feel that saying "that's crap" probably wasn't reason enough to eject the HC.

Opinions please....... Freshman HS league semi-final game - I am working bases Bottom of 7 - Visitors up 8-5 Home Team batting - runner on 1B – 1 out Close play at 2B. I had the visitor’s 2nd baseman coming off the bag and the home team’s R1 sliding into 2B safely. I gave the standard pulled foot signal with a verbal "off the bag" & safe call/signal. I was in great position to make the call and was (and still am) 100% sure of my call. Moans and complaints regarding the call from the visitor’s dugout, as would be expected and not of an ejectable nature. HC did not come out to ask for an explanation. Home team came back to tie the game 8-8 in the 7th and won it in the 8th inning Between 7th & 8th inning. Visitor’s Assistant Coach says to me, "That was a bad call at second", I said "What?". He said, "You made a bad call at second base". So I ejected him. His HC comes out to find out why I ejected the AC. I told him why and that he, the HC, was the only one that could ask me about calls. The HC said, "What did you see?" I told him and then he yells "That's crap!" So I ejected him too. Now that I have had time to settle down and replay the events in my head I believe that I should not have ejected HC for what he said. But at the time, in the heat of the moment, it seemed appropriate.

The problem with your mechanic is that the 2 people who most need the information you're providing cannot see you. The verbal is crucial to the BR and F2. Hopefully someone in the dugout is paying attention because "no catch & catch" can sound a lot alike in the excitement of the moment. That's why we don't say "fair" when there's a ball down the line, it can be heard as foul, we just point fair. Maybe to the rest of the park, but not for F2 and the B/R, the verbal is only for them. The visual is to keep the rest of the idiots happy. Sent using Tapatalk Actually it can be confusing to them as well, I have seen it in lower level games that I have observed. I guess it's a personal choice to use a verbal/hand signal versus just the hand signal. I'm not aware of it being taught to do just one or the other. I'll remain in the non-verbal camp....at least for now.

The problem with your mechanic is that the 2 people who most need the information you're providing cannot see you. The verbal is crucial to the BR and F2. Hopefully someone in the dugout is paying attention because "no catch & catch" can sound a lot alike in the excitement of the moment. That's why we don't say "fair" when there's a ball down the line, it can be heard as foul, we just point fair. And as far as saying things like "Gotta get him, gotta get him", I have never heard any umpire say that. The fewer words said by the umpire's during the game the better.

I think "No Catch" is more clear. What's the merit behind "Gotta get him!"? I never give a verbal "no catch" on a dropped 3rd strike. I indicate it with a safe signal. I've worked with guys who give a half safe signal (just using one arm).

I do not think that LL is any worst than any other youth leagues. Since I have only recently been working ages 12 and below I am surprised by several things: 1. The lack of baseball rules knowledge that most coaches have which causes them to be more argumentative and disrespectful. 2. How rowdy the parents/fans are. 3. How disrespectful some of the players are. For this I put most of the blame on the various leagues and umpires. If it's club ball the TD is trying to make a profit so the umpires are expected (in some of the cases I have seen) to take more crap and avoid EJ's (keep the customer happy). I do not work for those type of TD's. In my very limited LL experience (and other lower level youth ball) I think that it is the lack of umpire training as to how to deal with situations. When some umpires let coaches/parents/players get away with crap then they will expect to be able to dish it out to every umpire. Then they start playing in a highly competitive league like the one I work for where the officials are trained how to deal with situations (and expected to handle them promptly and decisively). And where fines and suspensions are always the result of EJ's. Then they have a very difficult time adjusting. How many of us have heard, "Well the last umpires let me do it that way" or something like that? Working as a on-field trainer/evaluator for a league I have found that it is difficult to get umpires to do everything the same way (when it comes to enforcing rules). When it comes to taking short-cuts or not enforcing the "little things" I see most problems with "experienced" umpires. Then they wonder why they're not getting games.

And what happened next?

Also, never assume anything! F2's glove hitting the dirt as he was making the catch could have caused dirt to fly up. If you aren't sure that the ball hit the dirt then it didn't.

