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Senor Azul

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Everything posted by Senor Azul

  1. Under Federation rules, obstruction is always a delayed dead ball. That means the ball becomes dead only after all runners have gone as far as possible so that the defense can record outs or commit errors. See case book plays 8.3.2A and D. · From the FED definition (rule 2-22-1): When obstruction occurs, the ball becomes dead at the end of playing action… · Obstruction appears in the delayed dead ball table in rule 5 as item number 4 with no conditions or qualifiers… · FED rule 5-1-2b—it is a delayed dead ball when a catcher or any fielder obstructs a batter or runner… · FED rule 5-1-3—The ball becomes dead when time is taken to make an award when a catcher or any fielder obstructs a runner… 2019 FED 8.3.2 SITUATION D: With one out, R2 and R1. B4 hits ground ball directly to F1 who throws to F5 for the force on R2 at third. F5 then throws to F3 in time to put out B4. F6 holds R2, preventing him from advancing to third. RULING: The umpire will call obstruction when it occurs, and then call time after runners have advanced as far as possible, which in this situation would probably be second for R1. R2 will then be awarded third. Because of the obstruction of F6, the out at first stands. B4’s out stands. B4 was not affected by the obstruction. B5 will come to bat with two outs and R2 is on third and R1 is on second base.
  2. According to the 2016 BRD, in its section on malicious contact (section 348, p. 232) the MLB issued the following interpretation in February 2014— Official Interpretation: Torre: The umpire has the right to eject (a player) from the game if it’s (the contact) blatant, and he’d be automatically out.”
  3. Well done, Mr. LRZ! In addition to the actual rule, the interpretations manuals state the same thing. The following is taken from the 2021 Minor League Baseball Umpire Manual (section 6.27, p. 118): Official Baseball Rule 6.02(a)(4) provides that the pitcher be charged with a balk if, while in contact with the rubber, he throws to an unoccupied base except for the purpose of making a play. Play 1: Runners on first and second, pitcher in set position. Runner breaks for third base and pitcher throws to third base. Ruling 1: Legal play. Play 2: Runners on first and second, pitcher in set position. Runner bluffs going to third base and pitcher throws to third base. However, runner did not go. Ruling 2: Balk under OBR 6.02(a)(4). The key to understanding the above two plays is for the umpire to use good judgment in deciding whether or not the runner on the previous base demonstrates or otherwise creates an impression of his intent to advance to such unoccupied base… Since the OP Mr. hookminor did not specify a rule code here’s something from the high school case plays— 2013 NFHS Baseball Rules Interpretations SITUATION 20: With runners at first base and second base, the runner at second bluffs a steal of third by running hard to third before he stops and retreats back to second base. The pitcher, seeing the runner take off hard to third base, legally throws to the unoccupied third base. The third-base coach wants a balk called on the pitcher since the runner from second stopped. RULING: A pitcher may throw or feint a throw to an unoccupied base in an attempt to put out or drive back a runner. As long as the umpire judges that it is reasonable for the pitcher to believe he had a play at third, even though the runner stopped, it is a legal move. (6-2-4b)
  4. Score the batter’s at-bat as an FC4-3 and credit him with an RBI per rule 9.04(a)(1) and the definition of the term fielder's choice (taken from the 2021 OBR)-- 9.04 Runs Batted In A run batted in is a statistic credited to a batter whose action at bat causes one or more runs to score, as set forth in this Rule 9.04. (a) The Official Scorer shall credit the batter with a run batted in for every run that scores (1) unaided by an error and as part of a play begun by the batter’s safe hit (including the batter’s home run), sacrifice bunt, sacrifice fly, infield out or fielder’s choice, unless Rule 9.04(b) applies; FIELDER’S CHOICE is the act of a fielder who handles a fair grounder and, instead of throwing to first base to put out the batter-runner, throws to another base in an attempt to put out a preceding runner. The term is also used by scorers (a) to account for the advance of the batter-runner who takes one or more extra bases when the fielder who handles his safe hit attempts to put out a preceding runner; (b) to account for the advance of a runner (other than by stolen base or error) while a fielder is attempting to put out another runner; and (c) to account for the advance of a runner made solely because of the defensive team’s indifference (undefended steal).
