Pitching Substitution

[Bumps]

JV game, FED rules.

F1, replaced in 3rd inning. F2 replaced in 4th inning. In 5th inning coach wants to put the original F2 on the mound, but leave in the new catcher. I let him know he can't do this, that the starter must re-enter in the same spot. He understands. Here is the sitch. During our discussion, the pitcher had taken warm up pitches. Once he realized he could not make this switch without removing his new F2, he pulled the pitcher from the mound and brought another fielder in.

Since warm pitches were thrown, should I have had the coach remove the catcher, since the NEW F1, was the original catcher? Hope this makes some sense.

I allowed the Coach to remove the pitcher and bring a new one in. The opposing team did not even question what was happening. Just really curious as to how this should have been handled, as I feel like I missed something.

[Jocko]

Reference 3-1-2

[Bumps]

Thanks Jocko. That I messed that one up. Was hoping that somehow, my talking to the coach, bought me something (time) to be able to disallow the illegal sub.

Seems like I messed this one up

[grayhawk]

Since this was an announced substitution, the new F1 has to face one batter until he is out, or reaches base.  If there was no announcement, then the new F1 isn't official until the ball is made live (3-1-1b).  You could then allow the coach to remove without requiring him to face a batter. You should not put the ball into play if you know the new F1 is an illegal substitute (re-entering in the wrong spot in the batting order).

[noumpere]

Since this was an announced substitution, the new F1 has to face one batter until he is out, or reaches base.  If there was no announcement, then the new F1 isn't official until the ball is made live (3-1-1b).  You could then allow the coach to remove without requiring him to face a batter. You should not put the ball into play if you know the new F1 is an illegal substitute (re-entering in the wrong spot in the batting order).

I don't see this as an announced sub yet.

 

Stop it when you see the new pitcher going out and or when the coach comes to you to tell you of the change.

 

and, if he's out there and he's alreeady in the game, then its an illegal sub and an ejection (or restriction) and the "must pitch to one batter" rule doesn't apply.

[Bumps]

It was not an announced sub yet. Player went to mound, coach was coming to me to announce, I saw what he was trying to do. Told him he could not do it. By that time the relief pitcher had thrown 2 warm up pitches.

Just trying to figure out how to stop this from happening again.

[grayhawk]

It was not an announced sub yet. Player went to mound, coach was coming to me to announce, I saw what he was trying to do. Told him he could not do it. By that time the relief pitcher had thrown 2 warm up pitches.

Just trying to figure out how to stop this from happening again.

 

If he was unannounced, then the warm ups pitches do not mean that he has to face a batter.  An unannounced F1 is only required to pitch to a batter if toes the rubber and you put the ball into play.  As you describe it, you handled it properly.

[Jocko]

It was not an announced sub yet. Player went to mound, coach was coming to me to announce, I saw what he was trying to do. Told him he could not do it. By that time the relief pitcher had thrown 2 warm up pitches.Just trying to figure out how to stop this from happening again.

all you can do is remind him that what he's attempting isn't possible. He'll (hopefully) understand right off and make a proper F1 change right then. Therefore, you've averted any penalties and the other coach can be appeased with the explanation.