Umpire Apperernce

[UMP45]

:question1: At the risk of offending some umpires I will pose this question. If you took 10 umpires and stood them next to each other in a line why is it you can, more times then not, pick out the ones who are softball umpires? I noticed this at our last meetting and it got me thinking. :shrug:

[Mike Prince]

Perhaps the softball umpires can spell their post title right though...We're all umpires, that is what is most important.

[UMP45]

But shouldn't they at least look like an umpire? Sorry about my spelling. I was educated in a government school!:agasp_:

[Guest]

I'm not a softball umpire, haven't ever been one, and I have no intention to become one. But:

Ok, for starters, the mechanics and evaluation standard of softball umpires are completely different than baseball umpires.

There is also a lot more baseball played than softball; it means more coaches, players, parents, etc will move to umpiring baseball when their respective career as a player ends. But at the end of the day, you still need umpires on a field, so the mantra of softball organizations may be more shifted towards "as long as we get the right number of blue shirts on the field." Which is why you may see guys with what we would consider sub-par standards of appearance working a game.

But you can also find guys like this out there on a baseball field. It's not like there is a supreme umpire dictator who looks at an umpire and goes "you're good, baseball. You're horsesh*t, softball."

Finally, how are you supposed to keep guys interested when the softball they do when starting out is as bad as it is? We occasionally have to share diamond time here with softball programs, and many games of mine have been delayed because the younger ages of players are just walk after walkk after walk after error after walk. That'd bore me to tears.

[mstaylor]

There are many differences in mechanics between softball and baseball, some are necessary, others seem more arbitrary. However, appearance should be the same between sports, the uniforms may be different, but the level of excellence shouldn't. I can only attest to my area and the comparison is not good. Our HS group used to cover both sports with a common assigner. We eventually split for a number of reasons but this was on the list. We had guys showing up in many different types of jackets, hats and pants. It got so bad that one year they were required to come to the test in uniform to prove they owned everything.

[spiritump]

There are many differences in mechanics between softball and baseball, some are necessary, others seem more arbitrary. However, appearance should be the same between sports, the uniforms may be different, but the level of excellence shouldn't. I can only attest to my area and the comparison is not good. Our HS group used to cover both sports with a common assigner. We eventually split for a number of reasons but this was on the list. We had guys showing up in many different types of jackets, hats and pants. It got so bad that one year they were required to come to the test in uniform to prove they owned everything.

I bet even those softball umpire used more than one pair of pants per season:)

[mstaylor]

Yeah, most of them had at least three pairs of grey to red pants. There was even a pair of grey fade to whites. :)

[UMP45]

Guys I'm not talking about on the field as much as just standing there observing them in meetings in regular clothes.

[Majordave]

Guys I'm not talking about on the field as much as just standing there observing them in meetings in regular clothes.

I was going to stay out of this one but after this last comment by UMP45 I was reminded of a time/story and I have to tell it:

At my first NCAA Baseball Umpires Meeting in Atlanta about three years ago I went out to eat with my family at a restaurant near our hotel. The place was packed. We waited a while and I noticed a specifically "sports/Jock" oriented crowd- Ball team hats, sweatshirts from various colleges and professional teams in multiple sports. The language was a bit "salty" and the crowd was unusually loud. But, it WAS NOT a sports bar, per se. I normally don't notice things like that but it was just wild. I couldn't help but overhear some of the conversations due to the loud volume of the participants and the fact that the language was starting to concern me as I had my wife and ten year old daughter with me. I then noticed the conversation closest and thus loudest to us was about umpiring. But something didn't feel right. I didn't recognize any of the men nearby and the style of dress, personal physical appearance levels and general demeanor of most of them was definitely a much lower level than I had encountered at the Baseball event I was attending (We all wore coat and tie at baseball meetings and I was still in mine at dinner due to late running meetings that afternoon/evening and starving family).

Eventually, I went to restroom and asked a couple of guys talking umpiring if they were at NCAA Baseball Umpire meetings and they said "No, NCAA Softball Umpire Meetings". Turns out that the Softball meetings were being conducted simultaneously at a neighboring hotel across the parking lot from our meeting at the Airport Marriott.

Anyway, to add a long comment to UMP45s discussion-YES, I did notice, there was/is a definite difference to me- At least that weekend. End of story number one.

