Odd Play

[Guest Coach]

Runners on 1st and 3rd. 2 outs. Ball is put in play. Both runners go on contact. Play goes to 1st but batter is safe. Runner from 3rd crosses home plate. Runner who was on 1st thinks it's a foul ball and returns to 1B. He did NOT touch 2B. He is TAGGED out.

Does the run count (he crossed home prior to the tag out).

[Replacematt]

No. Once he leaves 2B in the direction of 1B, the force is reinstated, and his out is a force out. A force out can be achieved by tagging either the runner or the base. Since this was the third out, no runs can score.

[BRUMP]

Runners on 1st and 3rd. 2 outs. Ball is put in play. Both runners go on contact. Play goes to 1st but batter is safe. Runner from 3rd crosses home plate. Runner who was on 1st thinks it's a foul ball and returns to 1B. He did NOT touch 2B. He is TAGGED out.

Does the run count (he crossed home prior to the tag out).

 

No run does not score. Just because the runner is tagged rather than the base does not change the fact that this is a force. Since the 3rd out was made by a force no runs can score.

[Guest Coach]

Do either of you have a section for this rule?  For Matt, the runner from 1B NEVER touched 2B.

[maven]

Do either of you have a section for this rule?  For Matt, the runner from 1B NEVER touched 2B.

 

 

They are correct: when the third out is a force play, no run can score. 4.09

 

R1 is forced to advance to 2B, and until he advances beyond 2B, it's a force play. 7.03(b)

[treydawgmt]

The important section to read is Section 2.00 of the Official Baseball Rules - Definitions.  In that section, here is the definition of "force play."  If you read the comment part of that definition, it states something must be done to remove the force.  In your case the batter was declared safe, so nothing has removed the force on this play.  The runner who was AT first is STILL forced to 2nd, and he never made it.

 

A FORCE PLAY is a play in which a runner legally loses his right to occupy a base by reason of the batter becoming a runner.

 

Rule 2.00 (Force Play) Comment: Confusion regarding this play is removed by remembering that frequently the “force†situation is removed during the play. Example: Man on first, one out, ball hit sharply to first baseman who touches the bag and batter-runner is out. The force is removed at that moment and runner advancing to second must be tagged. If there had been a runner on third or second, and either of these runners scored before the tag-out at second, the run counts. Had the first baseman thrown to second and the ball then had been returned to first, the play at second was a force out, making two outs, and the return throw to first ahead of the runner would have made three outs. In that case, no run would score.

 

Example: Not a force out. One out. Runner on first and third. Batter flies out. Two out. Runner on third tags up and scores. Runner on first tries to retouch before throw from fielder reaches first baseman, but does not get back in time and is out. Three outs. If, in umpire’s judgment, the runner from third touched home before the ball was held at first base, the run counts.