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Coach BIll

Is it time for the orange base?

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I think they badly missed that one last night - but it's such a poorly written rule it's understandable. The orange base would make sense based on the current rules. If they don't add it, then they need to better clarify the rule that will allow a runner to actually run to the base with the line being on the outside edge. The orange base would probably stop a few injuries and sure make 5.09 (a)(11)  far more sensible. What say you?

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2 hours ago, Lou B said:

I think we need a running lane from third towards home!

R3 and a grounder up the line to F5.  R3 runs home in fair territory making it difficult for F5 to throw to F2 at the plate.  We need a running lane to keep R3 out of fair territory!  :)

Or maybe we need an orange plate behind the white one!!!


 

B6A0D98E-D145-435C-B6AE-F36E071714DC.jpeg

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2 hours ago, yawetag said:

I'm intrigued. How do tag plays work?

They don't - most slow pitch rule sets, and leagues, with the commit line don't allow tag plays at the plate - once the runner passes the commit line F2 must touch the plate while holding the ball before the runner crosses the score line, which is 1BX...but once the runner passes the commit line he can't stop or go back, whether tags are allowed or not.   If he stops (or in some rule sets, retreats) he's out, no matter where the ball is.  There are some rule sets that do allow (but not require) the tag...F2 simply needs to have the brains to touch the plate instead of chasing the runner sideways....it really only comes up if the throw is offline.

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1 hour ago, beerguy55 said:

They don't - most slow pitch rule sets, and leagues, with the commit line don't allow tag plays at the plate - once the runner passes the commit line F2 must touch the plate while holding the ball before the runner crosses the score line, which is 1BX...but once the runner passes the commit line he can't stop or go back, whether tags are allowed or not.   If he stops (or in some rule sets, retreats) he's out, no matter where the ball is.  There are some rule sets that do allow (but not require) the tag...F2 simply needs to have the brains to touch the plate instead of chasing the runner sideways....it really only comes up if the throw is offline.

Interesting. Never worked slow-pitch and never seen the line in any game I've watched (which is only a few).

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49 minutes ago, yawetag said:

Interesting. Never worked slow-pitch and never seen the line in any game I've watched (which is only a few).

A lot of it is safety oriented for the most part.  Catchers aren't wearing any of the traditional tools of ignorance.  And MOST slow pitch leagues/tournaments are more casual, and invite a lot of neophyte players.    Also, in a lot of co-ed slow pitch leagues, where you need at least three females on the teams, and most teams struggle to find quality female players, you typically put one behind the plate.  No steals, no bunts allowed so they just pick up the ball and throw it back to the pitcher...and they just need to be able to catch the ball on a play at the plate.  No overweight men, or over-competitive types, killing the 105 pound catcher.

It's typically only the most competitive of leagues/tournaments that forego the commit/score lines and use the plate as they do in baseball/fast pitch.

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On 10/31/2019 at 12:31 PM, humanbackstop19 said:

Anytime there's a force play on the batter-runner at first base, a play is being made on them; making it required they are inside the RL at 45'.  If they're making a turn.....there's no play being made on them; so they don't have to be in the lane.  If there is a play being made on them and they are running outside the lane after 45', they are running illegally to first base.  A penalty only comes into play when interference occurs during the play.  

Just to be accurate, there is never a force play at first base.

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1 hour ago, mrumpiresir said:

Just to be accurate, there is never a force play at first base.

Just fyi, next time you find a thread via search, check the last date posted. Not trying to put you down or discourage participation, we've all been there when it comes to zombieing threads, just a heads up for next time.

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4 minutes ago, Biscuit said:

Just fyi, next time you find a thread via search, check the last date posted. Not trying to put you down or discourage participation, we've all been there when it comes to zombieing threads, just a heads up for next time.

I have pretty much retired from doing a lot of games after 30 years of umpiring and have not visited this forum in a long time.  What you stated in the past was wrong and I just wanted to correct that.  Forgive me for pointing out that incorrect information.

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2 hours ago, mrumpiresir said:

I have pretty much retired from doing a lot of games after 30 years of umpiring and have not visited this forum in a long time.  What you stated in the past was wrong and I just wanted to correct that.  Forgive me for pointing out that incorrect information.


I agree that it's not a force at 1B but NFHS calls it that in one of their case plays and I think I just heard a CWS umpire call it that in one of the 2/5/20 videos they have on Arbiter. I think you need to winnow thru some later threads to correct the same misnomer in case we haven't in those threads. We might have missed some. Sometimes we just shake our heads instead of correcting the misnomer:)

 

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4 hours ago, Jimurray said:


I agree that it's not a force at 1B but NFHS calls it that in one of their case plays and I think I just heard a CWS umpire call it that in one of the 2/5/20 videos they have on Arbiter. I think you need to winnow thru some later threads to correct the same misnomer in case we haven't in those threads. We might have missed some. Sometimes we just shake our heads instead of correcting the misnomer:)

 

Let's allow our drinking buddies to call it whatever they want but I am a strong believer that umpires should use the proper terminology. I have learned a lot about the nuances and the differences between the rule sets because of this forum and recommend it to umpire friends of mine. It totally amazes me how little the lay person knows about the rules to the game.

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On 2/14/2020 at 4:29 PM, mrumpiresir said:

It totally amazes me how little the lay person knows about the rules to the game.

It shouldn't amaze you at all...it should be expected.  You should be a tiny bit surprised at how ignorant some of the coaches and players are...but only a bit.

What should amaze you is how little so many umpires know about the rules of the game.

As far as the play at first...I know it technically doesn't match the definitions in the rule book, but what do you call it?  Using the English language the batter IS forced to run to first, just like R1 is forced to run to second.  That the rule makers decided to make some weird semantical differentiation for reasons known only to those partaking in snuff in a country club back room doesn't change the fact that those speaking English and using "force" as it is defined in the dictionary are not "wrong".

Even MLB.com's rules glossary uses the misnomer.

Definition

A force play occurs when a baserunner is no longer permitted to legally occupy a base and must attempt to advance to the next base. The defense can retire the runner by tagging the next base before he arrives, though not if the defensive team first forces out a trailing runner. In that instance, the force play is removed and the defense must tag the remaining runners to retire them.

First base tends to have the most force plays, as batters are eligible to be forced out at first any time they put the ball into fair territory and it is not caught in the air.

http://m.mlb.com/glossary/rules/force-play

 

 

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On 2/14/2020 at 6:29 PM, mrumpiresir said:

It totally amazes me how little the lay person knows about the rules to the game.

If the Internet has taught me anything, it's that the lay person in any subject knows little about the subject. Even a casual student of a subject knows only enough to be dangerous.

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Some more baseball semantics antics ...

First base precedes second base.  Second base precedes third base.

HOWEVER ... 

A base runner on third base precedes a base runner on second base.  A base runner on second base precedes a base runner on first base.

:cheers:

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1 hour ago, The Man in Blue said:

Some more baseball semantics antics ...

First base precedes second base.  Second base precedes third base.

HOWEVER ... 

A base runner on third base precedes a base runner on second base.  A base runner on second base precedes a base runner on first base.

:cheers:

So the preceding runner proceeds from the preceding base....

 

On another note, why do we park on driveways and drive on parkways?

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We don't need no stinking Orange base!

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