Tension Between Coach and UIC Impacts Game

[BlueClue]

Well my week keeps getting more interesting.

For context, I previously had an interesting run-in with my local little league's Vice President (see the post below for the full story)

Since then, he had left the board following that incident and I had assumed the role of UIC for the league around the same time. I haven't had a run-in with him until just recently and oh boy was it fun.

Since I was (and still am) out for the foreseeable future after taking a ball to the wrist, I've been doing a lot of supervising and helping some of the newer umpires out. Recently, I went to help two new-ish umpires in their first game of the year. When I arrive at the diamond I notice that one of the coaches is none other then Mr. former VP himself (henceforth known as JA). I listen in on the plate meeting (our league requires an adult present to support the umpires when they are both minors) and I can tell JA hasn't forgotten about that incident. Both teams proceed to their respective dugouts and the game begins.

The first inning goes by fairly uneventfully (the typical little league game where the pitcher's missing 3 feet outside and the batter's swinging his bat like an axe) apart from one thing- JA's players are leading off. Some are waiting until the pitch leaves the hand, some are just leading off from the start, however none of them are waiting for it to reach the batter (see Rule 7.13 of the LL rulebook). Following the inning, the crew comes up asking for some feedback. While they're with me, BU asks for clarification on the rule, which I provide him with. He mentions he noticed it but he wasn't too sure what the proper ruling was.

During the second inning, R1, BU calls a blatant lead off, JA isn't too happy about it the first time but doesn't say anything loud enough to hear. Two pitches later BU calls another blatant lead off on the same runner and JA storms right out of the dugout, attempting to argue the call with BU (using the excuse "he went on a passed ball!"). BU's having none of it and orders JA back to the dugout. While on his way back to the dugout he comes over to me, yelling about how I told him to call it and despite me trying to explain the situation he says "BlueClue you shouldn't even be here!". I snap back "I'm here for my umpires, not for you!" and walk away. Following the inning JA tries to go back over to BU and argue it again (this time stating how they're learning) but PU comes in and corrals him away. The crew meets up with me again and I mention how they had the correct call and that they're in charge of the game, not the coaches (I forgot to mention that both coaches had just been going for mound visits whenever they felt like it, and JA was hovering around the back stop while the ball was LIVE).

Going into the third, the crew cracked down on the inmates running the asylum. However, R2, BU called another blatant lead off and JA came out yet again, making a spectacle on his way out. He tried arguing how it was a passed ball, that his runner was on the bag, and that he was going to get someone to video it for him. At this point BU had enough and ordered him back to the dugout and the inning concluded. I was pissed off at the encounter from the previous inning, and his conduct then made me furious. I told the crew in between innings that his actions were incredibly inappropriate and that they shouldn't be tolerated.

The fourth inning went off without a hitch (with JA's team forfeiting), and following the game I had a little huddle with the crew, giving them some praise and feedback for the game. During which I told them that what happened wasn't their fault and shouldn't have happened. I waited with the umpires until their parents arrived, during which I chatted with BU on how he's one of our best up-and-coming umpires and I wouldn't want to lose him because of people like him. When I arrived back at home, I noticed that BU had sent me an incident report in regards to what occurred. I forwarded it to the League President to sort out with the rest of our disciplinary committee. Usually, I sit on the disciplinary committee and aid in the process, however, seeing my history with JA I excused myself from the process.

I'm well aware that my actions were driven by emotion, but I just really wanted to get it off my chest and hear some second opinions. Any feedback or criticism would be appreciated!

-Blue

[Mudisfun]

You say LL, so I am going on the assumption this is an actual LL and not just one using 'most' of their rules. I am also going on the assumption that both of your umpires were minors (junior) umpires and that you were at the game site as the Game Coordinator.

