Break Away Base Inadvertently Dislodged by Defense on Putout Attempt

[Velho]

Had a "that's new" play this morning. R1, 1 out, short fly ball to RF, R1 holds up, ball falls in front of F9, attempted F9-F4 putout. F4 stretches and break away bases dislodges. F4 catches ball off the bag, BU called R1 safe.

I looked into the RIM (2023, don't have newer though I doubt there is an applicable change) and can only find the below about it dislodging from a runner and how the runner can be protected.

Am curious if anyone had encountered this? I feel fine about the call. You can't penalize the offense for something the defense did (even if inadvertent). I can see an argument that says  Out because F4 was where the bag belonged but that feels like a stretch.

Overall, "tough break coach and get the bag fixed" (the mooring is too low so the magnet isn't touching the bag) makes sense to me.

 

[The Man in Blue]

Going to dissent again … for any breakaway bag, you should use the location of where it should be, not where it ended up, for everybody.  Doesn’t matter who knocked it loose.

It’s an equipment rule, not an actions of the player rule.  

[SeeingEyeDog]

55 minutes ago, The Man in Blue said:

Going to dissent again … for any breakaway bag, you should use the location of where it should be, not where it ended up, for everybody.  Doesn’t matter who knocked it loose.

It’s an equipment rule, not an actions of the player rule.  

I support your dissent...this is absolutely correct.

~Dawg

[Velho]

2 hours ago, SeeingEyeDog said:

3 hours ago, The Man in Blue said:

Going to dissent again … for any breakaway bag, you should use the location of where it should be, not where it ended up, for everybody.  Doesn’t matter who knocked it loose.

It’s an equipment rule, not an actions of the player rule.  

I support your dissent...this is absolutely correct.

~Dawg

I can follow that.

By rule LL says it's either for the offense. Nothing about the defense. Attaching the cites that didn't come through previously.

The league UIC agreed with my take of not letting the defense make a play in this situation.

[The Man in Blue]

Oof.  Common sense ain’t so common.  
 

There is no specification for how the bag dislodges, so why are we punishing any player for the complex’s faulty (or properly functioning) equipment?  More specifically, why would you punish one side and not the other?

So . . . R2 and R1, nobody out.  Short hop line drive to F6.  R2, thinking it was caught, slides back into 2B and kicks the bag three feet toward the outfield.

F6 tags R2 . . . safe or out?

F6 then wants more outs and . . . steps where the bag should be?  Or are you making him run to the bag’s new location for the force out?

[Velho]

8 minutes ago, The Man in Blue said:

So . . . R2 and R1, nobody out.  Short hop line drive to F6.  R2, thinking it was caught, slides back into 2B and kicks the bag three feet toward the outfield.

F6 tags R2 . . . safe or out?

R2 would be forced so on 2B or not is moot. R2 is OUT.

9 minutes ago, The Man in Blue said:

F6 then wants more outs and . . . steps where the bag should be?  Or are you making him run to the bag’s new location for the force out?

Invoking CS&FP, for the force out of the advancing R1, F6 touching either the spot or the dislodged base (hopefully with intent), needs to be an OUT. (rules doesn't say it's not!  )

I've never included the "Coach, is the field suitable for play today?" in my plate meeting (past the first few weeks rain is a non-issue here), but maybe I'll start to cover this.

 

[Richvee]

You can’t have a rule for the offense and not the defense. If a base is dislodged and it moves from it’s position, if you’re going to allow a following runner to touch the area where the base should be as having touched the base, ( which is indeed a rule) you must allow the fielder to touch  the same area, and if it’s a force only, you must count the out. This seems pretty cut and dry. 
What’s the alternative?  The defense has to run and touch the base wherever it may be to get the force out, while the runner is running to the spot where the base should be?