  5. I have posted the following a few times—most recently this past May. From the 2016 Baseball Rule Differences by Carl Childress (section 350, p. 234): Official Interpretation: Hopkins: On a force play a runner hit by a throw between bases is NOT guilty of interference if he did not slide when he is in the baseline and “not even halfway to second: The runner cannot be expected to slide at that point in the base path.” (Hopkins, website 2007 #3) Note from the BRD: This official interpretation seems to indicate that a runner who is more than halfway had better hit the dirt. 2007 NFHS Baseball Interpretations SITUATION 3: With no outs and R1 on first base, B2 hits a hard ground ball to F6. F6 fields the ball and steps on second base and then throws to first base in an attempt to double up B2. R1 is running standing up in a straight line to second and is hit by F6's throw. R1 was not even half way to second base and did not intentionally interfere with the throw. The defensive coach states that B2 should also be out since R1 violated the force-play slide rule. RULING: This is not a violation of the force play slide rule. R1 cannot be expected to slide at that point in the base path. The play stands. R1 would be out only if he intentionally interfered. (8-4-2b penalty)
  6. From the 2016 BRD (section 350, p. 236): Note 337: The force play/slide rule went into effect in 1998. FED listed their rationale: “The rule is intended to ensure the safety of the fielder.” (1998 Case Book Comments on the Rules, 2-32-2f, p. 3)
  7. Oh, Mr. Thunderheads, don’t let anybody tell you that the diagram you posted doesn’t have any application to first base—it definitely does! In fact, that diagram is used in the 2021 Minor League Baseball Umpire Manual and the example they use in showing how to use it is… A runner breaks from first base and then completely overruns first base with both feet going into foul territory beyond the base in returning. If the runner wants to again attempt to advance second base, they must retouch first base prior to advancing. In addition, I am almost certain there was a play discussed recently about whether a returning runner who had crossed the foul line (the back side of first base) had been passed by the B/R who had overrun first and gone up the foul line.
  8. Guys, we did discuss this question a long time ago in a thread titled Failure to touch 1B in August 2014 (Rules forum currently on page 26). The original poster eventually asked a friend of his at PBUC and here is what he said— "Good news...the OBR doesn't clearly define, so hard to say you are completely wrong. However, I think a more practical ruling would be if the runner touches the ground beside or beyond the base, he would be considered as to have touched or passed the bag." I think the takeaway from this is that foot placement is the key to the call. If the B/R’s foot is on the ground next to or beyond the bag prior to the F3 catching the throw, the B/R has “acquired” the base. The front edge of first base is 90 feet from the tip of home plate. If the B/R’s foot touches down and breaks the plane of that front edge before the ball arrives he has acquired the base. And here is the closest case play I could find back then—now it can be found in the 2017 Jaksa/Roder manual on page 83-- Batter hits a ground ball to the shortstop. On what appears to be the batter-runner's last stride before touching first base, his foot hits the ground just short of the base, failing to touch it. However, the batter-runner's body is over the top of first before the first baseman gloves the throw. The batter-runner overruns the base, the umpire makes no signal and the first baseman steps on the base and appeals to the umpire that the batter-runner failed to touch first: the umpire has handled the play in the correct manner. The batter-runner never reached first safely and it is the responsibility of the defensive team to recognize that he missed the base. The batter-runner is out on the appeal.
  9. Senor Azul

    Runs scoring

    Mr. Jimurray, could you provide the actual Wendelstedt interpretation you mentioned please. The 2013 Wendelstedt manual states that if multiple appeals make for exactly three outs, the defense is restricted by the order in which they appeal. So, in the OP when the first appeal was made on the batter-runner at first base that resulted in the second out and thus removed the force at second. Wouldn’t that mean the appeal on the miss of second base for the third out was a time play just as Mr. flyingron posted? Also, the 2016 BRD in its section 13 on pages 26-27 tells us the order of appeal can make a difference. Perhaps your citation could also mention the year it was made please. Maybe it came later and thus supersedes the previous rulings. And I am not sure why you brought up the NCAA ruling on this since this question specified OBR. But since you did, their rule 8-6b-9 tells us that multiple appeals must be in the correct order unless it is an advantageous fourth out.
