Scotty_Ump

Another FED situation I've had this year. Pitcher's throwing in the windup w/ pivot foot parallel to the pitchers plate and rocking back with their non-pivot foot towards 1B. I see this during warmup throws and tell F1 to throw from the windup legally. The head coach did not know why it was illegal "because that was okay the game before..."

Thanks for bringing that up. I help my local association with clinic training and local association meetings. I'm coming up with presentation topics for next season and one of them is consistent rules enforcement from a coaches perspective - with specific examples. While coaches whining "that hasn't been called all year!" isn't always believable, coaches get frustrated when legitimate and obvious rule violations that have NEVER been called are then addressed by an umpire mid or late season. Then it really can be an issue in the playoffs, especially the later rounds with officials are under added scrutiny.

NFHS Varsity game, bottom 1st. The starting pitcher had been using the windup legally for 2-3 pitches. On a 2-strike count, after stepping back with his non-pivot foot, he came to a complete stop -frozen like a marble statue for 1-2 seconds - before continuing his delivery. Probably trying to disrupt batter's timing. As the base umpire in A, I called time, called an illegal pitch, and added a ball to the count. When I walked toward the mound to explain, the HC - a coach I've had a good relationship with over several years - immediately said, "He's been doing that all year!" I honestly believe him. I'd bet no umpire had addressed that pitcher completely stopping mid-windup. And while that's not my problem - prior non-enforcement doesn't change the rules - it got me thinking about the broader issue. There must be rules that coaches are justifiably frustrated about, not because the rule may be unclear, but because umpire enforcement is so inconsistent they genuinely don't know what to expect. A few that come to mind right now: Pitchers wearing white or gray below the elbow / white or gray on the glove Fielders wearing play sheet wristbands on their belts Running lane violations What rules do you think belong here? And do you think inconsistency is more of an attention problem (umpires not noticing violations), an ambiguity problem (the rule itself is unclear or isn't covered well in local meetings or clinics) or an appeasement problem (the umpire doesn't want to be the "bad guy" by enforcing it)?

I appreciate everybody's feedback! I'm taking @NavyBlue's idea to my association board about reimbursing members who both complete the full course and work a minimum amount of games during the high school season.

I've been following the Umpire Classroom YouTube channel since it started in 2021, and they've recently launched paid online courses for both new and experienced baseball officials. https://www.umpireclassroom.com/ Has anyone here purchased either course yet? If so, do you find the content quality is as good or better than the YouTube videos? Or is anybody here considering becoming an "affiliate partner" and offer these courses to officials within your local association?

Thanks for all your feedback! This thread took an unexpected turn when I read runners could be called out for passing a lead runner even in a dead-ball situation. But the home run example makes perfect sense, I guess I had never thought of it that way... Just so I understand - if the BR had passed R1 immediately after the ball bounded into DBT, by rule B-R is out for passing a lead runner? And the reasoning there is because runners are awarded 2 bases they cannot pass each other while completing their awards? And to complicate things more... Let's say that B-R passes R1 on a fly ball hit down the RF line and subsequently the ball lands in foul territory. Does the penalty still apply if the passing occurs on a ball in flight before it becomes foul? I ask because in the OP that ball was fair by about 2' so this easily could have been the outcome of that play.

18u, NFHS rules, R1, 0 outs. 2-man crew and I'm in B. The batter hits a long fly ball down the RF line. R1 takes off for 2B and is touching the bag when the 1B Coach yells "get back" because F9 is bearing down on the ball. R1 sprints 3/4 of the way back to 1B when B-R clearly passes him rounding 1B. Once I see the pass, I point to the B-R and call him out for passing a lead runner. And while the pass is happening, F9 misses the ball, it lands in fair territory on the warning track, and quickly bounds over the outfield wall for a ground-rule double. We then awarded R1 3B. The call somewhat confused the OT since they hadn't seen a passing runners situation before. OTHC was great though and had no issue with the explanation we gave him about the ruling. This also was the first time I can recall calling a runner out for passing another runner. From my view in the working area, I saw the runners pass just after the ball hit the ground but before it went over the fence because (luckily?) I had both the runners and the ball in my line of sight. I was expecting an argument from the OTHC like "How can you call my runner out when the ball is out of play?" but he never brought that up. And since my partner was focused on the ball, he told me later he hadn't noticed the runners passing so he wouldn't have had anything for me if we did get together on timing of the pass vs. timing of the ball crossing over the outfield fence. So just an interesting combination of circumstances I never had before in a game... welcome any feedback on how I handled it and anything I should have done differently.