9.03(d) If no adult umpire is available for a game, and non-adult umpires are used exclusively for that game, the local Little League must assign an adult as Game Coordinator, or the game cannot be played. The Game Coordinator must not be a manager or coach of either team in the game, and cannot be assigned as Game Coordinator for more than one game at a time. The Game Coordinator's duties shall be:

(1) To be included in the pregame meeting as noted in Rule 4.01:

(2) To remain present at the game at all times, including between half-innings, in a position to see all actions on the field and in close proximity to the field (not in any enclosure). If, for some reason, the Game Coordinator is not present or is unable to perform his/her duties for any reason, the game must be suspended until the Game Coordinator returns, or until a new adult Game Coordinator is present and assumes the duties of Game Coordinator for the remainder of the game;

(3) To oversee the conduct of all players, managers, coaches, and umpires in the game;

(4) To have the authority to disqualify any player, coach, manager, or substitute for objecting to the decisions of an umpire, for unsportsmanlike conduct or language, or for any of the reasons enumerated in these Playing Rules, and to eject such disqualified person for the playing field. If the Game Coordinator disqualifies a player while a play is in progress, the disqualification shall not take effect until no further action is possible in that play;

etc, etc...

 

Basically points 3 and 4 above... when this JA continued to argue, to come out and argue again after the fact during the 1/2 inning, you could have, and had the authority to show him the parking lot. We have a good number of Junior umpires in our LL, and the word is out to the managers and coaches... mess with them at your own risk because if they don't dump you, our game coordinators will in a heart beat. Coaches are expected to be professional and to only speak to our juniors in a conversational tone. Any berating, aggressive posturing or speech and the conversation is over. Failure to comply is an immediate trip to the parking lot. This JA is 100% what LL does not want or need. 

Glad you were there to mentor and have your kids back. Keep up the good work! 

[Velho]

2 hours ago, Mudisfun said:

(4) To have the authority to disqualify any player, coach, manager, or substitute for objecting to the decisions of an umpire, for unsportsmanlike conduct or language, or for any of the reasons enumerated in these Playing Rules, and to eject such disqualified person for the playing field. If the Game Coordinator disqualifies a player while a play is in progress, the disqualification shall not take effect until no further action is possible in that play;

"Hey, Johnny's mom/dad, can you hold my phone and record the field until I get back? Thanks. PU, can I get 'time'?" Calmly walk on the field, "Hey, JA, you're gone."

[Vegas_Ump]

When I started in LL 35 years ago, our league had a total of 75 games a week at all levels of softball and baseball.  And we covered every game with two volunteer umpires.  Saved the parents some serious coin!

The lack of mobility of the families, economics, and demographics resulted in fewer kids to play ball, fewer games, and fewer volunteer umpires.  So our league adopted a Youth Umpire program which helped them qualify for their high school service projects.  Some of these kids were pretty good!  One or two went on to States!  But some of the kids had deficiencies.  Anyway, you train when you can.

I recall one kid who--as a player--had a huge attitude when I was behind the plate.  He decided to show me up by not taking his place in the batters box when directed.  That cost him a directed third strike, 3 outs, leaving runners on 2nd and 3rd.  And his team was down by 1 run!  Game over!  (Kid was a prima donna son of the league VP!)

The next year, I was surprised that this kid was doing youth umpiring at AA and AAA.  Turned out pretty good!  He got a clue!

My point is this:  There are fewer and fewer families playing in LL.  Your source of umpires (paid or volunteer) will be proportionately smaller.  Experience will be lacking.  Yet parents (in the stands and in the dugouts) demand all calls go their way.  And I have seen the deportment deteriorate over the past few years--and the COVID hassle made things worse!

These factors contributed my retirement from LL baseball umpiring. I don't need the hassle anymore.  I'm not going to bust my volunteer chops in 115 degree temperatures just to have some bozo manager suggest I'm not calling them fair for both teams.  Insult my integrity?  Yeah I can eject him, but I'm never going change his acerbic, entitled attitude.

Read the Little League Pledge on the back of the book!  It matters to an old fa*t like me.

Mike

Las Vegas

[blue23ll]

On 5/1/2022 at 11:22 PM, BlueClue said:

Well my week keeps getting more interesting.

For context, I previously had an interesting run-in with my local little league's Vice President (see the post below for the full story)

Since then, he had left the board following that incident and I had assumed the role of UIC for the league around the same time. I haven't had a run-in with him until just recently and oh boy was it fun.

