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Catcher using Fielder's Glove


Guest Steve
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Guest Steve

FED Rules with a couple league rules which supersede FED rules.

Had a pair of 5th Grade rec ball games I filled in to help a friend out. Catcher comes to the plate with a fielder's glove on. I didn't think anything of it other than at this age they should be learning how to catch with a mitt. After the half inning partner comes in and says the next inning the kid has to lose the glove for a mitt. I'm not looking for bear and say the only two rules I know regarding gloves/mitts are the white/gray on the pitcher's glove and only the F3 can use a first baseman's glove.  He precedes to let the head coach know his catcher is not legally equipment and has to lose the glove. The only FED rules I could find concerning gloves or mitts was 

1-3-6   Gloves/mitts made of leather shall be worn by all fielders and not be altered to create an adhesive, sticky, and/or tacky surface. The glove/mitt worn by the catcher may be any size. The glove/mitt worn by the pitcher that includes the colors white and/or gray shall be removed from the game upon discovery by either team and/or umpire. The glove/mitt worn by all fielders except the catcher shall conform to the following maximum specifications (found in Diagram 4):

Height (measured from the bottom edge or heel straight up across the center of the palm to a line even with the highest point of the glove/mitt): 14 inches

Width of palm (measured from the bottom edge of the webbing farthest from the thumb in a horizontal line to the outside of the little finger edge of the glove/mitt): 8 inches

Webbing (measured across the top end or along any line parallel to the top): 5-3/4 inches

 

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Allowed in FED.  Here's a relevant case play (although the specific reference might be different):

 

1.3.6 SITUATION C: F9 catches a fly ball with a first baseman's mitt. While leaving the playing field after
the third out, the coach of Team B detects this. RULING: There is not a distinction between a glove or
mitt. Therefore, the catch is legal. Gloves/mitts that meet the maximum specifications are legal.

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What is the true purpose of the catcher mitt? To protect the catchers hand, since typically the pitcher is throwing harder than the position fielders and the catcher is receiving many, many more throws per game than the other players.

So in your scenario... can a 5th grader throw hard enough to hurt a catchers hand? Maybe, after repeated throws... by rule in FED he does not need the mitt, but it is a poor coach in my opinion who is not teaching his players to learn to catch with the proper position equipment. Other rule sets do address this and require the catcher to use the proper mitt.

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The current Official Baseball Rules still use the word may when discussing the use of gloves and mitts.

2019 OBR

3.06 Fielding Gloves

Each fielder, other than the catcher, may use or wear a leather glove…

3.04 Catcher’s Mitt

The catcher may wear a leather mitt not more than thirty-eight inches in circumference, nor more than fifteen and one-half inches from top to bottom…

3.05 First Baseman’s Glove

The first baseman may wear a leather glove or mitt not more than thirteen inches long from top to bottom and not more than eight inches wide across the palm, measured from the base of the thumb crotch to the outer edge of the mitt…

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3 hours ago, Guest Steve said:

Had a pair of 5th Grade rec ball games

Context.

Context context context.

Your partner is being an OOO. He should take joy that there are enough 5th graders out there to play a game.

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11 hours ago, Guest Steve said:

FED Rules with a couple league rules which supersede FED rules.

Had a pair of 5th Grade rec ball games I filled in to help a friend out. Catcher comes to the plate with a fielder's glove on. I didn't think anything of it other than at this age they should be learning how to catch with a mitt. After the half inning partner comes in and says the next inning the kid has to lose the glove for a mitt. I'm not looking for bear and say the only two rules I know regarding gloves/mitts are the white/gray on the pitcher's glove and only the F3 can use a first baseman's glove.  He precedes to let the head coach know his catcher is not legally equipment and has to lose the glove. The only FED rules I could find concerning gloves or mitts was 