  10. According to the 2020 Little League Rules Instruction Manual it is a balk/illegal pitch when a pitcher pauses in his delivery. I understand that to mean that even in a windup the pitcher is not allowed to pause a la the “Japanese way.” Since LL rules are based on OBR it is also a balk/illegal pitch when a pitcher pauses in the Set position, i.e., he suspends his lift leg. 2020 LL rule 8.05 –With a runner or runners on base, it is an illegal pitch–Major/Minor League [a balk in Intermediate (50-70) Division/Junior/Senior League] when- (a) the pitcher, while touching the plate, makes any motion naturally associated with the pitch and fails to make such delivery; INSTRUCTOR’S COMMENTS: ➔ If the pitcher starts his/her delivery, in any way, and stops, the pitcher has violated the rule. Call a balk or illegal pitch. From the 2013 Wendelstedt rules interpretation manual (section 6.3, p. 102): It is a balk when… The pitcher suspends his foot in the air (he stopped his delivery) in an attempt to hold a runner. Play 132: R1, no outs, no count. The left-handed pitcher, after coming stopped in the set position, raises his non-pivot foot off the ground and suspends it in the air, freezing R1. He then steps and throws to first base in an attempt to pick-off R1. Ruling: This is a balk.
  11. From the 2021 Minor League Baseball Umpire Manual (section 6.7, pp. 98-99) discussing OBR 6.01(j): Even in the absence of a bona fide slide, the umpire still must find that the conduct of the runner “interferes with, obstructs, impedes, hinders or confuses any fielder attempting to make a play…” When a runner who does not engage in a bona fide slide makes contact with the fielder for the purpose of breaking up a double play, such contact will be deemed to have “hindered and impeded” the fielder for purposes of interpreting Rule 6.01(j). However, there may be instances where the runner does not make contact—or makes only incidental or minimal contact—with the fielder. In such cases, the umpire will use his judgment to determine whether the runner “hindered and impeded” the fielder and thereby violated the Rule.
  12. Well done, BCBrad. This rule interpretation is not just in the Wendelstedt manual—it is also found in the 2016 BRD (section 444, p. 295) and in the actual rule— The umpire shall call attention to obvious errors in the lineup: (1) The lineup does not include all nine players; (2) the pitcher is omitted when there is no DH listed; (3) two players with the same last name but no identifying initial. 2021 OBR Rule 4.03 Comment: Obvious errors in the batting order, which are noticed by the umpire-in-chief before he calls “Play” for the start of the game, should be called to the attention of the manager or captain of the team in error, so the correction can be made before the game starts. For example, if a manager has inadvertently listed only eight men in the batting order, or has listed two players with the same last name but without an identifying initial and the errors are noticed by the umpire before he calls “play,” he shall cause such error or errors to be corrected before he calls “play” to start the game. Teams should not be “trapped” later by some mistake that obviously was inadvertent and which can be corrected before the game starts…
  13. Here is the only help provided by the LL RIM-- 2020 LL RIM rule 7.08(a)(4) INSTRUCTOR’S COMMENTS: ➔ Stumbling, tripping or crawling do not constitute a “Head First slide.” ➔ This rule does not apply when a runner is returning to a base, only when advancing to a base. Any runner who does a headfirst slide is out at the moment the umpire sees the runner go into the headfirst slide. The ball remains live and in play. Other runners may advance at their own risk and plays may be attempted on any other runners. If the runner who is called out for sliding headfirst has been forced to advance this will be a force out and no runs will score if this is the third out of the inning. In all other instances the headfirst slide will be a time play when there are two outs.
  14. From the 2019 LL Make the Right Call (the casebook of LL Baseball): RULE 7.08(a)(4)[MAJORS & BELOW] SITUATION: A runner on third base breaks for home on a batted ball. The ball is thrown to the catcher and a play is imminent at the plate. In an attempt to avoid the tag, the runner slides head first into the plate. RULING: The umpire shall declare the runner out for the head-first slide, the ball remains live and the defense may record additional outs.
  15. Mr. MadMax, If you read the whole thread you will find that Guest LittleOtt makes some sense. He was just trying to help out Mr. maven. You see, earlier in this thread Mr. Jimurray wondered about which OBR rule would support an MLB umpire in prohibiting a batter from leaving the box to get a new bat. Then Mr. maven, rules interpreter, guessed it would be the batter’s box rule but did not provide an actual rule cite. It was then that Guest LittleOtt was helpful in providing the actual rules with their numbers that Mr. maven had guessed about. This is all fine and dandy except for the fact that GuestLittleOtt used a 2010 edition of the Jaksa/Roder manual so the rule numbers used in that edition are, of course, the old numbers and those rules have been rewritten some as well. The current rule numbers are--5.04(b)(1) and (2) and its following Comment and 5.04(b)(4).
