woodiemiller

A bad throw that would have stayed on the field of play if the gate was closed! How many pitched balls into the inning did you as the plate umpire or field umpire have to check the field prior to putting the ball into play. Bottom line is weather or not the coaches complied with what they agreed to at the plate meeting it is the officials job to put their head on a swivel and take a quick glance around. Not to hard to call time, step out and tell the coach to close that gate. My feeling is that blame for the zoo play you are describing rests with the guy wearing the gear... Either eat it and award bases or don't but once the line ups are handed to me at the plate I have full responsibility for the field and its condition regardless of plate meeting discussions. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk If you read the original situation, the gate in question is on the OUTFIELD SIDE of each dugout. Its the teams responsibility to keep gates shut, not the umpires. That is not a "zoo" play. A "zoo" play would be "On the 3rd Friday of the month which happened to be Friday the 13th, bases loaded, 2 outs, a full count on the batter and the team at bat is down 1 run. The pitcher pitches & the lights go off. Whats the ruling?"

Its not just about a rule. Its about an unfair advantage to the offense because the offense did not do what they were responsible for by keeping a gate closed. Dont use the rule book as a crutch. Not everything is addressed in a rule book. Do you call a strike zone according to the definition? Do you believe in the "vicinity" call? Im sure there are things that you do that are not addressed in the rule book.

You're making up rules. A ball that goes over, through or under a fence is out of play. Follow the rules for balls that go into DBT. Do you agree that we own the field once we get on it? If so, than the gate being open is on the crew and the batting team gains an unfair advantage by leaving the gate open. Not creating any rules, exercising my judgement. Explain that one to the DC, I guess we would say "sorry coach did not catch that gate being open so batting team gets a run due to my error?" We as umpires do not "OWN" any field once we get on it. Do the judges own the courtrooms when they sit on the bench? No.

A bad throw that would have stayed on the field of play if the gate was closed!

You're making up rules. A ball that goes over, through or under a fence is out of play. Follow the rules for balls that go into DBT. Do you agree that we own the field once we get on it? If so, than the gate being open is on the crew and the batting team gains an unfair advantage by leaving the gate open. Not creating any rules, exercising my judgement. Explain that one to the DC, I guess we would say "sorry coach did not catch that gate being open so batting team gets a run due to my error?" They're the ones that messed up. They overthrew 3B. Pick your analogy: Golf, play it as it lies; Law, you take your victims as you find them. While they may not have been responsible for the playing conditions, they're the conditions at the time. No the crew messed up by not catching the gate being open. We can not just ignore that fact. It is missed sometimes, bat left on field, gate left open... Usually happens on the lower level games and not Varsity but in this case that was presented, if I was UIC on the field that is exactly how I would have handeled it. However, I did ask you guys to rip me apart. Have a good night. Although I respectfully disagree with you about the part that its the crews job to make sure all gates are closed every minute of the game. Thats why its brought up at pregame. Just dont reward an offensive team when their gate is open & a ball goes directly through it.

You're making up rules. A ball that goes over, through or under a fence is out of play. Follow the rules for balls that go into DBT. Do you agree that we own the field once we get on it? If so, than the gate being open is on the crew and the batting team gains an unfair advantage by leaving the gate open. Not creating any rules, exercising my judgement. Explain that one to the DC, I guess we would say "sorry coach did not catch that gate being open so batting team gets a run due to my error?" It is not the umpires responsibility to make sure each teams gates are closed every minute the game is played. That is why it is brought up at pre-game. Do not reward a team for not doing what theyre responsible for doing which is keeping their gate closed. if they keep it open when theyre on defense, thats their problem. But offense? That is where they gain an unfair advantage!

Its not about ejecting. It was stated at the pregame that each team is responsible for their own gate. Dont U see how its such an unfair advantage? The rule book & case books do NOT cover every play, situation nor turn of events that could ever happen in a baseball game. Use your mind. Stop trying to blame everything on the rule book for your decisions. Is your strike zone the same by definition according to the rule book? It better be according to you. Do you give the "vicinity" call at 2b? Better not according to you. Im sure there are things you do that are NOT by the book. Do you ever come down in between innings to talk to your partner? Do you ever fraternize with coaches, players, fans or other umpires during a game?