What he said ^^^^^^^^^^

NO NO NO. IFF they are using continuous batting order then there is free sub on defense, but you cannot switch the batting order around which would happen in the OP. If you get to a missing-player slot in the lineup it is skipped without penalty. Minors must use CBO. Optional (seasonal, not by game) with majors. Poster got the sub rule sort of right for 9-man lineup. The starter can re-enter anywhere in the lineup but only after the player who entered for him has batted once and played defense for six consecutive outs. What happened with other subs doesn't matter. Asking of both sub 1 and sub 2 "were done" doesn't really mean anything. They can remain in the lineup if the starters re-enter in a different position in the order. They are allowed to bat 9. The team with the ej'd player had 10-players. Like I stated in the OP the sub had gone into the game in the 3rd inning. The starter in the 9-hole was their only available player. Since his sub had batted and had played at least 6 continuous outs he was okay to use wasn't he? Did I misunderstand something?

The question was asked earlier "How did the dead ball strike get called? It appears from your OP that the PU didn't call it a dead ball strike initially. He let the BR go to 1B then called you in to confer. So now you say "I have him offering at the ball" and your partner then calls it a dead ball strike and brings the kid back to bat. Yep, the coach will want an explanation and he deserves one..... from your partner, who's call it should have been. When I say coach I mean the head coach, the guy who was at the plate meeting. The other guy I do not talk to.... He will go away before any explanation begins.

I decided that I would help out one of the local LL's. Plus the free hamburger and a soda was more than I could pass up. So after working two PONY playoff games I race to the LL ballpark. The level is Majors. I do not know what age the players are but they play on a tiny little field. But the quality of play isn't bad considering their age. I have a play at the plate. F2 is standing there with the ball waiting to apply a tag on this huge (much bigger than the rest of the kids) base runner coming in from 3B. The runner plows into F2 knocking him back flat on his back. No attempt to slide, no attempt to avoid, never slowed down, just hit the smaller kid at a full run. Obviously I call 'time". F2 is lying on the ground crying (but still holding the ball), coaches and mom come running out..what the heck is going on? I have never worked a game where mommy comes out on the field. I ask myself, "are things getting out of control"? I turn to the big kid and say "You're out and you're ejected for malicious contact". Now he starts crying and here comes his coach. .... both players are sobbing. The ejected player's coach says "My player says he tripped into him, look he's crying". I can see he's crying, I'm going to start crying too. "Coach he didn't trip. What he did was lay a great block on F2 knocking him flat on his back. Take your player and go to your dugout". I'm not done yet. The team with the ejected player had used their only sub to replace the guy in the 9-hole after the 2nd inning. So he wants to re-enter him in the 5-hole for the ejected player. I remember that according to 3.03 you can do that if 1 & 2 are done (That's right, I actually read the rule book that morning). We are in the 5th inning, so yep, 1 & 2 are in the bag. So I announce the change. Here comes the other coach. He's telling me that I am wrong and that the other coach is trying to "pull one over on me". One what I wonder? I wonder if I eject this guy if he's going to cry too...... He calls the district UIC on me, right then and there. The UIC confirms to me (us) that the starter can re-enter in the 5-hole. The coach says to me "I should protest the game" I said, "That's fine, are you filing a protest?" He says I'll let you know. He didn't. By now I am wishing that I had just gone home after my two earlier games. I'm in over my head here... LL is too much for me. I'm going back to the older kids....maybe no lower than varsity HS. No more LL for me. My hat goes off to the you LL officials out there!

Here's my rule.... I would have told the opposing coach to return to his dugout (and he would have done so) before you and I continued our conversation. After speaking with you, IF I had some information that the opposing coach needed to know I would have walked over to his dugout and had a conversation with him. Not a good idea to go to the dugout IMO, meet him halfway at most. keep it one on one. Here's my rule.... I would have told the opposing coach to return to his dugout (and he would have done so) before you and I continued our conversation. After speaking with you, IF I had some information that the opposing coach needed to know I would have walked over to his dugout and had a conversation with him. Not a good idea to go to the dugout IMO, meet him halfway at most. keep it one on one. Yep, should have said "walk in the direction of the dugout to get the HC's attention (if I didn't have it already)". I would never go to the dugout...

Have any of you ever had to eject a HC at the plate meeting?