So we know this situation happened at an MLB game. But I'm curious what we do here under FED rules... IMO - I'm calling the runner out for attempting to leap over a fielder. But no ejection because I don't have malicious contact. The biggest takeaway I have is officials should carry Tasers. But for coaches ONLY. It's the step we take after restriction but before ejection. Ignore. Acknowledge. Warn. Restrict. Taser! Taser! Taser! Eject.

I’m watching the White Sox vs. Cardinals game tonight on MLB.com and this ad showed up while I was reading this thread.

O’Nora would wave to the press box when a new pitcher or a PH entered the game if that’s what you mean.

I went to the Orioles vs. Guardians game last Friday. During the plate meeting I saw Brian O'Nora handing Nestor Ceja what looked liked duplicates of the teams' lineup cards. Nestor put them in his pocket before jogging out to 3B and I noticed him take them out during substitutions. Just curious if anyone here knows what that's about. In MLB does the 3B umpire also keeps track of lineup changes - like a "backup" to the HP umpire in case any changes are missed? 🤔

Open to everybody but I'm particularly interested here in feedback from both coaches on this site and officials here who also coach / have coached youth baseball. Do you try to remember officials' names at the plate meeting and call them by name during the game (instead of "ump" or "blue")? Why or why not? Do you teach your players to call officials by their first names or by a generic title like "sir" (instead of "ump" or "blue")? Why or why not? Does it matter to you if an official calls you by name or only addresses you as "coach" throughout the game? Why or why not? Do you find officials have a more positive relationship (generally defined as more "deferential and respectful" vs. "argumentative and confrontational") with you and your players during a game - or throughout a season - when first names are used either by you towards officials or by officials towards you.

@cwbaseball11 - In 2021 I went with LUCs (over Team Wendy) for my Diamond and loved them. They’re 100% worth the cost, fit the mask perfectly and look great.

Got the 2023 Referee Umpires Training Catalog in the mail today. I'll usually get the NFHS Rules by Topic whenever there's a major rule update (like the P/DH change), and I bought the CCA Manual from them in 2019. Any recommendations on other baseball resources they offer? Everything Baseball Pitchers Can and Can’t Do and Say What? How to Respond to Baseball Players and Coaches look interesting - has anybody read these and found them valuable? https://store.referee.com/baseball

Simply was thanking a fellow umpire this morning for weighing in. I’ve been working games from 12pm-7pm today so haven’t had much time to follow the thread. I very much appreciate the case book citations you and @JonnyCat mention. I did read the 8.3.3 case play this morning but was concerned that it only pertained to a pitched ball, not a thrown one. Thanks for adding the NFHS interpretations.

Great pics! That's crazy how you can see each photographer in the background of the other's photo. 🤯

Had this situation come up last night. FED rules. No runners on. Batter grounds to F6, who throws wild to F3 and the ball gets away and is rolling towards a dugout opening. F3 chases after it, manages to grasp the ball in LBT, but his momentum carries him down into the dugout. The batter-runner occupies 1B when F3 enters DBT. What is the award and where do you place the runner? In that game, I gave a 2 base award and placed the runner on 3B. My thinking in the moment was the fielder's act to grasp the ball to prevent the ball from entering the dugout is a "subsequent play" and once he enters DBT the award is given from the base the runner occupies at the time the fielder enters DBT. Just want to make sure I handled this situation correctly and, if not, what rule or case book situation would apply here?

After 3 assignments that were rained / snowed out, I finally got in my first game of the season this morning. HS Varsity, I'm on the dish. Bottom 1st, no outs. SP starts off with back-to-back filthy curveballs for called strikes. Next pitch, batter whiffs on a high-in fastball. Frustrated batter then sends his bat flying towards his bench and starts walking away while I'm giving him the ejection mechanic with an emphatic "you're gone." HC knew it too, he didn't even try to go down the "why didn't you give a warning?" path. Nothing else happened and game went on as normal. That's easily the earliest ejection I've ever had to start a season. I just wanted to dust the winter cobwebs off - didn't see that one coming today.

