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Tredders
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Hey Guys,

 

I'm currently in my second season of umpiring and loving it! (well besides the 4 hour, 49 run marathon I just had!) Anyway  I had a situation in my game yesterday, Runners on 2nd and 3rd with 1 out 2-1 count on the batter. The batter swings and misses and the ball sails past the catcher and to the backstop. R3 comes home, and 3rd Base coach (who is also the manager) sends his batter running to first as he claimed he thought it was strike 3, therefore dropped third strike. On the throw to first, R2 has come around and scored. I had a very angry manager come out at me claiming that he cannot do that, and because the batter has to return to bat, R2 should only advance to 3rd base. My response was this "R2 scores because the ball is still live, batter comes back with a 2-2 count". Obviously the manager was still very unhappy, but walked away (eventually). Was I correct in saying the ball was live? Should have I given the third base coach a consequence for his error in sending the batter? The final score was 28-21 in favour of the team who was fielding at the time of the incident, so therefore this (thankfully) made this play irrelevant. Also, for those who are curious, the grade was Under 15 Div 2 and it was the Semi Final (as the season is unfortunately coming to a close here in Australia). And I was a solo umpire at the game, and therefore could not ask for help from a partner.

 

Thanks and Regards,

Tredders

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 While there may be some argument on this forum about it, if I have another play like this again there will definitely be an interference call as the BR has caused F2 confusion while making a play. 

 

Thanks guys!

 

Wow.  I think you need to reread the rest of the previous responses before you do this.

 

Edit to add:  okay, I see now that you've changed your tone after reading the second page of this thread.  I should probably have done that before posting.

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What "play" did the batter interfere with?

I think you're making a legitimate point here. Are you saying that if the runner from third headed toward home, the catcher started to make a play (running down the third base line, or started a throwing motion) and THEN the batter took off; you WOULD have interference due to confusion?

***************************************************************

 

Maybe I didn't state my position clearly enough. If not, then that was my fault. Let me rephrase it...

 

I would never under any circumstances call this play as interference!

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Thanks for the responses, I should have ended up tossing the Rat for calling the other HC a "wanker" loudly from his dugout,

 

That line right there is why I miss living in Oz so much....  Almost brings tear to my eye from 'home'sickness.

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Thanks for the responses, I should have ended up tossing the Rat for calling the other HC a "wanker" loudly from his dugout,

 

That line right there is why I miss living in Oz so much....  Almost brings tear to my eye from 'home'sickness.

Haha, yeah, gotta love Australia, but do you miss the 40 degree plates in the middle of summer? haha, I sure know I wouldn't! 

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bush-league? yabbo gamesmanship? yes.

interference? no. 

F2 has a job, part of it is knowing the siituation. shame on him. 

the ball remains live, you should not call time unless action has ceased. your only job is watching the ball and glancing at R2 touching  :home: . If you want to announce the count, fine. Be sure not to instruct anybody by doing so. i.e. don't say "hey catcher, it's only strike 2"

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Thanks for the responses, I should have ended up tossing the Rat for calling the other HC a "wanker" loudly from his dugout,

 

That line right there is why I miss living in Oz so much....  Almost brings tear to my eye from 'home'sickness.

Haha, yeah, gotta love Australia, but do you miss the 40 degree plates in the middle of summer? haha, I sure know I wouldn't! 

Mate, I lived in Alice - I didn't seem to have a choice!

 

Well, sorta.  We did kids games in the morning (when it was "only" 30 at first pitch), and then the teens/adults games were all at night.  Still miserable sometimes, but better.

 

And my wife and I miss it enough that we'd go back if we had the chance.  Not a second thought.

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What about 'verbal interference'? Could this fall under the same heading as the 3BC yelling "I got it" on a fly ball in the infield?

I would never have this call in this type of play. 

 

Im not accusing you of this but too often umpires think something isnt "fair" and then try to find a rule they can impose to meet their definition of fairness.  Look, stuff happens.  It's one of the lessons the players are supposed to learn from sports.

