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Malicious contact by offense

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Guest Michael

Under the NFHS baseball, man on second base, no outs. Batter hits a homer. Runner on second base creates malicious contact with the 3rd baseman. How many runs score if any? 

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The complicating factor in this play is that there is the rare circumstance of malicious contact while the ball is dead and an award is in progress (an over-the-fence home run is a dead ball and a four-base award to the batter). Part of the penalty for malicious contact is that the ball becomes dead immediately so what happens when the ball is already dead for another reason?

Fortunately for us the FED case book has a whole section of seven case plays dealing with malicious contact—they are 3.3.1 Situation DD, EE, FF, GG, HH, II, and JJ. One of the case plays does tackle the question of a malicious contact during a dead ball situation created by an out-of-the-park home run—3.3.1 FF.

With two outs and the bases loaded, B6 hits a home run out of the park. R1 maliciously runs over (a) F4 before touching second base or (b) F5 before touching third. RULING:  In both (a) and (b), R1 is declared out and ejected. In (a), the third out is a force, so no runs score. In (b), the third out was not a force play, so runners who have touched the plate prior to the infraction would score. Please note that in awarded situations it is not the base that is awarded, but rather the right to advance and legally touch a base with no play being made.

And a friendly reminder for Mr. The Man in Blue, FED rule references are separated by hyphens. To differentiate case book from rule book citations, the FED separates case book references by decimal points. I know you know this but the last couple of days you have posted using the wrong format for your citations. Earlier in this thread you posted just a citation 3.3.1m (which is a case play format) and when I went to it to see what you were referring to it made no sense but when I went to the rule 3-3-1m it made perfect sense. The other was in the 3rd strike interference? dead ball? play on? 2 outs? thread.

 

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R2 is out and ejected.  Batter may complete his advance and score. 

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This got me thinking. Same play as above 2 outs. No run scores? I did notice in the 2020 interps Fed confirmed passing a runner on a HR is a time play. I assume MC would be the same ? 
SITUATION 17: The bases are loaded with two outs. The batter hits the pitch over the fence for a grand slam home run. While circling the bases the batter-runner passes R1 between third base and home, before R1 touches home plate. R2 and R3 had touched home plate before the batter-runner passed R1. How many runs score? RULING: The batter-runner is out for the third out the moment he passed a preceding runner, R1. This is a timing play and runs scored before the third out will count, but the batter-runner and R1 will not score. Score two runs. (8-4-2m, 9-1-1)

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Time play during a dead ball. Ha. As Carl used to say, "Lah me."

The FED guidance at least has the virtue of being clear, even if not rational.

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In the OP it doesn't matter whether it's a time play  or not -- it's still a preceding runner, so no runs would score (had this happened with two outs).

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4 hours ago, Senor Azul said:

And a friendly reminder for Mr. The Man in Blue, FED rule references are separated by hyphens. To differentiate case book from rule book citations, the FED separates case book references by decimal points. I know you know this but the last couple of days you have posted using the wrong format for your citations. Earlier in this thread you posted just a citation 3.3.1m (which is a case play format) and when I went to it to see what you were referring to it made no sense but when I went to the rule 3-3-1m it made perfect sense. The other was in the 3rd strike interference? dead ball? play on? 2 outs? thread.

 

D'oh!  I do know that.  I would blame it on late night posting, but ... I did it twice?!  :banghead:  :shrug::cheers:

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4 hours ago, maven said:

Time play during a dead ball. Ha. As Carl used to say, "Lah me."

The FED guidance at least has the virtue of being clear, even if not rational.

Actually, I like it. It's not only clear, but rational to me from the POV of preserving the general principle that no runs score after a 3rd out is made. And if any team is so incredibly stupid as to find themselves in this situation? They deserve what they get.

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11 hours ago, Senor Azul said:

The complicating factor in this play is that there is the rare circumstance of malicious contact while the ball is dead and an award is in progress (an over-the-fence home run is a dead ball and a four-base award to the batter). Part of the penalty for malicious contact is that the ball becomes dead immediately so what happens when the ball is already dead for another reason?

Fortunately for us the FED case book has a whole section of seven case plays dealing with malicious contact—they are 3.3.1 Situation DD, EE, FF, GG, HH, II, and JJ. One of the case plays does tackle the question of a malicious contact during a dead ball situation created by an out-of-the-park home run—3.3.1 FF.

With two outs and the bases loaded, B6 hits a home run out of the park. R1 maliciously runs over (a) F4 before touching second base or (b) F5 before touching third. RULING:  In both (a) and (b), R1 is declared out and ejected. In (a), the third out is a force, so no runs score. In (b), the third out was not a force play, so runners who have touched the plate prior to the infraction would score. Please note that in awarded situations it is not the base that is awarded, but rather the right to advance and legally touch a base with no play being made.

And a friendly reminder for Mr. The Man in Blue, FED rule references are separated by hyphens. To differentiate case book from rule book citations, the FED separates case book references by decimal points. I know you know this but the last couple of days you have posted using the wrong format for your citations. Earlier in this thread you posted just a citation 3.3.1m (which is a case play format) and when I went to it to see what you were referring to it made no sense but when I went to the rule 3-3-1m it made perfect sense. The other was in the 3rd strike interference? dead ball? play on? 2 outs? thread.

 

Ha!! Last night I was looking for this case play and did a quick search for “malicious”. Guess I should’ve added “ly”:smachhead:

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