1-3-6   Gloves/mitts made of leather shall be worn by all fielders and not be altered to create an adhesive, sticky, and/or tacky surface. The glove/mitt worn by the catcher may be any size. The glove/mitt worn by the pitcher that includes the colors white and/or gray shall be removed from the game upon discovery by either team and/or umpire. The glove/mitt worn by all fielders except the catcher shall conform to the following maximum specifications (found in Diagram 4):

Height (measured from the bottom edge or heel straight up across the center of the palm to a line even with the highest point of the glove/mitt): 14 inches

Width of palm (measured from the bottom edge of the webbing farthest from the thumb in a horizontal line to the outside of the little finger edge of the glove/mitt): 8 inches

Webbing (measured across the top end or along any line parallel to the top): 5-3/4 inches

 

Help me here.  You stated that F3 is the only one allowed to use a first baseman’s glove and then reference the NFHS rules which do not state the same. Given the way the rule reads, F5 could use a first baseman’s glove if he chose to.  Not sure there would be many making said choice but the way I am reading this rule, it would not be in violation of the NFHS rule.  Is there a case scenario that supports only F3 can use the glove.  If I am missing this, please help me see my error. 

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Yes, Mr. Phu Bai, it was in 1960 when Paul Richards invented the oversize catcher’s mitt to help the Orioles catchers, Gus Triandos and Joe Ginsberg. The funny thing though is that even with the oversize mitt they managed to set league records for passed balls. The rules committee later voted to limit the size of a catcher’s mitt. The following text is from an article written by David Johnson in 1986 for the Chicago Tribune.

In the spring of 1960, Orioles manager Paul Richards did something about it. Richards, who died last month at age 77, invented an oversized mitt with Wilhelm in mind.

''We called it the elephant glove,'' said Ginsberg, ''because it was shaped like an elephant`s ear. Paul Richards was very astute, very thorough. He took advantage of the fact that, at that time, there was nothing in the rule book restricting the size of a catcher`s glove.'' Richards, who had been a catcher, asked Wilson Sporting Goods to design the glove.

''He asked us to make a glove that would be as large as any catcher could handle,'' said Gordon Hollywood of Wilson. ''He said, `Make the web as wide as can be,` yet flexible enough that the catcher could make quick pickups.''

Wilson made three models and told Richards to choose one. Each glove cost more than $300 to make, Hollywood said, which was about $250 more than the best big-league glove at the time.

''There was no die-cut pattern for a glove of that type. Everything had to be hand-cut. We had to pull people off the assembly line to do the job. To cut a glove like that today would cost you more than $1,000.''

Nobody has to pay that kind of money because the elephant glove is extinct. It was outlawed prior to the 1961 season after opposing teams complained.

They revised the rule to say that a catcher`s mitt could be no more than 38 inches in circumference or 15 inches from top to bottom. Richards` glove was 42 inches around and 18 inches long.

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9 hours ago, Phu Bai said:

 As an aside, I seem to remember Paul Richards creating a very large catchers mitt for a catcher catching Hoyt Wilhelm's knuckle balls. Anyone recall??

 

I remember seeing the mitt Carlos Ruiz used to catch R.A. Dickey in the all star game a few years ago.

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Guest David Ohsie
On 5/6/2019 at 11:52 AM, Mudisfun said:

What is the true purpose of the catcher mitt? To protect the catchers hand, since typically the pitcher is throwing harder than the position fielders and the catcher is receiving many, many more throws per game than the other players.

So in your scenario... can a 5th grader throw hard enough to hurt a catchers hand? Maybe, after repeated throws... by rule in FED he does not need the mitt, but it is a poor coach in my opinion who is not teaching his players to learn to catch with the proper position equipment. Other rule sets do address this and require the catcher to use the proper mitt.

There's also the bat.  I think that is part of the reason for the LL rule.

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5th Grade BB..........not going there..........who knows what catching skills you will see at that level........Id rather have a catcher attempting to catch a ball with a glove he can control than a stiff catchers mitt he cant............. 

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