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Um, well...you see...uhh, I, uhh....


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I’d sure like to see more of the video, especially @ the end of the umpire conference, since it looks like they determined and told the coach it stands.

 

 

 

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this is ALSO why the armchair umpires go online and bash umpires, lumping us all together.

Who cares what level this is. This is embarrassing. How in the heck did all three geniuses not correct this situation?   This is basic. And to those of you who are new umpires, this is why w

I'm going to choose not to say anything .................................. except ... THIS IS THE REASON COACHES HATE US!

I am curious what level this is since it is 3 umpires.

My first thought was if this is LL/Youth, mistakes happen, rules are not as well known, but I’ve never seen a youth game have 3 umpires 

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Who cares what level this is. This is embarrassing. How in the heck did all three geniuses not correct this situation?:FIRE::ranton:

:WTF  This is basic.

And to those of you who are new umpires, this is why we tell you three things have to happen after a foul ball or time is called:

1) Pitcher must have ball in their possession and on the pitching rubber

2) Batter is in the box and ready

3) Umpire puts the ball back in play, by pointing and announcing "Play" [Do this every time....don't get lazy. The next thing we are going to see is a hidden ball trick pulled off after a foul ball....and the ump calls somebody out when the above is not met.]

Absolutely shameful performance.:rantoff:

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To me, it looks like a high school tournament game. You can see the players’ senior posters on the fence (so home playoff game), 3 man crew, and I think the girls just look that age.

I know most state assoc. don’t allow protests, but if I’m the coach of the black team, no way on this planet I continue until this is made correct. Most tournament games will have a site director, and we’re getting this one done.

Maybe they eventually got it, that’s why I’d like to see the remaining video.


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9 hours ago, ShaunH said:

I am curious what level this is since it is 3 umpires.

My first thought was if this is LL/Youth, mistakes happen, rules are not as well known, but I’ve never seen a youth game have 3 umpires 

And apparently I don’t listen as well as I watch.  First sentence of the video says “this playoff game in HS softball”

Insert 🤦‍♂️ 

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20 hours ago, Mad Mike said:

The next thing we are going to see is a hidden ball trick pulled off after a foul ball....and the ump calls somebody out when the above is not met.

Or worse, a Balk... called (typically) by a PU that feels he was deceived. 

Sorry, but that’s not how it works. You cannot make a/the ball Live unless it is sitting in the F1’s possession. 

Thus, it is impossible to have a HBT out of a Dead Ball. 

Do your job (better).

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5 hours ago, Recontra said:

says it's a high school playoff game.

Oh, what I would give to know which state this was in! I would be sending this video to the state association repeatedly, not so much to embarrass the 3 umpires per se, but definitely to embarrass an association that, by indications, appears to be rewarding playoff games on some valuation other than competency!! 

This play/non-play violates the fundamentals of base/softball. If this doesn’t scream “Protest!!”, I don’t know what does. 

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@beerguy55 If you were coaching the team that was screwed royally, how would you handle this? Pretty sure you would get ejected, but what else could/should a coach do? Pull his team off the field? Getting popcorn ready to wait for your reply!!!

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Audio says it's a high school playoff game.

Yep, you’re right, thanks. I was watching w/ no volume when I found it. And of course SWMBO must never be disturbed & woken by late night umpire videos. But my assumption on age was correct.


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According to this article, Jefferson High School versus Ysleta High School, El Paso, TX, in the championship game: https://www.ktsm.com/sports/high-school-sports/ysleta-softball-calls-foul-on-bases-clearing-error-by-umpires/

Beyond the obvious, egregious error of allowing play to continue on a foul ball, neither the HP nor U2 put up their hands to indicate the foul ball. And the HP umpire takes off and carries his mask in his right hand, perhaps the least of his mistakes.

And, while all the (in)action was going on, an Isleta player hands U2 a second softball a fan apparently returned to the field, rightfully thinking play was dead.

I can guess how the Isleta coach feels, but I wonder how the Jefferson HS 3B coach feels.

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2 other details from the video (1 is a professional pet-peeve of mine): 

  1. Watch the U3 in particular... the ball is/was a Foul ball, was it not? Now, it’s not necessary to mechanic / signal Foul when a batted ball is that obviously Foul. However – what is the ball’s status now? Dead! Who is the only person who can make a (new) ball Live again? PU! So why are you calling / signaling “Time!” (to get together to conference) when the ball is already dead??!! Are you, as an umpire, supposed to know what the status of the ball is at all times??!! Sure, you can tell me it’s “habit”, but it’s a bad habit, and one you should break yourself of. 
  2. Somebody on this crew should have alarm bells blaring and rattling in their head that none of what we just saw was right. Then why is U1 going back to A in acceptance of the s#!tshow that just happened??
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14 hours ago, Mad Mike said:

@beerguy55 If you were coaching the team that was screwed royally, how would you handle this? Pretty sure you would get ejected, but what else could/should a coach do? Pull his team off the field? Getting popcorn ready to wait for your reply!!!