  16. 2019 rule 8-4 ART. 2 . . . Any runner is out when he: b. does not legally slide and causes illegal contact and/or illegally alters the actions of a fielder in the immediate act of making a play, or on a force play, does not slide in a direct line between the bases; or 1. A runner may slide in a direction away from the fielder to avoid making contact or altering the play of the fielder. 2. Runners are never required to slide, but if a runner elects to slide, the slide must be legal. (2-32-1, 2-32-2) Jumping, hurdling, and leaping are all legal attempts to avoid a fielder as long as the fielder is lying on the ground. Diving over a fielder is illegal. PENALTY: The runner is out. Interference is called and the ball is dead immediately. On a force-play slide with less than two outs, the runner is declared out, as well as the batter-runner. Runners shall return to the bases occupied at the time of the pitch. With two outs, the runner is declared out. The batter is credited with a fielder’s choice. 2-32 ART. 1 . . . A legal slide can be either feet first or head first. If a runner slides feet first, at least one leg and buttock shall be on the ground. If a runner slides, he must slide within reach of the base with either a hand or a foot. A runner may slide or run in a direction away from the fielder to avoid making contact or altering the play of the fielder (8-4-2b). 2-32 ART. 2 . . . A slide is illegal if: a. the runner uses a rolling, cross-body or pop-up slide into the fielder, or b. the runner’s raised leg is higher than the fielder’s knee when the fielder is in a standing position, or c. except at home plate, the runner goes beyond the base and then makes contact with or alters the play of the fielder. At home plate, it is permissible for the slider’s momentum to carry him through the plate in a straight line (baseline extended), or d. the runner slashes or kicks the fielder with either leg, or e. the runner tries to injure the fielder, or f. the runner, on a force play, does not slide on the ground and in a direct line between the two bases.
  17. Official Baseball Rules defines how an at-bat ends as follows-- 5.04(c) Completing Time at Bat A batter has legally completed his time at bat when he is put out or becomes a runner. Since the batter has not been put out or become a base runner he has not legally completed his at-bat. Put him back up to complete his at-bat.
  18. Well, Mr. The Man in Blue, I do have the ambition and I couldn’t find anything that supports your assertion about high school softball rules about HBP. So, I would like you to provide some supporting evidence to your contention that the pitched ball must hit the body and not the hair. Here’s some of what I found-- 2020 NFHS Softball rule 2 SECTION 64 TOUCHING Touching is contact with the ball, equipment or a person. There is no distinction between the act of touching and being touched. It applies to a pitched ball touching a batter, a batted ball touching the batter or any runner, catcher touching the bat, player touching a base, or ball touching a player or non-player. The term applies to contact with any part of the person or her clothing if the clothing is reasonably well fitted. 2020 NFHS Softball rule 8-1-2b and 8-1-2c A pitched ball that is entirely within the batter's box strikes the batter or her clothing. No attempt to avoid the pitch is required. However, the batter may not obviously try to get hit by the pitch. A pitched ball (not entirely in the batter's box) not swung at nor called a strike touches any part of the batter's person or clothing. It does not matter if the ball strikes the ground before hitting the batter. The batter's hands are not to be considered part of the bat. If no attempt is made to avoid being hit, the batter will not be awarded first base unless it is ball four. The most recent case book I have is the 2019 edition and in it there are four case plays under rule 8 (8.1.2D through G) and I found two case plays about HBP under rule 5 (5.1.1B and C). None of those six case plays mentions that hitting just the hair does not count as a HBP.
  19. Well, Mr. johnnyg08, I also have the 2021 Minor League Baseball Umpire Manual and I am looking at the exact page I cited. The citation I gave is absolutely correct--I don't know why there would be any discrepancy between my copy and yours. Section 5.12 talks about OBR rule 5.06(a)(1) if that helps at all. My copy has 183 pages counting blank end pages and it shows a copyright date of 2021.
  20. From the 2021 Minor League Baseball Umpire Manual (section 5.12, p. 55): A runner does not acquire the right to an unoccupied base on an attempt to retire the runner until he touches it before he is put out. This is true regardless of whether the umpire’s act of not making a call signifies to the defensive team that the runner failed to touch the base for purposes of an appeal play. Play 1: Batter-runner hits a ground ball and beats the play at first base but misses the bag as he passes it with both feet. Ruling 1: The proper mechanic is for the umpire to make no call on the play because the batter-runner has not yet touched first base. If the defense appeals by tagging the runner (or base) and appealing that the runner missed first base before the runner returns to first base, the batter-runner would be declared out… This text was new in the book for the 2018 season in Minor League Baseball. It further explained that the interpretation was added to clarify that on plays where the batter-runner overruns and misses first base and has both feet beyond the base before a play is made there, the umpire should make no “Safe” call (i.e., make no call on the play).
