Douglas/Force3 Mask

[UMP45]

When did Douglas start making the Force3 mask?

[tpatience]

1 hour ago, UMP45 said:

When did Douglas start making the Force3 mask?

They just rebranded it. Same with the smitty by Douglas CP

[wolfe_man]

It's the V1 by F3 also.  It has four springs which make it heavier. 

[AL-Ump]

I think they started a couple years ago.  Maybe Summer 2019.

[Thunderheads]

32 minutes ago, AL-Ump said:

I think they started a couple years ago.  Maybe Summer 2019.

it's been around longer than that for sure ....

[MadMax]

Several umpire associations have arrangements with Douglas and/or an outfitter/rep who sells for Douglas. Douglas has no interest in fabricating its own mask (no point in reinventing the wheel), so instead brokered a deal with Force3 to rebrand the Defender TM and HSM with Douglas marks so it can be sold alongside Douglas CPs and Shins – as a package deal, if need be – to associations. 

Likewise Smitty, being predominantly a uniforms / fabrics company, is in no position to wade in and develop an all-new CP. So, they brokered a deal with Douglas to brand a Douglas CP with the Smitty mark so it can be sold in Smitty's catalog, which is often supplied to associations as package deals.

[boyinr]

Based on the above, any idea whose helmet this is?  I have never worn a bucket but there are a few fields that I think I would like one on.  I like the price point.

https://www.douglaspads.com/collections/protective-equipment/products/hockey-style-catchers-helmet 

[wolfe_man]

18 minutes ago, boyinr said:

Based on the above, any idea whose helmet this is?  I have never worn a bucket but there are a few fields that I think I would like one on.  I like the price point.

https://www.douglaspads.com/collections/protective-equipment/products/hockey-style-catchers-helmet 

I can't see the front of the bucket, but I think that's a UA (All Star) bucket.

[MadMax]

4 hours ago, boyinr said:

Based on the above, any idea whose helmet this is?

 

3 hours ago, wolfe_man said:

I can't see the front of the bucket, but I think that's a UA (All Star) bucket.

It's neither.

The first UnderArmour HSM, called the Victory, was nothing more than an All-Star MVP shell with a unique-to-UA cage bolted on (and dare I say, uglier): 

The second rendition, called the Converge, departed from the All-Star family pretty radically. Not only was the cage updated, but the shell was completely redesigned. UA's project lead for baseball likely had a hand in it, and farmed it out to a different producer in China / Asia: 

Ready for this? This Douglas is actually the same shell as a Champro Optimus, just with a different cage:  

I don't know about you, and I will never claim to be a HSM wearer, but I'd be skeptical about a Champro shell and the padding behind it. I don't think Douglas put their own pads in it. I respect Douglas for hangin' in there and staying in the USA (instead of selling out to a Finnish international conglomerate, and watching all your time and resources – which could be spent improving your baseball and softball umpire gear – making golf, tennis, and basketball gear, where the accolades all go to the big-time brands anyway) 🤨... but they, too, haven't improved their foam beyond upholstery foam. 

[wolfe_man]

Yes, the cage is definitely Champro. Wow, now we know why they didn’t show the front view. Take a peek at how plain and ordinary this looks.

 

[boyinr]

Thanks for the information.  The Champro might be good enough.  But, if I go that route, I will buy an All Star MVP2400 or 2500 (the only difference is the removeable padding).   All Star sells the 2400 for $99.99 direct with free shipping over $99. 

[wolfe_man]

40 minutes ago, boyinr said:

Thanks for the information.  The Champro might be good enough.  But, if I go that route, I will buy an All Star MVP2400 or 2500 (the only difference is the removeable padding).   All Star sells the 2400 for $99.99 direct with free shipping over $99. 

I think that's a much better choice - and the cage design on the AS is far superior in my opinion.