Haha - honestly...I'm going right to "protest"...there's gotta be a protest mechanism in this setting.   "IT'S A DEAD BALL!"    I am screaming this during the play...and then after...everyone in the stands would know exactly my argument.

 

Now, if what you saw on the field is the protest - ie. the UIC is on the field and he rules on it - then, yeah, I'm probably getting tossed

I'm going somewhere between calling them all idiots, or Three Blind Mice...or telling them if they cash their game cheque they should be charged with fraud.....though context matters...if one of the teams is up by ten runs then I'm probably just shaking my head and dealing with it after the game.

EDIT: turns out offense was ahead 5-4 bottom of six at time of this play...this made game 8-4, the ending result....though it didn't change the outcome, it would have greatly changed the approach of the visiting team down 4 runs vs 1 run in the last inning (the 7th).

Either way, after the game, formal complaints to league, organization, ump association and anyone who will listen.   I would do everything in my power to bury these umpires.   People get fired from minimum wage jobs for less than this.

 

Now...I can see some really unethical ump pull something out of his ass like "nobody called foul...it was a fair ball"...and that's a judgement call, you can't protest - OK, fine, what do we do about the batter, who is still next to the batter's box giving high fives to the three runners who scored?   And then you bozos killed the play to discuss your ineptitude.   And then, yes, I'm probably getting tossed.

I MIGHT even call a team meeting right then and there, and see if they want to finish it or walk - but I think I'd want to see a pattern, and that this play was just the last straw.  But I go back to my original statement - in this kind of format, there HAS to be a protest mechanism that doesn't involve the clowns on the field.   Pulling the team off the field could be a tactic to get the protest heard, or to get the other team to choose between winning by forfeit or doing the right thing.

I may just implore to the other coach and hope he has some degree of moral fiber - again, not a judgment call we're disputing...this has worked for me once, where the coach agreed the ump bungled it, he undid the call himself, and we ended up "firing" the ump and doing the game ourselves.   Might be too high profile a game for this to work, but at least it would get someone's attention.  But maybe the other coach can convince the umps they're wrong...one can hope.

23 hours ago, Aging_Arbiter said:

this is ALSO why the armchair umpires go online and bash umpires, lumping us all together.

 

On 5/4/2021 at 6:24 AM, Thunderheads said:

THIS IS THE REASON COACHES HATE US!

I feel your pain, I really do - and I do know the truth, and have a good relationship with many umpires...but in my experience I'm more likely to get a crew like the one in the video than a crew of people like those who participate on this board.  God, I'd have loved to have many of you on the field with me.   Give this analysis whatever weight you want - how many amateur umpires are in North America and how many members does this board...and other boards/facebook groups dedicated to improvement...have?   What percentage join clinics beyond the one that was mandated to start umpiring?

Everyone knows there's an ump shortage - and asshole coaches/players/parents are a big part of that.  In all walks of life there is a set of people who will do just enough that is required to keep their job...with major shortages, like we see in umpires, we see a lot of people not even meet the bare minimum...and still keep their job.

But, even if that is off base, and the umps above are the minority...Most coaches see very little done about bad umpires by good umpires.   The blue wall goes up and that's the end of it - and week after week we see the same incompetent fools calling the game, and wonder where all the good umps are working...it's improved for sure, and statements like yours acknowledge that there are idiots in your ranks - but I remember when first joining this board being called a rat coach for merely suggesting that some umpires aren't very good at their job.

It's not just the combination of arrogance and ineptitude...but it's the perceived likelihood that nothing will ever be done to fix it.

  

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On 5/4/2021 at 7:24 AM, Thunderheads said:

'm going to choose not to say anything ..................................

except ... THIS IS THE REASON COACHES HATE US!

That's a great point, especially in this situation.  HOWEVER, my experience is usually they hate us because THEY do not know the rules.

When I started watching I honestly thought they were going to call it a fair ball...which, by the way, would have been better than what actually happened. :o

I truly fail to see how in a HS playoff game, with three umpires (apparently deemed good enough to do HS playoffs) this can happen. 

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23 hours ago, beerguy55 said:

"nobody called foul...it was a fair ball"...and that's a judgement call, you can't protest - OK, fine,

My hope is they actually thought it was fair as opposed to what actually happened.  Bad judgment is one thing not knowing the (basic) rules in a HS playoff game is another.

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40 minutes ago, aaluck said:

When I started watching I honestly thought they were going to call it a fair ball...which, by the way, would have been better than what actually happened. :o

I disagree...I think it would have been just as bad, if not worse to rule this fair - based on the manner of the umpires it's very clear none of them though it was fair...ruling it a fair ball after-the-fact would have been a really unethical and down-right slimy way to explain away their ignorance of the rules and avoid a protest  (and still wouldn't address the batter, who never made any attempt to run to first...or if they really thought it was fair, why did they kill the play and have a conference if the play was still live and a runner still in play - although, how cute would it be if there were already two out and then they rule her out for abandonment/desertion)   So, no, I don't think a fair ball is any better.

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2 hours ago, beerguy55 said:

I disagree...I think it would have been just as bad,

That's why I put the little....:o. Anyway...  Forget it..

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