Then, later that season, my high school association had ONE umpire-member who also worked softball and I drew a game with him. He was late to the game, had the wrong uniform shirt, (baby blue-wrinkled like he used it for pajamas-with red/white/blue and VERY faded numbers), excessive jewelry on the field (rings on both hands -big ones, gold bracelet and watch with short sleeve shirt, earrings, flashy "high fashion" style mirror/chrome frame sunglasses) and the single worst looking pair of pants (pinkish purple) and shoes (could have polished them with a Hershey Bar and a Brillo pad-to quote my Drill Sergeant from my Basic Training days in the Army) that I have ever seen on a certified umpire. Turns out he didn't take the level II exam for baseball either and got fired after our game and my report to our assigner afterwards. During the game he crossed me up on several signals, was out of position, didn't rotate to home and used an indicator on the bases. He umpired with a toothpick in his mouth and wore his hat back on his head like he was driving a tractor or a lawn mower. We had to pregame on the field after plate meeting...... I was so pissed. The only thing positive I can say about that particular experience with him was that he was in good physical shape. Thus my report to the assigner and the summarization stating that I would never work with him again.

Just my personal rant about my limited experiences with "some" softball umpires. I know this characterization is not representative of all softball umpires but enough of an experience for me to state that I will never work that sport with guys like that. Sorry if this offends, not my intention but just my personal observations and experiences as honestly and detailed as I can share.

My two cents.....

[Umpire in Chief]

From my perspective (Danger -- Focus group of 1) on average the softball folks don't appear to have the same level of dedication and passion for their sport as the average baseball guy I see.

[BigZigBlue]

From my perspective (Danger -- Focus group of 1) on average the softball folks don't appear to have the same level of dedication and passion for their sport as the average baseball guy I see.

AGREED WARREN!!!! But there are some guys that do both, which are usually baseball guys doing softball instead of softball guys doing baseball. I had a guy ask me about the difference between the two sports. He wanted to know what was the difference in the style of umpiring in it. I told him in baseball its laid back, slower paced, and you can be creative in how you make your calls; but in softball you are simply a robot out there....this is shown when you watch any NCAA softball game!! Which I know you guys aren't looking at how the umpires call anyway!!!!!

[sdix00]

During my first few years with the local Little League, we used a local association composed mostly of Softball Umpires (Adult Softball is pretty big) hired to call our 12U and 10U baseball games. The experience was less than pleasurable. Even though there was a time limit on our games, they still got every out they could find. They called balks on 10 year olds, sent runners back to TOP on foul tips, and even called my runner out for not touching home (no appeal). Not that you have to be a Softball Umpire to get these rules wrong, just saying that this association seemed to be comprised of guys who just didn't care much about getting better from game to game.

I did not know that this association handled mostly Softball until I joined the BoD two years later. The VP at the time (no UIC in place) decided to drop them as our primary supplier of umpires and go with volunteers and no training program. Another rough road which lead to eventually hiring the local SB association again. This was so disheartening because nearly every conversation with these umpires was either a rules misapplication or about how much money they were not making.

Unofficially, I started to recruit a couple guys and draft my sons in to service. Needless to say the quality improved because the new guys took the job seriously. Some, like my boys did not have the training, but were able to benefit from the experienced and caring guys I was able to recruit. Managers requested my sons and groaned when Mr. Softball rumbled on to the field.

Finally, last year (6 years in the league now) I was appointed UIC and what was my first act? Go find a guy who knew way more than I did about Recruiting, Training, and Umpiring in general and make him be the new UIC. The new UIC's first act? He interviewed the SB association rep and asked him "Where do you find your umpires?" The rep answered, "Anywhere and everywhere." My new UIC rolled his eyes and thanked the rep for his time. We still have a ways to go, but I feel we are on the right track and there is simply no room in a learning league for guys who refuse to learn.

So, not a commentary on NCAA Softball umpires vs NCAA Baseball umpires. I would not be able to contribute to that one. BUT, given the choice between an Adult Softball Umpire who has been calling games for 20 years and can't be bothered to challenge himself to learn something new, and a 13 year old kid who learns because, well, that's what 13 year old kids do all day anyway, the choice is obvious to me.

[LMSANS]

From my perspective (Danger -- Focus group of 1) on average the softball folks don't appear to have the same level of dedication and passion for their sport as the average baseball guy I see.

AGREED WARREN!!!! But there are some guys that do both, which are usually baseball guys doing softball instead of softball guys doing baseball. I had a guy ask me about the difference between the two sports. He wanted to know what was the difference in the style of umpiring in it. I told him in baseball its laid back, slower paced, and you can be creative in how you make your calls; but in softball you are simply a robot out there....this is shown when you watch any NCAA softball game!! Which I know you guys aren't looking at how the umpires call anyway!!!!!

Obviously you have never been to a national clinic for softball. I do both, about an 80/20 split in favor of baseball. I use the same call mechanic on everything except the strike. ASA has a slightly different definition of the mechanic than baseball. I, for one, am not a big fan of the showmanship exhibited by many (most?) baseball umpires. They gripe about a player/coach "showing them up", then they do a dance to show up a batter on a called strike.

I do get frustrated at my ASA association meetings over the appearance and attitude of the softball only umpires.