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LLWS - Not a bash, but a question


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16 minutes ago, wolfe_man said:

Whew, good thing we don't do any of that stuff here! :fuel::stir

The UIC that was in charge of the State tourney actually pointed my username out to the group of umps, Said I was outspoken and talking about all kinds of odd weird stuff ( ie grey ball bags LOL )

 

I made the mistake of laughing and saying Oh that IS me..  yeah things got awkward in the room after that... 

 

I know this and knew this then but than again my goals are not to get to Bristol and NOT to get to Williamsport I have made it to States 2 times now and thats as High as I want to go.  I've only been doing this 6 yrs now and well I know my own capabilities are still somewhat lacking.  I got bases down, My plate presence still needs some work. I get "Amped" up and need to learn to breathe and slow the game down. Its funny regular season Im cool as a cucumber, playoffs is where I get amped up.   but anyway.. yeah my goal is to do the best job I can for the game I am at, at that point and time.  If I keep making it up to state level great, awesome. Love it and enjoy it.  I have not one care to go down to Bristol cause I feel at this point it would be "too much" 

bleh too much typing I need to shutup if I ever want to go higher.. lol

 

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2 minutes ago, ArchAngel72 said:

bleh too much typing I need to shutup if I ever want to go higher.. lol

 

Or create a new user name... get re-born my brother!

I don't and won't do LL regardless, but I won't bash those that do.  My hat is tipped to anyone who'd do it for FREE!  To me, that's borderline insanity... FREE? I wouldn't touch it for $75/game personally.

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7 minutes ago, ArchAngel72 said:

The UIC that was in charge of the State tourney actually pointed my username out to the group of umps, Said I was outspoken and talking about all kinds of odd weird stuff ( ie grey ball bags LOL )

 

I made the mistake of laughing and saying Oh that IS me..  yeah things got awkward in the room after that... 

 

I know this and knew this then but than again my goals are not to get to Bristol and NOT to get to Williamsport I have made it to States 2 times now and thats as High as I want to go.  I've only been doing this 6 yrs now and well I know my own capabilities are still somewhat lacking.  I got bases down, My plate presence still needs some work. I get "Amped" up and need to learn to breathe and slow the game down. Its funny regular season Im cool as a cucumber, playoffs is where I get amped up.   but anyway.. yeah my goal is to do the best job I can for the game I am at, at that point and time.  If I keep making it up to state level great, awesome. Love it and enjoy it.  I have not one care to go down to Bristol cause I feel at this point it would be "too much" 

bleh too much typing I need to shutup if I ever want to go higher.. lol

 

Ahhhh, contraire ....  that's where you're mistaken.  You don't have "bases down" ...no one does.  Same for plate.  You're always evolving and improving and / or trying to improve ... remember that ;) 

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17 hours ago, SJA said:

Umps don't get paid (officially)  . . . unless the Leagues and Umps go "rouge". LL still will penalize the Umps that do somewhere down the line. 😠

Entire leagues AND umpires turn a reddish-colour?  I don't think I like THAT at all!

Ball-busting aside, that's why I'd never get that far down the road to Williamsport.  (Aside from the sheer numbers of 'competitors,' and my own limitations as an umpire, that is.)  Umpiring will never be more than a part-time side-gig for me, from a financial standpoint, but given the time, energy, and mileage I spend doing it, I will NEVER do it for free.  LL can rich off of everyone else.

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2 hours ago, ArchAngel72 said:

I can also point out they prefer guys that keep their mouth shut and don't talk about issues they see. Specially on forums and other social media things..

 

Arch bruv, I was raised when I see a wrong to right it...when I see someone or a group of people who are being taken advantage of to speak out against that. If we ignore things and I quote "keep our mouths shut", things do not improve. If you're OK with that, that is your choice. It should then come as no surprise...I am making a different choice.

Once again, just so I am clear...people who do this work for free are my heroes and I am saddened by their working conditions.

