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Pitching Question

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Okay.  I have been out of umpiring and coaching for a few years enjoying my kids in their prospective sports and working on my masters.  Both the baseball coach and softball coach have stepped down within a short period of time.  My kids go to school with me, so I will be at the games anyway since they are playing.  They got me to coach both.  Baseball pitching rules have changed and I have no clue what I am doing with softball, but that is another story.  

So with the new pitch count rule, I am at a small school.  40 per grade level or less pretty much.  So I am not going to have a lot of pitching.  So I am trying to think creatively in case a situation comes up.  I have to download an app and wait for my state agency to load the book on my app, so I am in a holding pattern on that.  

My question is, can a pitcher come out of the game in the middle of an inning or otherwise, go to a new position, then re-enter as pitcher from a new position on the field.  For example, I have my number 1 in the rotation going.  He pitches to hitters 1-6.  To save him from using pitches, can I move him to RF, bring the RF in to pitch to 7-9, then switch them back?  I believe that was something I could do before.  I coached during the inning count days where it was X amount of innings and a partial inning counted as a whole, so wasn't really something I contemplated back then.  I just see this as a way to save some pitches from him, to allow him to go deeper into games that we are sticking with the other team in.  

Thanks

 

(NFHS, but Tennessee Middle School if it makes a difference between states for any reason on pitch count rules)

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35 minutes ago, TNCoach said:

My question is, can a pitcher come out of the game in the middle of an inning or otherwise, go to a new position, then re-enter as pitcher from a new position on the field.  For example, I have my number 1 in the rotation going.  He pitches to hitters 1-6.  To save him from using pitches, can I move him to RF, bring the RF in to pitch to 7-9, then switch them back?

Yes, you may, once per inning. 

Here's the primary rule governing subbing for/replacing F1, 3-1-2:

Quote

If a pitcher is replaced while his team is on defense, the substitute pitcher shall pitch to the batter then at bat, or any substitute for that batter, until such batter is put out or reaches first base, or until a third out has been made. To ensure that the requirements of this article be fulfilled, the umpire will deny any coach-defensive player conference that will violate the rule. If a pitcher is incapacitated or guilty of flagrant unsportsmanlike conduct, this rule is ignored. A player may be removed as pitcher and returned as pitcher only once per inning, provided the return as pitcher does not violate either the pitching, substitution or charged conference rule. If the pitcher, because of an injury or being incapacitated, is replaced as pitcher and the above rule is not satisfied, or if his replacement requires more warm-up throws than permitted in 6-2-2 exception, he cannot return to the game as a pitcher.

 

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Okay.  So, I can sub him out, then bring him back in, but only once per inning.  So a pitching change is also not a charged conference, correct?  Those would not count toward that?  

What is the caveat with the pitches at the end of what you quoted?  The rule book has not been placed in my queue yet on the app.  How many warmup pitches does my replacement get?  My pitcher coming back in would get none, correct?

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28 minutes ago, TNCoach said:

Okay.  So, I can sub him out, then bring him back in, but only once per inning.  So a pitching change is also not a charged conference, correct?  Those would not count toward that?  

Correct. 3-4-1

29 minutes ago, TNCoach said:

What is the caveat with the pitches at the end of what you quoted?  The rule book has not been placed in my queue yet on the app.  How many warmup pitches does my replacement get?  My pitcher coming back in would get none, correct?

Here's 6-2-2 EXCEPTION:

Quote

EXCEPTION: The starting pitchers may warm up by using not more than eight throws, completed in one minute (timed from the first throw). When a pitcher is replaced during an inning or prior to an inning, the relief pitcher may not use more than eight throws completed in one minute (timed from the first throw). At the beginning of each subsequent inning, the pitcher may warm up by using not more than five throws, completed in one minute (timed from the third out of the previous half-inning) (3-1-2). In either case, the umpire-in-chief may authorize more throws because of an injury, ejection or inclement weather.

In your scenario, (say, swapping F1 and F9), when F9 comes in to pitch he may have up to 8 warmup pitches. If he requires more than 8, then the previous F1 may not return to pitch in that game (not just that inning).

When original F1 returns to the mound, he may also have up to 8 warmup pitches. Of course, he might not need that many, or he might need more, which 6-2-2 EXCEPTION allows in some cases. There's no scenario in HS baseball where a pitcher coming to the mound gets zero warmup pitches: that's a safety issue.

Pitchers returning to the mound after having pitched in a prior inning get the reduced (5) warmups.

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Thanks.  Trouble I am sure I am going to run into is coaches and umpires who don't know the rule.  I will have to talk to them in pre-game to make sure they do to avoid problems.  At our level, we get new ones and such.  

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3 minutes ago, TNCoach said:

Thanks.  Trouble I am sure I am going to run into is coaches and umpires who don't know the rule.  I will have to talk to them in pre-game to make sure they do to avoid problems.  At our level, we get new ones and such.  

It's never a bad idea to express your intention to use it in case an umpire or opposing coach is unfamiliar with it.   Communication is key to avoiding disagreements.

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12 minutes ago, wolfe_man said:

It's never a bad idea to express your intention to use it in case an umpire or opposing coach is unfamiliar with it.   Communication is key to avoiding disagreements.

That's what I have usually done in the past.  I had a team where we stole home probably five or six times one season.  I normally alerted the home plate umpire so he did not get caught by surprise. 

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3 hours ago, TNCoach said:

That's what I have usually done in the past.  I had a team where we stole home probably five or six times one season.  I normally alerted the home plate umpire so he did not get caught by surprise. 

Hopefully, not right before you tried it.  By yelling down from the 3B coaches box.  :)

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5 hours ago, HokieUmp said:

Hopefully, not right before you tried it.  By yelling down from the 3B coaches box.  :)

Haha.  Nah.  Now, I did have a player miss the steal time at first three pitches in a row, so I yelled at him from the 3B box and tell him he missed the sign three times, so he needed to steal this time.

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I’m surprised I haven’t seen this tactic used to extend an ace through the game. Then again, our state allows 110 pitches so an ace who’s on his game should be able to get through 7 innings 

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Middle School has a max of 85 here.  

1-19 pitches is 0 days rest.  20-35 is 1 day.  36-50 is 2 days.  51-66 is 3 days. 67-85 is 4 days.  

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