Spot on labguy. I like your reasoning because it verifies an umpires job to be FAIR & to hold teams accountable for their responsibilities. Well put. A+

You're making up rules. A ball that goes over, through or under a fence is out of play. Follow the rules for balls that go into DBT. The rule book allows umpires to address issues that are not specified in the rule book! This is one of those issues. Try thinking for yourself a little bit. The rule book is a set of guide lines, it is not the bible.

You left out a parenthesis and you left out who opened the gate and when. Actually I don't think any of that matters. So, all you can do is point out a typo? Really? that adds to the discussion how exactly? Who opened the gate & when? That doesnt matter. It only matters its their responsibility to keep gates closed ESPECIALLY when their respective team is on the field other wise it becomes an unfair advantage if the ball goes through.

Think for yourself a minute. Umpires job is to make sure to be FAIR. Keeping a gate open when your team is up is having an unfair advantage if the ball goes through! Just because the rule book doesnt address every case scenario, doesnt mean you cant use your own discretion of "fair play". The rule book should be used to solve problems, not create them.

Because the ball would remain on the playing field had the gate been CLOSED! Its an unfair advantage to leave a gate open that you are responsible for when YOUR team is batting. Think about it. We as umpires are all about FAIR play. How is that fair? Whats to keep a team from keeping the gate open every time theyre up to bat but make sure its closed when they are on the field? Just because the rulebook doesnt mention EVERY SINGLE case play, doesnt mean you cannot use your own personal discretion. Thats NOT our responsibility. Do you go around & check to make sure every player is wearing a cup too?

Yes, home teams coach brings it up @ pre game. Its BOTH teams responsibility to keep their respective gates CLOSED. If they dont when their team is up to bat, its an UNFAIR advantage if the ball goes thru the opening. Thats the whole point of this. Your point was just ignore it?

You're making up rules. A ball that goes over, through or under a fence is out of play. Follow the rules for balls that go into DBT. Does the rulebook not say something to the effect of any anything not covered, an umpire may rule on using his own?????

Pregame meeting, both coaches are informed that there are gates that they are responsible for on the outfield sides of their respective dugouts. Bases loaded with no outs & the team whos dugout is on the #B side, is up to bat. Doesnt matter the level. Fly ball to normal depth CF, who makes the catch while R3 tags LEGALLY from 3B. R2 tags but decides to go back to 2B. Meanwhile, the throw goes to 3rd base where the ball goes over the 3rd basemans head, bounces in the grass area & proceeds to go THROUGH THE OPEN GATE & had the gate been closed, the ball easily stays on the field of play. Question, because the batting team left open the gate (please do not say "a good umpire would have seen this & told them to close it before the inning started"), that in itself is NOT the issue here, would you award the runner on second base home because the ball went through the opened gate?

Its just a self reminder that there are 2 strikes. Just like some will call out "Ball......2". Not a major issue at all.

During a college post season game, 3 man, my U1 had R1 on base with less than 2 outs. Pitcher throws to 1B in an effort to pick off the runner. He gets the ball there so long before the runner gets back that the 1B swipes at the runner & misses completely because the runner was that slow or that far off! My partner calls him "Out!" The 3B coach yells over, "Larry, he never tagged him!" Larry replies, "I didn't say he tagged him, I called him OUT!" 1) Don't get too cute on tag plays. 2) Don't reward bad base running.

ONLY the umpire can "call" time. Every one else is only requesting/asking for time. Its the umpire who calls "Time".

As I have stated, it is hard to read "SARCASM" when its in print media. I even complimented whoever it was who posted the line, "Use the rulebook to solve problems, not create problems."

How was I being a jerk or condescending? I was simply making a point. Talk about being condescending. You try lecturing me when we both know it is hard to read "sarcasm" when it involves print media.

Running lane doesn't matter. Intent does. Really? Since when? How can you read "intent"? So if F3 makes a bad throw from FOUL territory and it hits the BR, you are going to reward a bad throw? LOL

I dont agree. 3B line extended can block you out from the catchers body. So you would rather be...........?? 1B line extended?

Maven, Thats like saying "obstruction is usually against the defense while usually interference is against the offense." Thats not true & Live ball/dead ball is not just about the player.

Fair/foul is about the ball. Live ball/dead ball is about the player (usually about his feet). So when a ball is thrown or hit into DBT its about the player? LOL

1000 unemployed wannabe comedians out of work & I swear they are ALL on this site!