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Infield fly throw out runner that is to far from his base


piranhaost

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We had a situation during our previous game where the shortstop catched an infield fly ball called by the umpire. Runner standing on first base. Shortstop catched the ball and threw the ball directly to first base where the runner was heading back to . So ball was quicker to first base than the runner on first. I know the ball is still alive after an infield fly and that runners may advance on their own risk. So in my opnion runner on first was out and this was a double play? Was this the right call? 

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6 hours ago, agdz59 said:

If the first baseman was only touching first base when he caught the ball as if it was a force play and the runner returned to 1B before a tag was applied, the runner is safe.

I haven't umpired in a few years now but I remember that an infield fly is like anything else except that the batter is already out. I read OP to say the ball was caught, so why isn't this a valid appeal?

 

Editing to add: I read OP as a tag-up appeal... It's possible that isn't what OP meant which would change my comment.

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LL Rule..

 

Rule 2.00

Rule 2.00 defines the Infield Fly as, “a fair fly ball (not including a line drive or a bunt) which can be caught by an infielder with ordinary effort, when first and second, or first, second, and third bases are occupied before two are out. The pitcher, catcher, and any outfielder stationed in the infield on the play shall be considered infielders for the purpose of this rule.” It goes on to state that “[t]he ball is alive and runners may advance at the risk of being caught or retouch and advance after the ball is touched, the same as on any fly ball. If the hit becomes a foul ball, it is treated the same as any foul ball.”

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When an infield fly is declared, basically all that happens is the batter-runner is out and it removes any force plays.  The ball remains live and, if caught, the runners are responsible to return to "tag up" an base left before the first touch of the batted ball.  Nothing else fancy or complicated about an infield fly.

So to answer your initial question - if the runner was off the base on the initial touch of the batted ball (likely the catch by F6) and the ball was returned to F3 and they tagged the runner or the base before the runner returned to first, you have an out.  If the runner was on the base at the first touch and then came off, the runner must be tagged with the ball to be declared out.

And an appeal on a runner having to retouch a base left early is never, ever, ever, ever, ever a "force".

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Indeed the runner left on contact and already was on his way to second base when the shortstop caught the ball.
First baseman just touched his base and I both called the batter and the runner out.

So if I'm reading it correct the runner only has to be tagged when he left the base at the moment that the shortstop catches the ball. Thanks for all your feedback. Much appreciated

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3 minutes ago, piranhaost said:

Indeed the runner left on contact and already was on his way to second base when the shortstop caught the ball.
First baseman just touched his base and I both called the batter and the runner out.

So if I'm reading it correct the runner only has to be tagged when he left the base at the moment that the shortstop catches the ball. Thanks for all your feedback. Much appreciated

Correct. In your actual play, the throw to 1B was a retouch appeal, which you granted. Only the base needs to be tagged.

If something else had happened, then the ruling would be different. Folks love their hypotheticals.

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So let's say "infield fly" with runner on first and second. Shortstop catches the ball and then he tags the runner between second and third while runners is heading back to second base after he left second base on contact batter this also would be a double play?

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8 minutes ago, piranhaost said:

So let's say "infield fly" with runner on first and second. Shortstop catches the ball and then he tags the runner between second and third while runners is heading back to second base after he left second base on contact batter this also would be a double play?

Really, this has zero to do with an infield fly call.  You have a fielder with the ball tagging a runner that is off base.  That's out every time (as long as the ball is live, that is).  No need to go farther down the rabbit hole of "what about if...".  Not that complicated, really.

From your description in the OP and your supplemental info, the correct call was made.

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13 minutes ago, piranhaost said:

So let's say "infield fly" with runner on first and second. Shortstop catches the ball and then he tags the runner between second and third while runners is heading back to second base after he left second base on contact batter this also would be a double play?

The fielder caught the ball.  He "doubled off" a runner who left early.  That can be done by tagging a runner or by tagging the base the runner left early.

 

And, anytime (well, a live ball, not after overrunning first ...) a runner is tagged while off a base, the runner is out.

You seem to be getting caught up on the fact that this was an infield fly.  Ignore that -- it doesn't really matter (for this application)

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