Since I was (and still am) out for the foreseeable future after taking a ball to the wrist, I've been doing a lot of supervising and helping some of the newer umpires out. Recently, I went to help two new-ish umpires in their first game of the year. When I arrive at the diamond I notice that one of the coaches is none other then Mr. former VP himself (henceforth known as JA). I listen in on the plate meeting (our league requires an adult present to support the umpires when they are both minors) and I can tell JA hasn't forgotten about that incident. Both teams proceed to their respective dugouts and the game begins.

The first inning goes by fairly uneventfully (the typical little league game where the pitcher's missing 3 feet outside and the batter's swinging his bat like an axe) apart from one thing- JA's players are leading off. Some are waiting until the pitch leaves the hand, some are just leading off from the start, however none of them are waiting for it to reach the batter (see Rule 7.13 of the LL rulebook). Following the inning, the crew comes up asking for some feedback. While they're with me, BU asks for clarification on the rule, which I provide him with. He mentions he noticed it but he wasn't too sure what the proper ruling was.

During the second inning, R1, BU calls a blatant lead off, JA isn't too happy about it the first time but doesn't say anything loud enough to hear. Two pitches later BU calls another blatant lead off on the same runner and JA storms right out of the dugout, attempting to argue the call with BU (using the excuse "he went on a passed ball!"). BU's having none of it and orders JA back to the dugout. While on his way back to the dugout he comes over to me, yelling about how I told him to call it and despite me trying to explain the situation he says "BlueClue you shouldn't even be here!". I snap back "I'm here for my umpires, not for you!" and walk away. Following the inning JA tries to go back over to BU and argue it again (this time stating how they're learning) but PU comes in and corrals him away. The crew meets up with me again and I mention how they had the correct call and that they're in charge of the game, not the coaches (I forgot to mention that both coaches had just been going for mound visits whenever they felt like it, and JA was hovering around the back stop while the ball was LIVE).

Going into the third, the crew cracked down on the inmates running the asylum. However, R2, BU called another blatant lead off and JA came out yet again, making a spectacle on his way out. He tried arguing how it was a passed ball, that his runner was on the bag, and that he was going to get someone to video it for him. At this point BU had enough and ordered him back to the dugout and the inning concluded. I was pissed off at the encounter from the previous inning, and his conduct then made me furious. I told the crew in between innings that his actions were incredibly inappropriate and that they shouldn't be tolerated.

The fourth inning went off without a hitch (with JA's team forfeiting), and following the game I had a little huddle with the crew, giving them some praise and feedback for the game. During which I told them that what happened wasn't their fault and shouldn't have happened. I waited with the umpires until their parents arrived, during which I chatted with BU on how he's one of our best up-and-coming umpires and I wouldn't want to lose him because of people like him. When I arrived back at home, I noticed that BU had sent me an incident report in regards to what occurred. I forwarded it to the League President to sort out with the rest of our disciplinary committee. Usually, I sit on the disciplinary committee and aid in the process, however, seeing my history with JA I excused myself from the process.

I'm well aware that my actions were driven by emotion, but I just really wanted to get it off my chest and hear some second opinions. Any feedback or criticism would be appreciated!

-Blue

Is it permissible now days for LL coaches to have free reign of the field? Able to storm out of the dugout whenever they want?? 

My last act in a leadership capacity of my local league was a meeting of the "disciplinary" committee. I left after that and never went back or officiated another game for that league. 

[ArchAngel72]

Blue 

 

No they are supposed to request time to come out of the dugout.

A little ranging out to direct fielders here or there I allow so long as they step back in quickly. But anything other nope for me  In the dugout Sir!

 

[BDad]

@blue23ll I'm with @ArchAngel72. During regular season, I'm a little flexible within reason. Depends on the field, too. One field I work the dugout fence is close to the foul line and more than one coach has tested his jumping skills dodging line drive fouls. I try to pay more attention for safety reasons at that field.

Here's Regulation XIV(d) from the 2022 LL RIM:

[blue23ll]

@BDad I know the rule.  I am talking about adults leaving the bench area to argue.  The rules don't permit that and neither should we.  Someone storming out of the dugout should be ejected the minute he/she gets one step onto the field.