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I have never called verbal interference, nor I don't ever see calling it. Just threw that out, because I hear that argument from some of our HS guys, and shake my head.

I am 'old school' and believe that that some stuff is part of the game and I let it go. I believe the defense is responsible to know the situation, they mess up- Oh well, play on!

I was a catcher and I had to know the count to call the pitches, so no excuse to make the throw to first in that play or even to second on a ball 4.

The defense uses decoys - why can't the offense

 

Play ball -

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Verbal interference is a viable call, just not here. The defense needs to know the situation, they are also taught to control the lead runner. If they throw behind him then they learned something. 15 yr olds should not get sucked into a stupid play like that. Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2

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Guest saj551

Hey Guys,

 

I'm currently in my second season of umpiring and loving it! (well besides the 4 hour, 49 run marathon I just had!) Anyway  I had a situation in my game yesterday, Runners on 2nd and 3rd with 1 out 2-1 count on the batter. The batter swings and misses and the ball sails past the catcher and to the backstop. R3 comes home, and 3rd Base coach (who is also the manager) sends his batter running to first as he claimed he thought it was strike 3, therefore dropped third strike. On the throw to first, R2 has come around and scored. I had a very angry manager come out at me claiming that he cannot do that, and because the batter has to return to bat, R2 should only advance to 3rd base. My response was this "R2 scores because the ball is still live, batter comes back with a 2-2 count". Obviously the manager was still very unhappy, but walked away (eventually). Was I correct in saying the ball was live? Should have I given the third base coach a consequence for his error in sending the batter? The final score was 28-21 in favour of the team who was fielding at the time of the incident, so therefore this (thankfully) made this play irrelevant. Also, for those who are curious, the grade was Under 15 Div 2 and it was the Semi Final (as the season is unfortunately coming to a close here in Australia). And I was a solo umpire at the game, and therefore could not ask for help from a partner.

 

Thanks and Regards,

Tredders

 

In all my many years of umpiring I have never had a 4:49 game.  28-21?  No offense, but I’m glad that I do not work youth baseball in Australia.

In your situation:

  • It is the coach’s/player’s responsibility to know what the count is. Hopefully you didn’t give the wrong count prior to the pitch but regardless they should still know the count (and so should you).

  • The ball is “LIVEâ€! 
  • Players may advance at their own risk and if they score it counts.

  • The batter returns to bat with a 2-2 count.
  • No penalty to the 3rd base coach. With that said if it happens a second time I’m going to have a talk with the head coach (the one who attended the plate meeting) and have that type of crap stopped. No one makes a mockery out of a game I officiate…never, ever!  That’s part of good game management.

 

When it comes to the count, I tell the batter and catcher the count after each pitch. Depending on the age level and skill level I might announce the count to the world often.

 

Can I assume that 15U is played on a 90’ field?  I wouldn’t work an entire game alone on a 90’ field. 2-man crews are bad enough but 1-man?

I am still amazed at the 28-21 score….. I think that I would have a huge strike zone for this skill level.  Maybe “nose-to-toes’ & “line-to-line†(that’s a joke)

 

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...well besides the 4 hour, 49 run marathon I just had!...

Sounds as if you need to call more strikes. :shakehead:

 

No way this is INT. Why do I care where the batter goes during play? As long as he doesn't delay the game, he can go get a drink for all I care. Onus is on the defense to know who may legally advance.

 

I wouldn't call it differently with young'uns. Teachable moment when the defense screws up.

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There is a rule that state that if any member of the offense does ANYTHING to impede, hinder or confuse the defense, it can be construed as interference, but the act of a runner continuing on after he has been put out does not in and of itself constitute interference.

 

Like most others, I would have used the same argument you used: it's the defense's resposibility to know the situation, just like on a dropped third strike with less than 2 outs and first base occupied. The catcher should know not to throw to first base, regardless of what the batter does.

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I feel at some point and age in ball and life you must learn from your mistakes. The run counts and batters at 2-2. F2 will remember this the rest of his career or he will have a short career as F2

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