~Dawg

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1 hour ago, ArchAngel72 said:

The UIC that was in charge of the State tourney actually pointed my username out to the group of umps, Said I was outspoken and talking about all kinds of odd weird stuff ( ie grey ball bags LOL )

 

I made the mistake of laughing and saying Oh that IS me..  yeah things got awkward in the room after that... 

 

I know this and knew this then but than again my goals are not to get to Bristol and NOT to get to Williamsport I have made it to States 2 times now and thats as High as I want to go.  I've only been doing this 6 yrs now and well I know my own capabilities are still somewhat lacking.  I got bases down, My plate presence still needs some work. I get "Amped" up and need to learn to breathe and slow the game down. Its funny regular season Im cool as a cucumber, playoffs is where I get amped up.   but anyway.. yeah my goal is to do the best job I can for the game I am at, at that point and time.  If I keep making it up to state level great, awesome. Love it and enjoy it.  I have not one care to go down to Bristol cause I feel at this point it would be "too much" 

bleh too much typing I need to shutup if I ever want to go higher.. lol

 

Dude, you are cooked now.  Might want to give out your height, hammer or point, third strike and IFF mechanics to leave no doubt who you are...  🤣

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1 hour ago, BLWizzRanger said:

Dude, you are cooked now.  Might want to give out your height, hammer or point, third strike and IFF mechanics to leave no doubt who you are...  🤣

Sadly I do wonder if this year was my last state event I will be invited to..  that thought has crossed my mind.  As well as retiring this login and creating another.  LOL

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Soooooooooo, back to the original questions about robotic mechanics. 

These guys are not only pretty decent umpires, but most are Regional instructors. So they're actually trying to model what they teach. 

 

Oh, and most to them also do other "flavors" of ball, too. Adult league, tournament stuff, HS, etc. It's pretty rare to encounter LL umpires who strictly do LL. Some do. 

 

Now we know what umpire school is like. Repetitive, robotic moves, that drill them into your head. And then you after a while you get your own "style" if you will. These guys you're watching now are all World Series veterans, called back because of COVID. And actually, they're really less "robotic" as they have nothing to prove. 

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I've noticed that they're not enforcing the batters box at all in several of these games. These kids are 4 or 5 inches behind the back line and several have their toes clearly over the edge of the plate... Even the announcers are commenting on the batters crowding the plate. 

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6 hours ago, mark38090 said:

I've noticed that they're not enforcing the batters box at all in several of these games. These kids are 4 or 5 inches behind the back line and several have their toes clearly over the edge of the plate... Even the announcers are commenting on the batters crowding the plate. 

I think you exaggerate but video/game/inning would help as would if this was a starting position or a hitting the ball position. Toe/s on the plate would not be illegal for hitting the ball if heel/s were/was touching the line. 

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Little League 6.06 A Batter is out for an illegal action

A. Hitting the ball with one of both feet on the ground ENTIRELY outside the batter's box. (does not matter if its a foul or fair ball)

 

If their instep or heel or toe is on the batters box line they are considered in the box. Even if half their foot is on the plate.

 

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20 hours ago, JonnyCat said:

Interesting. Is it that much cheaper to go with a different insurance than LL?

Not necessarily cheaper, but necessary. Our corporation charters with LL for majors and below but the teenager portion is not LL   The softball part has swung back and forth between LL and non-LL. Therefore we have a policy to cover all aspects, with LL blessing (we had to submit the policy to them) as it covers everything they want covered. 

 

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5 hours ago, Rich Ives said:

Not necessarily cheaper, but necessary. Our corporation charters with LL for majors and below but the teenager portion is not LL   The softball part has swung back and forth between LL and non-LL. Therefore we have a policy to cover all aspects, with LL blessing (we had to submit the policy to them) as it covers everything they want covered. 

 

That makes sense. Thank you. I wonder how may other leagues self insure. 

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I am late to the game on this thread, but here is my $0.02 worth.