I’m a little late to this thread, but this is absolutely the BEST sentence I’ve ever read on this forum. This should be quoted on page 1 in every umpire manual.

Now that’s a video I’m looking forward to. MLB has got to either mic up the crew chief to announce replay decisions or have a “comms director” umpire in NY who can cut into broadcasts to explain the mechanics of plays like this one to broadcast team. Side question: are retired umpires somehow “forbidden” from taking jobs at FOX or MLB Network to do for broadcasts what retired NFL refs are doing on FOX and CBS?

Interesting situation from BOS vs. TOR earlier today... https://www.mlb.com/video/alex-verdugo-safe-after-review-x1733 Question: how would the replay review have turned out had Gurriel caught the ball AND held the bag AFTER Verdugo passed 1B? Wouldn't TOR need to legally appeal the missed base before Verdugo returned to get an out here?

Appreciate all the feedback from everyone. Like I mentioned in the OP, this sitch is a first for me and getting multiple perspectives is helpful. Some of the situations we talk about on this forum are HTBT and it's tough to convey all the context.

@JimKirk, thanks for taking time to clarify that!

@Scissors - I thought the same thing when I ordered the replacement pads through UA. After I got the pads in the mail and saw the color, I went back to UA website and read these subtle description differences in the pads. I think there are 2 different deerskin pad colors. @JimKirk, do my eyes deceive me? #FM4000MAG-UMP-BK/TN Description: #FM4000MAG-RP-DS Description:

This situation has never happened to me in a game in 14 years. Has anyone here dealt a similar situation? How did you handle it? 14u tournament game, semi final, FED rules. I'm PU. Home team on 1B side had a Bluetooth speaker with them and played music between innings or when new F1 was tossing warm-up pitches in the middle of an inning. No "walk up" music. (Personally, I'm not a fan when teams do this period but unless a TD says something or maybe somehow music is being played in an unsporting manner, I wouldn't get involved.) Most music was Hip-Hop / Top 40 genre. You could tell lyrics were being censored. Then between 3th-4th inning, I'm standing up the 1B line watching warm-up throws as music plays when I'm like, "Did I just heard the n-word?" ~5 seconds later, there it was again. Plus two more words following that which could get a radio station fined by the FCC. I turned to the bench, looked at the HC and made a couple throat-slashing motions while telling him to turn the music off. He walked out to talk with me and I told him what I heard. He replied sheepishly, "Yeah, that's not my playlist". Turns out an adult next to the bench (I'm guessing a player's dad) was controlling the music from a tablet. He must have seen my reaction because as the coach was coming out to talk to me the music stopped. I told the coach to cut out the music for the rest of the game. (I could rant about this coach showing zero responsibility or leadership, but that's not what we're talking about here...). That team won the semi-final and played the final the next game. My partner and I switched up for that game. We could hear them playing music as we changed in the parking lot and figured they had learned their lesson and we wouldn't have problems during the final. After all, I never had that happen once in hundreds of games. I mean, c'mon, what are the chances it would happen again? So this team made a pitching change around the 2nd or 3rd inning. While I was hanging out in deep C, they're playing their music. And mid-song now we've got some rapper yelling out "my n-word" about 5-6 times in a row. I'm stepping towards their bench ready to go off on the HC and the adult running the music, when some other fans yell out "turn that off!" and the music shuts off. I was pretty hot and probably did the prudent thing in that moment to walk back and get back to baseball. That team ended up getting run-ruled by 15 in 4 innings so there's that. Looking back, I wish I had handled this differently. I think my biggest mistake may have been not telling that HC at final game pregame conference to keep the music off. I'm also curious if anyone would have EJ'd the HC during the semi or final game or asked the HC or TD to have the fan controlling the music sent to the parking lot. In my mind, if you can't say a word on the field you can't play it on a speaker. Especially that word. Have at it...