I did my part.

[HokieUmp]

Babe Ruth tournament, I was U3.  R2, 2 out.  Ball is hit to the shortstop.  Since I'm in C, I'm right there, and I see the runner dodge the ball as he's running, and of course, F6 doesn't field it the cleanest, and the end result is no out is made.  I see the DC coming out to talk to the plate guy, and I know where this is going.  Since it was about 95 degrees at 11:30 in the morning. I wait for him to come to me - since my plate guy rightfully sends him my way.  As he's walking - he's a big man - I hear something from the dugout area along the lines of "giving the fielder a chance to field it," so I'm thinking the discussion is going to be how the runner screened the fielder, and was preparing for that conversation.

[Mind you, I actually executed the play properly:  I looked for the contact, saw none, and actually ALSO remembered to signal safe and call out "That's nothing!"  So that's another reason I figure we're going to chat about a screen.]

DC: "If that ball hit the runner, wouldn't he be out?"     Wuhhht?

Me:  "I didn't have that - that's why I signaled 'That's nothing.'"

"Couldn't you appeal that?"     Wuhhht?  <--- I realize that's pedantic, but words have meaning, and 'appeal' has a specific one.

"No.  I'm the closest umpire to the play.  Why would I ask someone farther away for help?"

"He had the better angle.  Can you ask him?"

"No.  I own that call.  I had it."

"Well, I.... okay.  .......  Um, okay."    Exit, and scene.

So, yesterday at least, I did my part for umpires that follow me.  JUST BECAUSE A COACH ASKS YOU TO GET HELP, DOESN'T MEAN YOU HAVE TO GET HELP is the moral of that story, and the 'coach version' of that is JUST BECAUSE YOU WANT HELP, DOESN'T MEAN YOU'RE GETTING IT.  Notice, for any "yeah, but" objections that might ensue:

1.  No one got ejected.

2.  No one got mad.

3.  He wasn't treated "arrogantly;"  he was just told matter-of-factly that I wasn't getting help from anyone on a call that happened right in front of me.  I saw no contact, and the ball's path to the fielder gave me no evidence to the contrary.  A fielder f---ing up a ground ball play, in the 13 to 15 age range, is not necessary and sufficient proof that something else untoward happened.

4.  No wordy discussions or explanations.

You're welcome, future umpires in the Peninsula area of Tidewater Virginia.  And umpires everywhere! [A flag icon would go here, if I had one.]

[LittleBlue]

While you did your part, and good on you for that, I bet you that coach asks the next guy to get help and he does thus keeping the problem going. Change on this issue has to start at the umpire level so more guys know what calls they should and should not get help on.

[umpire_scott]

I had he converse of that, sort of.  Two-man, I'm in "C".  Ground ball to F6, R2 runs in front. F6 is about 6 feet behind the R2 and coming in.  He fields the ball with a slight bobble and throws the BR out at first.  As I trot back to "C" I here my partner telling the now R3 that he is out.  What?  He says "the ball hit him".  I'm thinking I was right there and the ball did not hit him.  We get together to confer and he is adamant that he was looking at it the whole time and the ball glanced off R2.  Well I don't feel I can tell him that he didn't see what he said he saw, so we rule R2 out.  I was right there and I'm 99% certain the ball never touched the runner.

[Jimurray]

1 hour ago, umpire_scott said:

I had he converse of that, sort of.  Two-man, I'm in "C".  Ground ball to F6, R2 runs in front. F6 is about 6 feet behind the R2 and coming in.  He fields the ball with a slight bobble and throws the BR out at first.  As I trot back to "C" I here my partner telling the now R3 that he is out.  What?  He says "the ball hit him".  I'm thinking I was right there and the ball did not hit him.  We get together to confer and he is adamant that he was looking at it the whole time and the ball glanced off R2.  Well I don't feel I can tell him that he didn't see what he said he saw, so we rule R2 out.  I was right there and I'm 99% certain the ball never touched the runner.

So there was no "time, that's interference, you, you're out, you 1B" from your partner?

[umpire_scott]

19 hours ago, Jimurray said:

So there was no "time, that's interference, you, you're out, you 1B" from your partner?

If there was I ddin't hear it. 

[HokieUmp]

On 7/16/2016 at 0:12 PM, LittleBlue said:

While you did your part, and good on you for that, I bet you that coach asks the next guy to get help and he does thus keeping the problem going. Change on this issue has to start at the umpire level so more guys know what calls they should and should not get help on.

You're not wrong.  And the problem is:  guys on this board either already know that, or WANT to get better, and be better.  The people that need to hear the "just 'cause they ask, doesn't mean you have to" message aren't here.

[umpire_scott]

1 minute ago, HokieUmp said:

You're not wrong.  And the problem is:  guys on this board either already know that, or WANT to get better, and be better.  The people that need to hear the "just 'cause they ask, doesn't mean you have to" message aren't here.

And the other problem are tournament directors that get paid by the teams so they want to keep teams happy so they pressure umpires to "get help" as a way to pacify the coaches.

[KenBAZ]

As with many other things, the umpires on this board who have gotten the, "just 'cause they ask, doesn't mean you have to" message have to model it and serve as examples for others.

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

[umpire_scott]

And I think it is imperative that coaches are made aware of this.  It is probably not appropriate for umpires to make them aware during a game situation, but I do believe many coaches truly think that when an umpire rightfully declines "getting help" they are being stubborn and when one does go to discuss it they are being professional and humble. That is how the coaches and parents perceive it.  So there is some value to going to your partner talking about who is buying beer after the game and then sticking with the call.  But the detriment this causes is far more than the value of pacifying a coach.  Coaches need to be aware that umpires are trained to only go for help if they need it.  The umpire in the best position to make the call is the one making it.

And the coaches and parents I'm talking about are below high school level for the most part.  Coaches that get paid already know these things and they are trying to get an edge when they ask an umpire to get help.