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FPSR Violation in NFHS


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We need to get this every time.   

The fielder did NOT miss the tag: he had possession of the ball while still in contact with the 2B bag (slow it frame-by-frame and see for yourself). In review, this aspect of the call was confirmed.

Amen.

Maybe I'm being too technical/literal, but since F6 came off the base early, is this still a FPSR?

The force was never achieved, the runner isn't out yet, and there is no double play in progress...

 

Even the OBR rules about bona fide slide (which this is, under those conditions) talks about it being on a double-play attempt...is it even a double-play attempt any more, by the time they make contact?

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In every game I work that's an out at second base.

Additionally, the rule indicates that on force play (not force out) the runner, if he slides, must slide in a direct line between the bases. A runner may also slide in a direction away from the fielder to avoid making contact or altering the play of that infielder. Clearly that is not the case on the play above.

In the NCAA, the rule book has an diagram clearly showing where a runner needs to be when they slide on such a play.

ncaa-fpsr.png

 

 

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14 minutes ago, beerguy55 said:

Maybe I'm being too technical/literal, but since F6 came off the base early, is this still a FPSR?

The force was never achieved, the runner isn't out yet, and there is no double play in progress...

 

Even the OBR rules about bona fide slide (which this is, under those conditions) talks about it being on a double-play attempt...is it even a double-play attempt any more, by the time they make contact?

You are being too technical/literal ;) ....  YES, it's still FPSR because, as @Kevin_K points out: it is a 'force play' (force play in effect)

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1 hour ago, beerguy55 said:

Maybe I'm being too technical/literal, but since F6 came off the base early, is this still a FPSR?

The force was never achieved, the runner isn't out yet, and there is no double play in progress...

  1. The fielder did NOT miss the tag: he had possession of the ball while still in contact with the 2B bag (slow it frame-by-frame and see for yourself). In review, this aspect of the call was confirmed.
  2. For FED/NCAA, the fielder is protected from this contact whether or not he makes or has made a play on the sliding runner. R1 would be guilty of a FPSR violation even if the ball hadn't arrived yet.
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29 minutes ago, maven said:

The fielder did NOT miss the tag: he had possession of the ball while still in contact with the 2B bag (slow it frame-by-frame and see for yourself). In review, this aspect of the call was confirmed

The fielder did IN FACT miss the tag, which is clearly evident in frame-by-frame slo-mo - so clearly that the call on the field was overturned upon review.    The on-field call of a bona fide slide was what was confirmed on review.

R1 (previously called out on the force) was placed on second base...B/R, who had advanced to second on the errant throw, was put back to first....at the end of review, run scored, R1/R2, nobody out.

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16 minutes ago, beerguy55 said:

The fielder did IN FACT miss the tag, which is clearly evident in frame-by-frame slo-mo - so clearly that the call on the field was overturned upon review.    The on-field call of a bona fide slide was what was confirmed on review.

R1 (previously called out on the force) was placed on second base...B/R, who had advanced to second on the errant throw, was put back to first....at the end of review, run scored, R1/R2, nobody out.

THIS IS STILL FPSR IN FED, .... PERIOD ;) 

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On 4/11/2021 at 7:44 AM, johnnyg08 said:

We need to get this every time.

There's a problem here, guys, that @beerguy55 and @maven touched on – F6 wasn't in contact with the bag when he received the throw. He tapped it with his right foot as he brushed past it, but the throw from Pujols was so weak (ha!) that the F6 was no longer in contact with the bag when he received the throw, transferred the ball in a blur, and then attempted to throw to 1B. 

So, Interference aside... just looking at the play at 2B... we have to read and process everything we're seeing much more clearly. Of course, the MLB and NCAA D-1 guys have the benefit of multi-man umpire crews, wherein a U3 or U2 has a longer and more deliberate window to judge the play at 2B, both for the Force Out and potential Interference – he has no responsibilities to 1B and the "back end" of the DP. Going further, MLB has the benefit of video replay for that Force Out at 2B. As such, the "neighborhood play" (which is what this is) has no longer been assumed, and the middle infielders are held to a more exacting standard. 

So with R1 actually Safe at 2B, let's continue the play... Is he guilty of FPSR, at least to NCAA and NFHS standards? Yes to both. So his being Safe does not absolve him of violation of the FPSR, and committing Interference. So R1 would be Out on Interference. Then, because it was committed so as to break up a DP, BR would be ruled Out as well. This is important to know as you/we explain it to a shrewd coach. 

However, OBR is markedly different than NCAA and NFHS in their definition / limitations / allowances on slides, specifically FPSR. 

According to the MLB Review, R1's slide was legal. 

https://www.mlb.com/news/double-review-goes-blue-jays-way-twice

 

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11 hours ago, beerguy55 said:

Maybe I'm being too technical/literal, but since F6 came off the base early, is this still a FPSR?

The force was never achieved, the runner isn't out yet, and there is no double play in progress...

 

Even the OBR rules about bona fide slide (which this is, under those conditions) talks about it being on a double-play attempt...is it even a double-play attempt any more, by the time they make contact?

First and foremost, FPSR is a SAFETY RULE vs a normal Interference Rule. So with that comes the max penalty offered on this play.

So because it is a safety rule we get both the guilty runner and the BR and all runners go back to TOP.

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Ironically enough, I called a FSPR violation in my HS game last night. AC apparently had never heard of such a thing. (Fortunately, HC had no issues with it)

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