Years ago, Andy Konyar was the UIC of all Little League.  And he sought to standardize all umpire training.  For the most part it worked pretty well.  Then Andy retired.  Some regions kept up with the disciplines for tournament umpires.  I used to be in SE Region at the time, and I thought they were pretty sharp umps.  This year?  Not so sharp.  Don't know why.

Being in WR now, I have done the WR Tournament in 2017, and looking sharp was a must!  Here's my take on it:  If you are lazy or inconsistent in your plate mechanics (or any other mechanics when you are in the field) you'll probably be OK until you get a close one.  Then, you will have the other team's manager (and ESPN replay) on your ass because you gave them the impression that you are not fully involved in the game.

Yeah, you are a volunteer, but if you want to be respected as an umpire, you have to look like one and act as one, especially in tournaments.  

Consider the video clips of umpire dancing with Dugout--The Little League mascot.  Sure, he's just a fun loving guy who is part of the carnival atmosphere.  But if he blows a call, he's just a buffoon trying to get himself on TV, and acting as one sets the stage for undeserved criticism.  

The most transparent umpires call the best games.  And these guys are sharp and crisp ("robotic"?) with their calls.

JMO

Mike

Las Vegas

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Here's my observation, going back 20 years. 

 

When I first started umpiring, I'd watch these televised games and wondered how the umpires were selected. Again, in my observation back then, it looked like most guys were getting a retirement gold watch for their many years of service. And that's fine. But they seemed much older, and less mobile than what you see now. 

I go back to the 2001 games, where U2 missed a missed base because he was so focused on getting inside. (it went against our local team, so that's why it sticks in my head). It seems after that the umpires got more nimble (read: younger). 

Also, I observed that going back to hands on knees after a call was the norm. Also, staring at first base after and out/safe call was an odd mechanic in noticed. Now I rarely see that. So, we, as a group, have evolved over time. 

Another evolutionary move was bringing in the selected umpires to WP months before the tournament for sort of an evaluation. Again, IMO, this was more to take the surprise element out of it, and maybe make some corrections/suggestions. In the past there have been some "interesting" mechanics, especially from umpires that come from across the pond. 

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doesn't umpire school pretty much robotize their process so there is a much more level playing field for judging performance with mechanics and positioning.

And cannot, of course, your natural (whatever yours are/or are not) instincts come into play, when a situation (out of the box) does not conform to those natural umpire school taught positioning robotics for all plays, and that can get a smile/rise out of the evaluators for your instincts performed on the fly.

So LL doesn't seem to be the only place robotized mechanics/positioning for the most part come into play.

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On 8/26/2021 at 3:04 AM, Jimurray said:

I think you exaggerate but video/game/inning would help as would if this was a starting position or a hitting the ball position. Toe/s on the plate would not be illegal for hitting the ball if heel/s were/was touching the line. 

These kids from Michigan were doing it again today but the plate umpire has backed them up. The Ohio team did it today. Sorry I didn't reply earlier but I'm fighting covid and damn this was a really bad week. 

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2 hours ago, mark38090 said:

These kids from Michigan were doing it again today but the plate umpire has backed them up. The Ohio team did it today. Sorry I didn't reply earlier but I'm fighting covid and damn this was a really bad week. 

A quick review of the ESPN Michigan game showed a toe extended over the inside line with no correction and a back foot slightly outside the box which the PU corrected. In both cases those were legal positions to hit the ball but violate the initial batting position rule. Sometimes if no one complains we leave minor violations alone since they become legal as the pitch is on the way. But give us a game/batter/inning with the 4 inch exceedance or foot touching the plate.

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Can't give you an exact, but Michigan, kid with all the hair that's such a great pitcher, back foot completely behind the back of the batters box line. Around here, if you're not correcting that, the coaches are going nuts. Again, I'm not bashing, just pointing it out. Today's second batter for SD, toes out of the box when the at bat starts. 

 

20210829_101212.jpg

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