  21. Your question, Mr. ousafe, reminds me of a very famous barnstorming team called the House of David. They took on all comers from the Majors and Minors, the Negro Leagues, and any local semi-pro teams. What made them distinctive was that every member of the team had long-flowing hair and beards of Biblical proportions. They came from a place in Michigan called Benton Harbor and played from about 1915 till about 1955. I couldn’t find any anecdotes about their tonsorial splendor causing any problems with the rules though.
  22. From the 2017 Jaksa/Roder manual (chapter 2, p. 22): The ball becomes live again once (5.12)… (a) every umpire discontinues his signaling of time, and (b) the pitcher has the ball in-contact with the pitching rubber. The plate umpire recognizes time during warm-up pitches. When he is in position, preparing to rule on a pitch to a batter, he may point to the pitcher to emphasize his discontinuation of time, and this is called “putting the ball in play.” This point does not in itself create a live ball—nor is it required of the umpire—but is often useful, especially with runners on base. The Preface to the book tells us that “items in italics are innovations unique or original to the Jaksa/Roder manual…In other cases they are interpretations of plays or rules that have not yet been specifically addressed by the Major or Minor Leagues…Bear in mind that the process for making new rules interpretations in the Major and Minor Leagues can be very involved; oftentimes many opinions must be considered. Be that as it may, the words and interpretations herein printed in italics are not to be considered those officially used on the fields of professional baseball.”
  23. I would agree that the definition of the term person is indeed relevant here. But I would also say that it is incomplete here. I think you also need to add the definition of touch-- 2021 OBR Definitions TOUCH. To touch a player or umpire is to touch any part of his body, or any uniform or equipment worn by him (but not any jewelry (e.g., necklaces, bracelets, etc.) worn by a player). (Touch) Comment: Equipment shall be considered worn by a player or umpire if it is in contact with its intended place on his person. Upon first glance your question would seem to be a bit facetious but it does have some serious ramifications when it comes to such things as dangling laces and jewelry. For example, the 2021 MiLBUM tells us… Hanging laces attached to a defensive player’s glove shall count when determining whether or not a ball was touched over fair territory and whether or not a catcher interfered with a batter’s attempt to strike at a pitched ball. As stated in the definition of a Tag, contact with hanging laces alone does not constitute a tag.
  24. 2019 NFHS Case Book play 2.28.3 Situation A: R3 and R1 with no outs. F1 contacts the pitcher’s plate and assumes the set position stance. As he begins his stretch, R1 advances toward second base attempting to steal. F1 realizes R1 is stealing but he does not throw to second, fearing that R3 will break for home and score. F1 completes his stretch, coming to a pause with the ball in both hands in front of his body. R1 reaches second and rounds it, after which F1 delivers the ball to B3, who fouls a pitch into the stands. RULING: R1 is allowed to remain on second because he was there prior to the time of the pitch. The definition of “time of the pitch” determines the base to which R1 is entitled. For all three codes, the time of pitch for the set position “occurs the instant the pitcher, after coming to a complete and discernible stop, starts any movement of his arms or legs that commits him to pitch.” (FED rule 2-28-3)
  25. To our guest, John Holland, according to the 2016 BRD (section 166, p. 126), at least one of the pro umpire schools frowns upon the usage of the do-not-pitch signal. OBR Official Interpretation: Wendelstedt: [The Wendelstedt school teaches that] the “Do not pitch” signal is not an appropriate mechanic. If the pitcher delivers a pitch when the batter is not appropriately ready, call an illegal pitch. (email to Childress, 7/13/12) And the 2021 Minor League Baseball Umpire Manual (section 9.4, p. 152) seems to agree— “Before the first pitch of an inning or following any dead situation, the plate umpire should be sure that the pitcher does not deliver the pitch before the batter is ready. It is acceptable for the umpire to put up his right hand up in front of his body at least head height to prevent the pitcher from delivering a pitch before the batter is set. This signal should only be used to indicate that the ball is still dead following the calling of time and never used to initiate the call of time. The plate umpire should always raise both hands above his head when initiating the call of time.” So, technically, when an MLB umpire signals do not pitch it is supposed to be a continuation of the dead ball situation and not an immediate dead ball.
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